# Dumbed down for movies, TV, etc. **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 27, 2009, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421 "2009-07-27T13:57:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 8:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/21 "2009-07-28T08:34:19Z")
In one of the most quoted lines from _Silence of the Lambs_ Lecter mentions eating someone’s liver with “fava beans and a nice Chianti.” I don’t have the book around so I’m not 100% positive, but it seems like Lecter’s wine choice in the book was something else. Something, I assume, that many in the audience wouldn’t recognize as wine? Also the Goldberg variation played was not Glenn Gould’s version, as specifically mentioned in the book, although I suppose that could have been a rights issue. Gould’s version–actually, either of his versions–are easy to recognize compared to anyone else’s. ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/22 "2009-07-28T13:07:44Z")
> [@Bryan\_Ekers](#): > > my favourite spoof of dumbing-down is [this adaptation of _Watchmen_](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDDHHrt6l4w). In particular this parody seems to be inspired by the _Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles_ animated series- the theme songs are similar\*, and both are essentially turning serious, gritty characters\*\* into fun-loving goofs who party and eat pizza. \*The Ninja Turtles theme song was actually written by Chuck Lorre, who snuck a reference to this fact into one of his production logos as well as an episode of _Two and a Half Men_. \*\*Despite the fact that it was meant as parody and the heroes were, well, giant turtles, the original Ninja Turtles comics were quite serious in tone and violent. ---
**Author:** ![Soul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Soul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/23 "2009-07-28T14:18:11Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > Harry Potter and the **Philosopher’s** Stone > > Dumbed down before it was even a movie! :rolleyes: Compared to [what it could have been](http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20048226,00.html), the US title was brilliant. > [@](#): > > ARTHUR A. LEVINE > Editor > > Flying back to the U.S. from the Bologna Children’s Book Fair in April 1997, Arthur A. Levine read the galley of the event’s most intriguing prospect, Harry Potter and the Philosopher’s Stone. ‘‘That was a very enjoyable plane ride,’’ recalls Levine. Ten years later, Levine, 45, has edited and published each Potter book in America through his eponymous imprint at Scholastic. After outbidding seven other publishers (he paid $105,000 for book 1), Levine suggested J.K. Rowling change its title to Harry Potter and the School of Magic. According to Levine, Rowling said, ‘‘Yeeee-ah, I don’t quite like that, but how about Harry Potter and the Sorcerer’s Stone?’’ Since then, Levine says he’s never used his position of extreme power to persuade Rowling to keep a character alive or try a particular plot twist. ‘‘The last thing in the world I’d want,’’ he says, ‘‘would be to dictate to J.K. Rowling.’’ —Gregory Kirschling ---
**Author:** ![Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/bc8723/32.png) [@Unauthorized\_Cinnamon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unauthorized_Cinnamon)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/24 "2009-07-28T14:33:08Z")
My favorite is Jurassic Park. Ellie is talking to a biologist who’s so smart and knowledgeable, he’s working on a genetics project advanced beyond our wildest dreams. He tells her the dinosaurs maintain a certain body temperature. Ellie: It’s homeothermic? Biologist: Yes. Ellie: It maintains that temperature? Biologist: :smack: ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/25 "2009-07-28T14:43:12Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > In one of the most quoted lines from _Silence of the Lambs_ Lecter mentions eating someone’s liver with “fava beans and a nice Chianti.” > > I don’t have the book around so I’m not 100% positive, but it seems like Lecter’s wine choice in the book was something else. Something, I assume, that many in the audience wouldn’t recognize as wine? I remember that! It stuck in my head when I read the book after seeing the movie. It’s “a big Amantine”. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/26 "2009-07-28T14:55:19Z")
**V for Vendetta** , from start to finish of the (miserable) Hollywood version. Just for a taster, of course audiences are too dumb to sympathize with Evie if she is portrayed as a teenage factory worker/hooker. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/27 "2009-07-28T15:10:02Z")
> [@villa](#): > > **V for Vendetta** , from start to finish of the (miserable) Hollywood version. > > Just for a taster, of course audiences are too dumb to sympathize with Evie if she is portrayed as a teenage factory worker/hooker. Aspiring hooker – on her first attempt she solicited a secret policeman, but V saved her before anything happened. ---
**Author:** ![villa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/bc79bd/32.png) [@villa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/villa)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/28 "2009-07-28T15:20:42Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Aspiring hooker – on her first attempt she solicited a secret policeman, but V saved her before anything happened. Well, she did commit solicitation. Which could, in itself, be sufficient to consider her a hooker. Dammit, you knew what I meant! ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/29 "2009-07-28T16:43:07Z")
On the subject of Contact, in the novel at the end the main character sets her SETI computers to examining Pi. And they find deep into it an indicator of a message, essentially a block of 0s and 1s that forms a square with a perfect circle in it. This would strongly suggest that the universe was created, that spacetime was designed to be as it is since Pi is built into the universe. If something encoded a message in Pi it did it from outside our universe as its laws and geometrical axioms were being written. That’s just fucking awesome. But I’m willing to bet the average matthew mcconaughey fan just isn’t up to it. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ivylass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/9de053/32.png) [@ivylass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivylass)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/30 "2009-07-28T16:53:41Z")
> [@Larry\_Mudd](#): > > We call this type of thing “exposition.” > > [shoots ironic look in direction of fourth wall] **CSI** does this all the time. I would hope the lab techs would know about all the tidbits they feel necessary to explain to each other already, but apparently they have to discuss it anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Icerigger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/icerigger/32/432_2.png) [@Icerigger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Icerigger)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 5:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/31 "2009-07-28T17:41:13Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > On the subject of Contact, in the novel at the end the main character sets her SETI computers to examining Pi. And they find deep into it an indicator of a message, essentially a block of 0s and 1s that forms a square with a perfect circle in it. I have always wondered what Sagan was trying to say with that, God exists? I guess Palmer Joss was right after all. ---
**Author:** ![It\_s\_Not\_Rocket\_Surgery](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/it_s_not_rocket_surgery/32/312_2.png) [@It\_s\_Not\_Rocket\_Surgery](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/It_s_Not_Rocket_Surgery)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/32 "2009-07-28T18:19:16Z")
> [@mobo85](#): > > I believe Batmanuel is the result of legal quirks and not dumbing down- the characters of Die Fledermaus and American Maid were created for the animated series and thus property of Fox Kids (now Disney), so the producers of the live-action series had to create characters with similar personalities who were legally not the same characters- hence Batmanuel and Miss Liberty. Ignorance fought! Thanks for the info. ---
**Author:** ![Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hilarity_n.suze/32/6223_2.png) [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hilarity_N.Suze)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/33 "2009-07-28T18:29:43Z")
> [@FriarTed](#): > > I remember that! It stuck in my head when I read the book after seeing the movie. It’s “a big Amantine”. Lecter didn’t really seem the type to go for Chianti. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/34 "2009-07-28T18:57:55Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Of course, then you had GI Joe, where every gun on the show fired laser beams instead of bullets (because ya know, even letting the military have bullet guns on kiddy shows is a no-no :rolleyes:) not that it mattered since no one ever actually got hit on the show, with maybe one or two notable exceptions. Further dumbing things down, Snake Eyes and Storm Shadow, who pretty much dominated the storylines used for the comics (written by Larry Hama who basically created all the characters and wrote the filecards that came with the toys) had most of their personality stripped and were left as fairly minor characters. Remember that the GI JOE cartoon was made to support the first few waves of action figures. At that time Snake-eyes and Storm Shadow were becoming fan favorites thanks to kid support and Hama’s stories but not the central crux of the entire mythos. Considering that Snake-eyes got any play thanks to being drab looking for a cartoon and NOT talking is pretty remarkable. He was always treated as a solid second tier character. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/35 "2009-07-28T19:16:25Z")
> [@Typo\_Knig](#): > > Harry Potter and the **Philosopher’s** Stone > > Dumbed down before it was even a movie! :rolleyes: I recall, when the James Bond movie “License to Kill” came out in the late 80s, it was based on a book entitled “License Revoked”. The argument I read at the time was that the producers believed that too many Americans wouldn’t know what “revoked” meant. ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/36 "2009-07-28T20:13:39Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I recall, when the James Bond movie “License to Kill” came out in the late 80s, it was based on a book entitled “License Revoked”. The argument I read at the time was that the producers believed that too many Americans wouldn’t know what “revoked” meant. _Licence to Kill_ (the film uses the British spelling of “license”) wasn’t taken from a Fleming title (the first Bond film not to be so), but it is true that the original title was supposed to be _Licence Revoked_. ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/37 "2009-07-28T20:13:45Z")
I thought that it was because the films were not “James Bond in …” but just the title. And the title “License Revoked” sounds like a teen comedy. Possibly a comedy starring the Coreys. A sequel to “License to Drive” perhaps. Also, License Revoked is not a good title. License to Kill is. ---
**Author:** ![Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Uosdwis\_R.Dewoh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Uosdwis_R.Dewoh)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/38 "2009-07-28T21:56:32Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > I recall, when the James Bond movie “License to Kill” came out in the late 80s, it was based on a book entitled “License Revoked”. The argument I read at the time was that the producers believed that too many Americans wouldn’t know what “revoked” meant. To be fair, “License revoked” would have made for a bad title song. ---
**Author:** ![Duhkecco](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/8491ac/32.png) [@Duhkecco](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duhkecco)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/39 "2009-07-28T22:08:54Z")
> [@Hilarity\_N.Suze](#): > > Lecter didn’t really seem the type to go for Chianti. He’s also not the type to go for “Amantine”, which is not even a type of wine. In the book, Lecter mentions a “big [Amarone](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amarone)”. ---
**Author:** ![thelurkinghorror](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7c8e57/32.png) [@thelurkinghorror](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thelurkinghorror)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2009, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421/40 "2009-07-28T22:11:14Z")
That’s funny. Just this morning I looked up the phenomenon mentioned several times in this thread on TVTropes. It’s listed under [As You Know](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AsYouKnow). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dumbed-down-for-movies-tv-etc/504421.md?page=3)