# Driving accidents **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 1, 2008, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488 "2008-04-01T05:47:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![copperwindow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@copperwindow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/copperwindow)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 5:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/1 "2008-04-01T05:47:07Z")
If I’m a pedestrian and I run into oncoming traffic and get hit by a car, who is at fault? ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/2 "2008-04-01T05:59:07Z")
you are ---
**Author:** ![danceswithcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9e8a1a/32.png) [@danceswithcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/danceswithcats)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 7:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/3 "2008-04-01T07:53:48Z")
Were you crossing at a crosswalk? Were you crossing against pedestrian control signals? Did this hypothetical action take place in a state where pedestrians have the right of way in various situations, or not? Were you impaired by alcohol or pharmaceutical products? Are you sighted, and if not, where was your guide animal? ---
**Author:** ![copperwindow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4af34b/32.png) [@copperwindow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/copperwindow)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/4 "2008-04-01T07:57:51Z")
[QUOTE=danceswithcats] Were you crossing at a crosswalk? Were you crossing against pedestrian control signals? Did this hypothetical action take place in a state where pedestrians have the right of way in various situations, or not? Were you impaired by alcohol or pharmaceutical products? Are you sighted, and if not, where was your guide animal? [/QUOTE] No, I’m an asshole who wanted to cause an accident. The reason I ask is because two people told me that when a car and pedestrian get into an accident, the car is to blame regardless of the circumstances. Is this true in any state? ---
**Author:** ![atomicbadgerrace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e7dd6/32.png) [@atomicbadgerrace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/atomicbadgerrace)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 8:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/5 "2008-04-01T08:06:48Z")
[QUOTE=copperwindow] No, I’m an asshole who wanted to cause an accident. The reason I ask is because two people told me that when a car and pedestrian get into an accident, the car is to blame regardless of the circumstances. Is this true in any state? [/QUOTE] IANAL, but I can’t imagine any traffic court hearing assigning blame to the driver after hearing you say “your honor, I’m an asshole who wanted to cause an accident.” Here’s a [NY State](http://www.nysgtsc.state.ny.us/peds-vt.htm) website with some information on traffic law and pedestrian safety. Someone with much more legal experience will be along shortly. ---
**Author:** ![Critical1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@Critical1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Critical1)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 8:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/6 "2008-04-01T08:15:40Z")
in the second case I was told by a state patrol officer that when a pedestrian gets hit on the freeway (yeah the friggin freeway) the first assumption is suicide or drugs/mental issues. the driver is most definitely not always at fault and I would be pretty surprised to find this to be the case in any state. contrary to popular opinion the pedestrian does not always have the right of way. generally crosswalks and sidewalks only (in Washington all intersections are defaulted to crosswalk status even if there isnt one) I would guess parking lots as well. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/7 "2008-04-01T08:34:01Z")
Even if the pedestrian _does_ have right of way, that doesn’t trump physics - if a vehicle that is being driven safely, legally and responsibly, and you suddenly leap out in front of it, giving the driver no time to react or avoid you, then _you_ caused the accident. It might not always appear so clearcut to other parties, after the event, but assuming there’s a good standard of evidence, I can’t see how the driver could be held responsible in any sane, civilised legal system. I’ve heard people say similar things about rear-end collisions - the notion that _if you crash into the back of another car, it’s always your fault_. While it’s often true in those cases that fault does lie with the driver behind, there must be situations where it doesn’t apply - for example, if you collide with the rear end of a vehicle that suddenly pulls out of a side road, right in front of you. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 8:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/8 "2008-04-01T08:50:27Z")
[QUOTE=copperwindow] No, I’m an asshole who wanted to cause an accident. The reason I ask is because two people told me that when a car and pedestrian get into an accident, the car is to blame regardless of the circumstances. Is this true in any state? [/QUOTE] It’s not even true here in South Korea. Like many other things people like to toss around as fact, this one’s a myth. I’ve lived in California a long time and have often heard “the pedestrian automatically has the right of way.” That bit of folk wisdom is false. ---
**Author:** ![Martiju](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e8c25b/32.png) [@Martiju](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martiju)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/9 "2008-04-01T11:41:36Z")
[QUOTE=Monty] It’s not even true here in South Korea. Like many other things people like to toss around as fact, this one’s a myth. I’ve lived in California a long time and have often heard “the pedestrian automatically has the right of way.” That bit of folk wisdom is false. [/QUOTE] And unwise. Whenever people say that I always think how great it will be to have that sense of righteousness when you’re wrapped around the rear axle…! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 12:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/10 "2008-04-01T12:09:39Z")
[QUOTE=Mangetout] I’ve heard people say similar things about rear-end collisions - the notion that _if you crash into the back of another car, it’s always your fault_. While it’s often true in those cases that fault does lie with the driver behind, there must be situations where it doesn’t apply - for example, if you collide with the rear end of a vehicle that suddenly pulls out of a side road, right in front of you. [/QUOTE] When I rear-ended someone, it was because a car in the oncoming traffic left turn lane suddenly made a U-turn in front of the car in front of me, meaning that the car in front of me stopped virtually instantly, and I (many, many car lengths back) made a controlled skid (no ABS then) right into the back of him (no, there was no place else to go to avoid it entirely). I was worried about this precise piece of common wisdom, and the cop (a) didn’t give me a ticket; and (b) annoted that I had no fault on the report. I was never sued (or otherwise asked) for the victim’s deductible (our only liability in Michigan). My insurance rates didn’t go up. It was a sweet deal, except for the two other cars’ drivers and passengers. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/11 "2008-04-01T17:19:45Z")
The closest thing I can think of is the UK highway Code which states that drivers must always give way to pedestrians - which does not mean they must always wait for them, but that if there happens to be a pedestrian in the way, the driver must stop - which is rather obvious but I suppose some there is some legal possiblility in there. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/12 "2008-04-01T17:32:43Z")
[QUOTE=Monty] Like many other things people like to toss around as fact, this one’s a myth. I’ve lived in California a long time and have often heard “the pedestrian automatically has the right of way.” That bit of folk wisdom is false. [/QUOTE] In fact I’ve read of several cases in San Francisco where some dope stepped out in front of traffic, got hit, and where the driver was not charged. The driver stopped in these cases. Maybe the incorrect perception is from the true one that pedestrians in crosswalks do have the right of way. Now, if I hit an idiot bicycle rider running a stop sign, can I be charged? Or will I be awarded two ears and a spoke? ---
**Author:** ![tremorviolet](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@tremorviolet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tremorviolet)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/13 "2008-04-01T20:50:53Z")
Here are the relevant [Texas statutes](http://tlo2.tlc.state.tx.us/statutes/docs/TN/content/htm/tn.007.00.000552.00.htm#552.005.00) (boldings mine): > [@](#): > > § 552.005. CROSSING AT POINT OTHER THAN CROSSWALK. > (a) **A pedestrian shall yield the right-of-way to a vehicle** on the > highway if crossing a roadway at a place: > (1) other than in a marked crosswalk or in an unmarked > crosswalk at an intersection; or > (2) where a pedestrian tunnel or overhead pedestrian > crossing has been provided. > (b) Between adjacent intersections at which traffic control > signals are in operation, a pedestrian may cross only in a marked > crosswalk. > (c) A pedestrian may cross a roadway intersection > diagonally only if and in the manner authorized by a traffic control > device. And for crosswalks: > [@](#): > > § 552.003. PEDESTRIAN RIGHT-OF-WAY AT CROSSWALK. > (a) The operator of a vehicle shall yield the right-of-way to a > pedestrian crossing a roadway in a crosswalk if: > (1) no traffic control signal is in place or in > operation; and > (2) the pedestrian is: > (A) on the half of the roadway in which the > vehicle is traveling; or > (B) approaching so closely from the opposite half > of the roadway as to be in danger. > **(b) Notwithstanding Subsection (a), a pedestrian may not > suddenly leave a curb or other place of safety and proceed into a > crosswalk in the path of a vehicle so close that it is impossible > for the vehicle operator to yield.** > (c) The operator of a vehicle approaching from the rear of a > vehicle that is stopped at a crosswalk to permit a pedestrian to > cross a roadway may not pass the stopped vehicle. So it explicitly says that _even on a crosswalk_ a pedestrian can’t suddenly walk into traffic. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/14 "2008-04-01T23:20:36Z")
[QUOTE=Voyager] In fact I’ve read of several cases in San Francisco where some dope stepped out in front of traffic, got hit, and where the driver was not charged. The driver stopped in these cases. Maybe the incorrect perception is from the true one that pedestrians in crosswalks do have the right of way. Now, if I hit an idiot bicycle rider running a stop sign, can I be charged? Or will I be awarded two ears and a spoke? [/QUOTE] You’d be just as likely to lose that one, I would assume, as if you t-boned a pickup truck that ran a stop sign. All vehicles on the road have to obey traffic laws, including bicycles. This is how a cop in College Station, TX (a _bicycle_ cop, even) explained it to me, and how I always understood it. This reminds me of another pet peeve I love to whine about: Bicyclists riding their bikes in the oncoming lane. I am running late for class, I am driving 45MPH on a busy road full of other speeding nigh-tardy students with a 40MPH limit. The last thing I need to do is have my dad’s car dinged up by some dingbat who feels like nailing the car at relative highway speeds and parking himself head first in my passenger seat. There’s a REASON you’re supposed to ride bikes in the direction that traffic is moving. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/15 "2008-04-01T23:26:32Z")
[QUOTE=Raguleader] You’d be just as likely to lose that one, I would assume, as if you t-boned a pickup truck that ran a stop sign. All vehicles on the road have to obey traffic laws, including bicycles. This is how a cop in College Station, TX (a _bicycle_ cop, even) explained it to me, and how I always understood it. This reminds me of another pet peeve I love to whine about: Bicyclists riding their bikes in the oncoming lane. I am running late for class, I am driving 45MPH on a busy road full of other speeding nigh-tardy students with a 40MPH limit. The last thing I need to do is have my dad’s car dinged up by some dingbat who feels like nailing the car at relative highway speeds and parking himself head first in my passenger seat. There’s a REASON you’re supposed to ride bikes in the direction that traffic is moving. [/QUOTE] I don’t ride bikes, and when I did I stopped. Just the other day I was turning right from a big street onto mine, and someone on a bike blew through a stop sign right in front of me, on the service road, and looked annoyed that I didn’t stop on the main street (which is dangerous) so that he could break the law. He was lucky that I didn’t turn down the service road after him to give him a lesson in bicycle safety. There are many safe bicycle riders in the Bay Area, but there are many who are not - and we’ve had Pit threads about this already, so that will be all I say about that here. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/16 "2008-04-01T23:52:59Z")
[QUOTE=casdave] The closest thing I can think of is the UK highway Code which states that drivers must always give way to pedestrians - which does not mean they must always wait for them, but that if there happens to be a pedestrian in the way, the driver must stop - which is rather obvious but I suppose some there is some legal possiblility in there. [/QUOTE] The Australian version of this is that the driver has a duty to “attempt to avoid any collision”. This trumps the fact that you may legally have right of way. So if a micro scooter runs a red, you must try to stop your semi truck regardless of who is “in the right”. ---
**Author:** ![Raguleader](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/258eb7/32.png) [@Raguleader](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raguleader)\ **Post date:** [April 1, 2008, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/driving-accidents/443488/17 "2008-04-01T23:56:13Z")
[QUOTE=Voyager] I don’t ride bikes, and when I did I stopped. Just the other day I was turning right from a big street onto mine, and someone on a bike blew through a stop sign right in front of me, on the service road, and looked annoyed that I didn’t stop on the main street (which is dangerous) so that he could break the law. He was lucky that I didn’t turn down the service road after him to give him a lesson in bicycle safety. There are many safe bicycle riders in the Bay Area, but there are many who are not - and we’ve had Pit threads about this already, so that will be all I say about that here. [/QUOTE] Yeah, I used to run intersections if it looked like I had room/time, until I nearly got pancaked by a 72 passenger bus going across campus one time. (As an example of my inability to properly prioritize my concerns, my dad reminds me that I noticed the bus driver was a cute blonde girl before I noticed the bus)