# drad dog, you owe me an apology. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 16, 2017, 7:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998 "2017-02-16T19:06:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/21 "2017-02-17T03:38:13Z")
Yeah, dead dog. You aren’t helping. Even if OP was a Trump supporter, how would your bizarre overreaction to a single sentence have helped? You would easily be dismissed. You’ve given way too much plausible deniability. By the end, you were flat out trolling, and I’m surprised the new moderation let you get away with it. If this is the way you are fighting Trump outside the board, please reconsider. You want to point out that a certain guy is talked about by conservatives, then do that. And you’re entirely emotional reactions to Bricker aren’t helpful, either. Use facts when dealing with someone like that. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/22 "2017-02-17T03:54:42Z")
\*your ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/23 "2017-02-17T04:04:08Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Yeah, dead dog. You aren’t helping. Even if OP was a Trump supporter, how would your bizarre overreaction to a single sentence have helped? You would easily be dismissed. You’ve given way too much plausible deniability. > > By the end, you were flat out trolling, and I’m surprised the new moderation let you get away with it. > > If this is the way you are fighting Trump outside the board, please reconsider. You want to point out that a certain guy is talked about by conservatives, then do that. > > And you’re entirely emotional reactions to Bricker aren’t helpful, either. Use facts when dealing with someone like that. To my view you’re taking yourself a little too seriously here. “By the end…” By the end…God created forums? I made a snarky post of disbelief. Period. I didn’t engage over time. I haven’t even seen the thread today. ?A reasonable person would assume that: Someone has a working knowledge of Alinsky’s methods; and makes a lone comment about it, with no other point to make; but that the person is not referring to public mentions and use of his name over the last 8 years; and in fact is not aware of it at all, and _ **shocked** _ by this development? How does that happen? You’re going to need some thicker skin for the times ahead. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/24 "2017-02-17T04:09:08Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > Talking about Alinsky was a right wing shibboleth. Oh, a Saul Alinksy style radical? That sounds terrible! Well, give a Saul Alinsky style radical a 1920’s style death ray and you just know there’s going to be trouble. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/25 "2017-02-17T10:44:17Z")
I’m not the least bit invested in this pitting (though it has the value of having introduced me to **WordMan’s** informative post about Prince, and I’m grateful for that), but I will note that whenever anyone demands an apology, I tend to think, without knowing anything else about the situation, “Now there’s a whiny little bitch.” I don’t think I’ve ever told anyone they “owe” me an apology. It seems just a tad self-important and insecure. (And anyway, who wants a forced apology? There’s no guarantee of its sincerity.) Does Trump demand apologies from people? I think he has been known to do this. Anyway if I’m wrong in my characterization of apology-demanding, then I guess I owe the OP one. Sorry **August West.** 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/26 "2017-02-17T10:50:09Z")
Sorry, missed edit window. This seems apt: > **[Donald Trump demands an apology from you](https://www.motherjones.com/kevin-drum/2017/01/donald-trump-demands-apology-you/)** > > Just out of curiosity, I did a quick check to see how many people/organizations Donald Trump has demanded an apology from since he began his presidential campaign. The answer is 21: Intelligence chiefs Cast and producers of Hamilton Mika Brzezinski... ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/27 "2017-02-17T15:18:55Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > You need to check your definition of “ironic.” I don’t think it means what you think it does, and I never said you were being that. > > This is a google for “republicans citing Saul Alinsky”: > > [why do republicans cite saul alinsky - Google Search](https://www.google.com/search?q=why+do+republicans+cite+saul+alinsky&oq=why+do+republicans+cite+saul+alinsky&aqs=chrome..69i57.10207j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8#q=republicans+citing+saul+alinsky) > > I grew up in 2 very left wing households. I never heard of the guy until president Black Person was elected and it became a part of the derangement, and delegitimization thereof. I think I can recall half a dozen mentions on fox news (and virtually zero elsewhere.) Never heard a discussion of him anywhere else. That’s my context. > > So why is he the thing you think of when someone is talking about Garry Kasparov? > > BTW: I like Teddy too. My Great Uncle was a Maine Guide, knew teddy, and was the one who called the 1912 progressive party convention to order with his expert bullmoose call. Have a good day. I also grew up in a left wing household and _Rules for Radicals_ was on our living room bookshelf. My father talked constantly about the “haves” and “have-nots”. The next time I heard about it was from a bearded and pony-tailed political science professor who opened the first day of class by asking us “What would it take to get you to start throwing rocks in the streets?” _Rules for Radicals_ was required reading for his course. So why on God’s fucking green earth would this book be the first thing I think of when I read a thread where Garry Kasparov presents his “rules for rattling Trump”? Gosh, I don’t know, could it **possibly** be that every one of Garry’s rules can also be found in chapter one of Alinsky? Holy everloving shit! I bet that was it!. I posted one sentence that compared Kasparov’s rules with Alinsky’s rules. And instantly you turned into some kind of aggravating drama queen, frothing at the mouth to slap down the right wing fascist that triggered you, except that you were wrong. And when it was pointed out that you were reading waaaaaaaay too much into a fairly fucking simple sentence, instead of accepting it, you doubled down on your assholery. As far as my being unaware that the right-wing has found Alinsky and incorporated him into their propaganda, I can only plead ignorance. I don’t watch or listen to Rush, Hannity, O’Reilly or whoever the current talking head is on Fox News. I am completely uninformed of whatever imbecility is spewing from their rancid gobs. I actively avoid them. ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/28 "2017-02-17T15:20:36Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > I’m not the least bit invested in this pitting (though it has the value of having introduced me to **WordMan’s** informative post about Prince, and I’m grateful for that), but I will note that whenever anyone demands an apology, I tend to think, without knowing anything else about the situation, “Now there’s a whiny little bitch.” > > I don’t think I’ve ever told anyone they “owe” me an apology. It seems just a tad self-important and insecure. (And anyway, who wants a forced apology? There’s no guarantee of its sincerity.) > > Does Trump demand apologies from people? I think he has been known to do this. > > Anyway if I’m wrong in my characterization of apology-demanding, then I guess I owe the OP one. Sorry **August West.** 🙂 Oh for fuck’s sake. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/29 "2017-02-17T18:14:20Z")
> [@August\_West](#): > > Oh for fuck’s sake. I have never heard of Saul Alinsky except as a right wing dog whistle. Ever. Not once. In fact, why not, let’s try it, here is a google for "Alinsky right wing dog whistle: [https://www.google.com/search?q=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&oq=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&aqs=chrome..69i57.11423j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8](https://www.google.com/search?q=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&oq=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&aqs=chrome..69i57.11423j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) That’s even juicier than my first one. I find it really striking that you could be so oblivious of what is going on in media over the last 8 years, (Not to mention at the same time having been a poster here). Because that media has also been _ **covering** _ fox and the dog whistle effect. It has made it’s way into the real world too. Where have you been man? If you’re of the left then 1) We need you to be more aware, and 2) You seem very easily triggered. This is what has enabled some trolls and idiots to say “That’s why donald won!” I don’t want that. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/30 "2017-02-17T18:20:44Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I have never heard of Saul Alinsky except as a right wing dog whistle. Ever. Not once. > > In fact, why not, let’s try it, here is a google for "Saul Alinsky right wing dog whistle: > > [Alinsky right wing dog whistle - Google Search](https://www.google.com/search?q=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&oq=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&aqs=chrome..69i57.11423j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) > > That’s even juicier than my first one. > > I find it really striking that you could be so oblivious of what is going on in media over the last 8 years, (Not to mention at the same time having been a poster here). Because that media has also been _ **covering** _ fox and the dog whistle effect. It has made it’s way into the real world too. Where have you been man? If you’re of the left then 1) We need you to be more aware, and 2) You seem very easily triggered. > > This is what has enabled some trolls and idiots to say “That’s why donald won!” I don’t want that. You’ve never heard of Saul Alinksy except as a right wing boogeyman, and you’re calling _him_ oblivious? Jesus Christ, you’re an asshole. ---
**Author:** ![drad\_dog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/aeb1de/32.png) [@drad\_dog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drad_dog)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/31 "2017-02-17T18:32:57Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > You’ve never heard of Saul Alinksy except as a right wing boogeyman, and you’re calling _him_ oblivious? > > Jesus Christ, you’re an asshole. Thanks. You mean you’re going to “false-equivalence” my post out of existence in your mind? Hey look it’s still there. Well this has been an education. Here is what’s good about getting pitted: It’s all about me. If someone even brings up something that isn’t me I can yell “Off Topic!” and put an end to that. I don’t even get that with my mother. Here’s what’s bad about it: It TICKLES! Stop that you guys. Here’s what’s neutral: Getting called an asshole by assholes, having losers stop in to squirt gasoline and jump up and down to see conflict among anonymous posters, because they have nothing better to feel anything about. Whiny little hall monitor types and Junior G-men citing year old threads, because, maybe they got their toesies hurt last year. It’s not very attractive. Is it? ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/32 "2017-02-17T18:58:53Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > I have never heard of Saul Alinsky except as a right wing dog whistle. Ever. Not once. > > In fact, why not, let’s try it, here is a google for "Alinsky right wing dog whistle: > > [Alinsky right wing dog whistle - Google Search](https://www.google.com/search?q=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&oq=Alinsky+right+wing+dog+whistle&aqs=chrome..69i57.11423j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8) > > That’s even juicier than my first one. > > I find it really striking that you could be so oblivious of what is going on in media over the last 8 years, (Not to mention at the same time having been a poster here). Because that media has also been _ **covering** _ fox and the dog whistle effect. It has made it’s way into the real world too. Where have you been man? If you’re of the left then 1) We need you to be more aware, and 2) You seem very easily triggered. > > This is what has enabled some trolls and idiots to say “That’s why donald won!” I don’t want that. I see. Because _you personally_ have never heard of Alinsky, except as a “dog-whistle” from the right wing, anytime you see his name in print you must immediately begin insulting and denouncing the person that wrote it. And **I’m** “easily triggered”. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/33 "2017-02-17T20:35:56Z")
> [@drad\_dog](#): > > Here is what’s good about getting pitted: It’s all about me. If someone even brings up something that isn’t me I can yell “Off Topic!” and put an end to that. I don’t even get that with my mother. I suspect you’re still living with her, so the change of pace must be nice. Dude, you’re a jerk. You don’t contribute enough to discussions to make your jerk persona tolerable. And you flop into threads like a big, dumb puppy, making them about you because you poke people and get them to poke back. Be less of a twit. You’d be amazed at how civilly you’ll be treated. ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/34 "2017-02-17T21:41:27Z")
OK, August, your story sounds plausible. Yeah, some old hippies used to read that book. But seriously, the only time I’ve ever seen Saul Alinksy referenced since the 70s was by right-wingers trying to denounce someone as a Saul Alinsky radical. > **[Who is Saul Alinsky, and why is Newt Gingrich so obsessed with him?](https://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/The-Vote/2012/0128/Who-is-Saul-Alinsky-and-why-is-Newt-Gingrich-so-obsessed-with-him)** > > Newt Gingrich keeps likening President Obama to radical community organizer Saul Alinsky. But Gingrich seems to have adopted Alinsky's tactics himself, as has the tea party. Mainstream Republicans aren't happy. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2017, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998/35 "2017-02-17T22:11:57Z")
> [@Lemur866](#): > > OK, August, your story sounds plausible. Yeah, some old hippies used to read that book. But seriously, the only time I’ve ever seen Saul Alinksy referenced since the 70s was by right-wingers trying to denounce someone as a Saul Alinsky radical. > > [Who is Saul Alinsky, and why is Newt Gingrich so obsessed with him? - CSMonitor.com](http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Politics/The-Vote/2012/0128/Who-is-Saul-Alinsky-and-why-is-Newt-Gingrich-so-obsessed-with-him) I was confused because, well, the statement itself was not critical, simply an observation. I really don’t see how anything untoward can be read into it. But also because I am familiar with him in the context of left-wing anarchism, in the 90s from the same people who would read books like “The Anarchist’s Cookbook” and “Poor Man’s James Bond.” I wouldn’t assume one way or another what someone make a statement like **August West** ’s is politically. These sorts of books speak to radical ideologies of both sides. (I also know him because I live in Chicago, and was born in Back of The Yards, which is where he started his community organizing. I pass the Back of The Yards Neighborhood Council he founded almost every day. I can’t tell if it’s still active, though.) My guess, actually, was that August was a leftist. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drad-dog-you-owe-me-an-apology/779998.md?page=1)