# Drilling concrete **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Tags:** tools-electric-diy\ **Created:** [November 16, 2024, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312 "2024-11-16T02:27:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/21 "2024-11-16T12:43:19Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > Zip ties have no place in supporting shelves. When a shelf is loaded, there is a lot of weight pushing downwards. The shelf post translates a lot of that into a force pulling _away_ from the wall. It’s not all vertical. The ties are to prevent the shelf from falling forward. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 12:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/22 "2024-11-16T12:46:52Z")
And I predict they will fail utterly at doing that. Not nearly strong enough. IMO YMMV etc., But unless you already have contrary experience I’d be _very_ leery of that idea. A problem with structural failures in general is they give almost no warning. Everything can be fine for days, weeks, or months. Then one tie fails, the rest are suddenly overloaded by (1/however many ties) percent, another fails, and gravity works all but instantly to drop the whole shelving unit and the contents onto whatever/whoever is within 6 feet of the shelves. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/23 "2024-11-16T12:50:32Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > The ties are to prevent the shelf from falling forward. Enough very heavy zip ties might do that but it’s not a great way to do this. Please tell us more about these shelves. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/24 "2024-11-16T12:51:44Z")
Ask me how many times I used old zip ties … which then failed (snapped – brittle due to age) before I finally threw them away 😉 ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/25 "2024-11-16T14:06:28Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > I once had to drill a 2 inch hole through 4 inches of concrete to run some electrical conduit. Rented everything. Wow, that hammer drill was _heavy_, but the 2 inch bit went through the concrete with no problem. My father-in-law put a dock in at his cottage. We had to anchor eyebolts into 2 billion year old Canadian Shield granite. We rented a rotary hammer and it took 10 minutes to drill 2”x8” holes in the rock. I think it took longer to run the 200’ extension cord down to the lake and roll it back up. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/26 "2024-11-16T14:10:41Z")
I’m surprised that [Black and Decker](https://www.amazon.com/s?k=hammer+drill+for+concrete&crid=EBNE7UD46MUX&sprefix=hammer+drill%2Caps%2C256&ref=nb_sb_ss_ts-doa-p_2_12) had some bad reviews, although it is the least expensive. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/27 "2024-11-16T14:19:29Z")
If possible, I’d rather rent a really good one than own a really bad one. ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/28 "2024-11-16T14:32:10Z")
Add me to the No Zip-Tie team. My garage shelves are anchored to the walls with metal brackets similar to this: [![Imgur](https://i.imgur.com/b0vBSbD.jpeg "imgur.com") ](https://imgur.com/b0vBSbD) You could also use a small-gauge metal chain. mmm ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/29 "2024-11-16T14:35:20Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > I’m surprised that [Black and Decker](https://www.amazon.com/s?k=hammer+drill+for+concrete&crid=EBNE7UD46MUX&sprefix=hammer+drill%2Caps%2C256&ref=nb_sb_ss_ts-doa-p_2_12) had some bad reviews, although it is the least expensive. B+D of today is not a great brand. Stanley Black and Decker, the corporate owner, has a bunch of different brands including Porter Cable and DeWalt. > **[Black+Decker](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black%2BDecker)** > > Black+Decker is an American manufacturer of power tools, accessories, hardware, home improvement products, home appliances, and fastening systems, headquartered in Towson, Maryland, north of Baltimore, where the company was originally established in 1910. In March 2010, Black & Decker merged with Stanley Works to become Stanley Black & Decker. It remains a wholly owned subsidiary of that company. > As of 2017, Stanley Black & Decker's brand portfolio included: ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/30 "2024-11-16T16:07:34Z")
Here’s a different question that just occurred to me. Is the OP talking about free-standing floor-mounted shelving that he’s just installing an anti-tip strap on? Or are we talking about shelving that is mounted to the wall and hangs from the wall? All along I’ve been thinking the latter, but @Mean_Mr.Mustard’s post somehow triggered the thought that there’s another possibility. I still would not use a zip-tie for an anti-tip strap. But I now see how my earlier advice would seem to make no sense in the context of floor-mounted free-standing shelving set _alongside_ a wall, not hanging _from_ a wall. ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/31 "2024-11-16T16:17:58Z")
Anecdote time: I only have a small subset of my tools up in Durango. I needed to put a 5/8" anchor in a sidewalk to mount a post base. I went to H.D. and bought a nice impact bit, and tried to drill the hole with my cordless drill. After a half an hour, I’d drained the battery, and made a hole maybe 3/4" deep. I went on ebay, bought a used impact drill (the same one I have at our main house, and the same battery pack), and went and did other things for the week it took to get delivered. When it came, I took it outside, and finished the 4" deep hole in about 5 minutes. ---
**Author:** ![crazyjoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f14d63/32.png) [@crazyjoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crazyjoe)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/32 "2024-11-16T17:15:33Z")
I started to feel the same sentiment. I will chime in here to say that zip ties degrade over time, especially exposed to weather and humidity. They become brittle and less likely to perform their task. They make devices expressly for this purpose, no-tip straps, that are just as easy to use as zip ties ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/33 "2024-11-16T18:29:24Z")
If it prefab metal or wire shelving they have a gazillion holes and openings to add stuff. A good sturdy S hook will secure the shelving to an eyelet put in the drilled holes. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/34 "2024-11-16T19:31:14Z")
That was my first thought. What are those particular brackets called? ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/35 "2024-11-16T19:34:13Z")
They look like conduit supports. But- I do t understand why you need them. Every shelf bracket I’ve ever seen has holes to put a wood screw right into the wall. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/36 "2024-11-16T19:47:06Z")
Yep. Conduit strap. Plumbers strapping is more forgiving. But you don’t need that. Really. I guess if you were shelving bowling balls or heavy weights , maybe. ---
**Author:** ![Tride](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tride/32/13907_2.png) [@Tride](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tride)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/37 "2024-11-16T19:54:12Z")
What you should really rent is a rotary hammer–much better. With the hammer drill you can drill 5/32" holes and use Tapcon screws. Easy. I have 2 roto-hammers and a hammer drill. If you’re in Bozeman you’re welcome to borrow them… ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/38 "2024-11-16T20:07:47Z")
Don’t know what kind of shelves but my usual approach to securing things on a concrete wall is to use anchors to connect a piece of pressure treated lumber to it, then use screws, nails, etc. to attach anything to the lumber. I’ll being doing something maybe only slightly similar to the OP. I have heavy gondola shelving that sticks out into my shop taking a lot of space so I’ve got extra posts and I’ll attach vertical 2x6s to the wall to attach the posts so the shelves will become wall mounted instead of free standing. These shelves hold a lot of heavy tools and have to be well secured to the wall when they’re no longer counterbalanced on two sides of the post. The OP may just want to attach a 2x4 or larger horizontally at the right height to secure his shelves. If wood is used on concrete it should be pressure treated. Most wood decays rapidly in contact with concrete. ---
**Author:** ![Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mean_mr.mustard/32/3865_2.png) [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/39 "2024-11-16T21:13:26Z")
> [@Beckdawrek](#): > > Yep. Conduit strap. > > Plumbers strapping is more forgiving. > > But you don’t need that. Really. > I guess if you were shelving bowling balls or heavy weights , maybe. No bowling balls, but my concern was little ones climbing a shelf like a ladder and…well you can imagine how badly that could turn out. Cite: As a kid there was nothing I wouldn’t try to climb. mmm ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2024, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312/40 "2024-11-16T22:10:00Z")
True. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/drilling-concrete/1010312.md?page=3)