# Dubya the lush **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 25, 2003, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413 "2003-05-25T16:37:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/1 "2003-05-25T16:37:28Z")
I had mentioned in another thread that “W” looks to me like he fell off the wagon. Is any evidence (other than his splotchy face) available to support/deny this? ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/2 "2003-05-25T16:48:05Z")
Um, since you’re the one making the accusation, what evidence do you have to support it? ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/3 "2003-05-25T16:52:16Z")
I’d like to think it’s true but even I think I need more than a splotchy face to come to that conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/4 "2003-05-25T16:55:35Z")
Great Debate, or just Great Hate? People of Earth: you decide! ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/5 "2003-05-25T17:05:27Z")
I guess I’m to blame for putting the idea in Zoo’s head. Sorry. IMHO, anyone? ---
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/6 "2003-05-25T17:16:08Z")
I admit part of the reason I started this thread was just to stir shit up. Perhaps this is a subject better suited for the pit, but I am curious if there is any information out there. The splotchy face evidence I have is thin at best, but I have known many long term drinkers and one common effect I have noticed is a splotchy face as they entered their 50’s & 60’s. Other than that I really have nothing else, except for in some of his tv apearences he looks to me like he has a good buzz going. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/7 "2003-05-25T17:18:41Z")
I dunno about the splotchy face, but I think it’s more likely he’s taking prescription drugs to deal with anxiety than hitting the bottle. It’s easy, legal, and less likely to bite him in the ass politically. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/8 "2003-05-25T17:30:52Z")
Summary: I have an unlikely proposition, no evidence to support it, that slurs the President’s name. I think I’ll post it, to “just stir shit up.” Nice going. Wrong forum. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/9 "2003-05-25T17:34:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Bricker \* > \*\*Summary: I have an unlikely proposition, no evidence to support it, that slurs the President’s name. I think I’ll post it, to “just stir shit up.” > > Nice going. Wrong forum. \*\* Wrong forum? Or bannable offense? ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/10 "2003-05-25T18:25:13Z")
I have a splotchy face from staring at a monitor all day long… ---
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/11 "2003-05-25T18:32:34Z")
Bricker… “Proposition unlikely” Falling off the wagon is not all that rare. “No evidence to support it” The evidence is thin, but it is there. I’m sorry I did not post this in the pit or IMHO, not much chance of a civil discussion I guess. ---
**Author:** ![Foolonthehill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Foolonthehill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foolonthehill)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/12 "2003-05-25T18:57:44Z")
Katherin van Wormer from the University of Northern Iowa wrote an article published today, (5-25), in the San Francisco Chronicle. Called “Brain Chemistry; The Seritonin Factor,” van Wormer calls Bush a ‘Dry Drunk’ In effect, he will always act the way he does, (every decision is B&W, evrything is exaggerated). Interesting article. ---
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/13 "2003-05-25T19:12:16Z")
Thank you Foolonthehill, this was my original intent. To prove dubya is still tipping the bottle is a hard thing to do, to prove he is not drinking may be impossible. I wanted to see observations and other info the dopers may have. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/14 "2003-05-25T19:14:07Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zoo \* > \*\*Bricker… “Proposition unlikely” Falling off the wagon is not all that rare. > > “No evidence to support it” The evidence is thin, but it is there. > > I’m sorry I did not post this in the pit or IMHO, not much chance of a civil discussion I guess. \*\* It’s very easy to request a moderator to move it to the appropriate forum. That is, if you are sincere about wanting to do so. ---
**Author:** ![zoo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71c47a/32.png) [@zoo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zoo)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/15 "2003-05-25T19:19:35Z")
John Mace… By all means then. How do we do ths? By the way, you are to blame. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/16 "2003-05-25T19:54:18Z")
“By the way, you are to blame.” I know. That’s what I said in my first post. “How do we do ths?” Look in the bottom right corner of your OP box or any box showing any of your subsequent posts. ---
**Author:** ![milroyj](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e57/32.png) [@milroyj](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/milroyj)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/17 "2003-05-25T22:53:17Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by zoo \* > **"No evidence to support it" The evidence is thin, but it is there.** If it’s there, then provide it. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/18 "2003-05-25T23:34:11Z")
There may be something to the “dry-drunk” thing. Black and white morality, self-righteousness and over-developed religiosity are all characteristics of this. Has GWB ever explicitly admitted to being an alcoholic? I think it’s pretty clear that he is, whether he says so publicly or not, but I also think that’s an admirable quality on his part. Kicking alcoholism is a hard thing to do and is a life-long process. It’s one part of him that shows genuine character. (And that’s about the nicest thing you’ll ever hear me say about Shrubya) ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/19 "2003-05-25T23:43:53Z")
He says he “drank too much,” but that he was not an alcoholic. I do think it’s kind of cool when at events like the state dinners the newspaper accounts say that “the wines included a Muscatel and a Sauvignon Blanc. The President had only water.” ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2003, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413/20 "2003-05-25T23:45:18Z")
No, he hasn’t, and hasn’t even publicly discussed it except in the barest detail and with a cover story about “being young and irresponsible” - until the age of 40, that is. Laura said, in an election-year interview with Barbara Walters, I believe, that she gave him an ultimatum then. That would seem to confirm that it was/is an addiction, not just a habit. We are also constantly told that there are no former alcoholics, just recovering ones, so that means he _is_ an alcoholic. That said, I haven’t noticed any changes in his behavior lately. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dubya-the-lush/177413.md?page=2)