# Dropping "the" in Front of Chef or Coach **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [May 4, 2022, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954 "2022-05-04T17:47:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2022, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/21 "2022-05-05T17:14:01Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > It may be more of a regional thing, Could be, except for chef and coach. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2022, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/22 "2022-05-05T19:30:02Z")
Of course. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2022, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/23 "2022-05-06T01:57:39Z")
> [@Dereknocue67](#): > > It’s another odd quirk in our language. Most of us might say, "I am going to school.’, yet seldom say, ‘I am going to hospital.’, much like the British. Using “the” seems superfluous. That’s not really the same though, as “I am going to school” (I am attending classes) has a different meaning than “I am going to _the_ school.” (I will physically be in the school building.) ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2022, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/24 "2022-05-06T02:06:08Z")
Not only do I assume they are using those terms as a title, but I would write it that way, same as when a nurse refers to Doc. I’ve also heard both of those from TV. I remember the TV sitcom Coach where the head coach was always referred to as “Coach” by the players, and that seemed to carry through in all other users. The same thing I noticed happening with “Chef” on cooking shows. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2022, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/25 "2022-05-06T07:12:32Z")
> [@Kzbre5m](#): > > _Rabbi_ is another one, as in _Rabbi wants to speak with you_ . I don’t know what to say if there are more than one (not a Minyan I know), as sometimes happens at work. That certainly doesn’t come from Hebrew. In fact, Hebrew has the opposite phenomenon - “the” is used as an honorific when addressing someone. You’d address as rabbi as “the Rabbi”, as in, “May I ask you a question, the Rabbi?”. Same thing with teacher, coach, bus driver or commanding officer; in fact, the Hebrew equivalent of “sir” in the military sense literally means “the Commander”. ---
**Author:** ![Kzbre5m](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f08c70/32.png) [@Kzbre5m](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kzbre5m)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2022, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/26 "2022-05-06T23:12:50Z")
I’ll have to ask this the next time I see any of them. It’s not a regular thing. Another is Lieutenant. “Will _the Lieutenant_ want coffee?” Thinking about it, it sounds like a replacement for _you_, and a respect for that particular rank. Upper ranks don’t get the _the_, though my research is mostly _Hogan’s Heroes_ and other 60’s TV war sitcoms. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2022, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/27 "2022-05-06T23:23:08Z")
I recall “Doctor” and “Father” for a Catholic priest being used that way when I was young - but only by certain people, like the nurse in the doctor’s office or the parish secretary. Which I guess is the same as the other examples- it would really only be the team members who refer to “Coach” or the restaurant staff who refer to “Chef” , right? ---
**Author:** ![Dereknocue67](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6de8d8/32.png) [@Dereknocue67](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dereknocue67)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2022, 7:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/28 "2022-05-07T07:16:35Z")
Your distinction has a difference after changing the context of the communication. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2022, 10:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/29 "2022-05-07T10:19:55Z")
I guess I could say that I’ve never referred to anyone that way, but I’ve never had a coach or worked for a chef. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2022, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/30 "2022-05-07T10:37:42Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > For example, someone told a lie to the chef and someone else commented “I can’t believe she would lie right to [C]hef”. My change. I would capitalize it as the title is used for the person themself, much like we capitalize “Mom” or “Dad” when used within a family but would say “my mom” or “my dad” when talking to an outsider. My dragon boat team has a coach who we call “Coach” and we refer to him as such when talking to other people on the team. For example. “Did you hear, Coach says we need to be there at 5:00?” ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2022, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/31 "2022-05-07T16:06:23Z")
One more example: “Matron”. ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [May 7, 2022, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/32 "2022-05-07T22:51:32Z")
There’s a word I don’t hear used very often. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/33 "2022-05-08T03:42:08Z")
I’ve often heard churchgoers refer to their pastor (when discussing him in the third person) simply as “pastor”. ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/34 "2022-05-08T11:46:27Z")
It strikes me a kid referring to a parent as “Dad” or “Mom”. A certain whiff of fictive family? An intersect of family level comfort but with a level of not call by first name respect? And more used with other members of “the family”? Sometimes shortened also. “Teach”, “Doc” … “Coach” and “Chef” have those almost parental roles with others in the team feeling like sibs. “General” likely not but “Sarge” does? ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/35 "2022-05-08T19:12:49Z")
Yeah, this seems like it might be it. It goes with what others said earlier, about direct responsibility over someone. ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2022, 9:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/36 "2022-05-08T21:58:23Z")
I don’t know if it’s still the case, but when I was in school 40 years ago, there was a female nurse employed by the school whose job (as far as I understood it) was to look after children who became unwell or sustained minor injuries during the school day. She had a room with a bed where unwell children could lie down, and she would administer medical treatments such as painting iodine on a cut knee or pouring peroxide on an infected finger. That nurse was referred to as “Matron” (never “the matron”). Edited to add: it seems this job still exists [Microsoft Word - Matron - April 2019 (thebluecoatschool.com)](https://www.thebluecoatschool.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/Matron-April-2019-2.pdf) ---
**Author:** ![sciurophobic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@sciurophobic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sciurophobic)\ **Post date:** [May 9, 2022, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/37 "2022-05-09T15:17:30Z")
I believe if you work in the White House you might say POTUS instead of The POTUS or The President, and definitely not just President. ---
**Author:** ![Sternvogel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bc79bd/32.png) [@Sternvogel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sternvogel)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2022, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/38 "2022-05-10T00:01:58Z")
> [@CookingWithGas](#): > > I have heard nurses refer to the doctor as “doctor” using the title as a surrogate for the name. I once read an article in which a physician was quoted as explaining that his staff referred to him as simply “Doctor” for the same reason that Christians do not describe their savior as “the Jesus”. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2022, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/39 "2022-05-10T00:09:35Z")
I’ve never heard “the POTUS” in any context that I’m aware of. In my experience, it’s always just “POTUS”, regardless of your job title or closeness to the White House. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2022, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954/40 "2022-05-10T00:33:42Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > As far as I can tell, this doesn’t happen with other titles – you wouldn’t say “I can’t believe she lied to general/captain/doctor/nurse…”, you would put “the” in front of it. It’s common to refer to the boss as Boss. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dropping-the-in-front-of-chef-or-coach/963954.md?page=3)