# Dylann Roof found guilty - rot in hell **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 15, 2016, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814 "2016-12-15T21:39:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a8b319/32.png) [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Disgruntled_Penguin)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/81 "2016-12-20T15:47:40Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > Do _you?_ > > To the extent that _that’s_ your argument, then wouldn’t the crime rate be irrelevant to you? If it _were_ the case that the murder rate was no different (or, at that, lower) in capital-punishment jurisdictions, then why _wouldn’t_ you just repeat your question about How Can Perpetuating The Same Action Be Right? Why _wouldn’t_ you shrug off the data to again ask Do You Really Believe Two Wrongs Make A Right? > > You asked those questions. Don’t you care about the answers? Why wouldn’t I shrug off the data? Geez, I don’t know, perhaps I don’t reject the facts when they don’t support my theory. If they did not agree I’d discard my theory as flawed. You aren’t like that too? I ask honestly. You’d continue a theory in the face of data suggesting otherwise? Wait, of course you would. You’re doing it now. OF course that assumes that my question deals with " How Can Perpetuating The Same Action Be Right" which is not at all what my point is. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/82 "2016-12-20T15:49:34Z")
I’ll stick with a bullet to the head and tossing him on the burn pile. But hey, that’s just me. ---
**Author:** ![Novelty\_Bobble](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Novelty\_Bobble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Novelty_Bobble)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/83 "2016-12-20T18:55:55Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > I’ll stick with a bullet to the head and tossing him on the burn pile. But hey, that’s just me. I’m sure it is, and it shines a light into a dark side of your psychology that is rather worrying. You are maybe not as far removed from Roof’s mentality as you’d like to think. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/84 "2016-12-20T19:58:18Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > > [@RandMcnally](#): > > > > The family wants to forgive him, that’s fine. But I don’t. He didn’t just harm those family, but the entire black community and I, for one, am tired of “forgiving” white people who do us evil. > > Just white people? :rolleyes: Right, right, we get it, #AllEvilsMatter. But what we are talking about in this thread, specifically, is a particularly appalling instance of the **systemic and longstanding and societally condoned perpetration of evil by white people against the black community in the US**. So, maybe not the best time to pipe up with nitpicking faux-egalitarian objections to a black person’s expressing anger **specifically about that phenomenon of white-on-black evil**. Sheesh. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/85 "2016-12-20T20:06:58Z")
> [@Novelty\_Bobble](#): > > You are maybe not as far removed from Roof’s mentality as you’d like to think. I’m okay with the distinction. There is no comparison of Roof’s actions to those that will execute him. Roof’s chose his path including his own execution. The men and women on that jury are just fulfilling the law and the seeing that Roof faces the consequences of his actions. Again, when I kill stray dogs attacking my cattle, I am well within my rights, as I’m protecting my livestock. But it’s the nature of feral dogs to go after weaker animals, and they do not understand the consequences that await them, when I catch them. Roof on the other hand knows the consequences of his actions, and did it anyway. His execution is clearly justified. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/86 "2016-12-28T16:30:00Z")
I see Roof is back in the headlines now, so this seems as good a time as any to continue. > [@Disgruntled\_Penguin](#): > > Why wouldn’t I shrug off the data? Geez, I don’t know, perhaps I don’t reject the facts when they don’t support my theory. If they did not agree I’d discard my theory as flawed. You aren’t like that too? I ask honestly. You’d continue a theory in the face of data suggesting otherwise? Wait, of course you would. You’re doing it now. > > OF course that assumes that my question deals with " How Can Perpetuating The Same Action Be Right" which is not at all what my point is. You literally wrote: “If what he did was wrong how can perpetuating the same action against him be right?” If that wasn’t what your point is – excuse me, wasn’t “at all” what your point is – then you shouldn’t have said it in the first place; I took you at your word, in good faith, like the darned nice guy I am. If it’s not your point, then I congratulate you; it’s not my point either; I don’t believe it should be anyone’s point. But I want to make something clear: since I truly thought it _was_ your point – you know, since you typed it out, word-for-word – I genuinely figured it _would_ have made sense to reject the data. Let me explain. I adore, and advocate for, freedom of expression, and freedom of worship – not because I believe they’re correlated with lower crime rates, but merely because I believe it’s _right_. I’m a fan of the right to a trial by jury; I’m a fan of the right to gay marriage; I’m a fan of the right to all sorts of things. If someone were to tell me that one of those happens to be linked to lower crime rates, I’d – well, I’d file it away as a piece of trivia, and I’d maybe even mention it from time to time; but I wouldn’t actually _care._ After all, I’d still be on the side of free speech and freedom of religion and jury trials and gay marriage and so on even if new data showed that crime rates _weren’t_ any lower in jurisdictions that uphold those. So when I took you at your word – “If what he did was wrong how can perpetuating the same action against him be right?” – I figured you were the same way: if you truly believed that “perpetuating the same action” can’t be right, then you wouldn’t actually care whether “perpetuating the same action” causes lower crime rates; after all, it still wouldn’t be the right thing to do. The data maybe wouldn’t be relevant; you’d maybe want to do what’s right regardless. If you don’t actually believe that “perpetuating the same action” point – well, then, sure, I guess the data could be relevant. But in the future, I’d strongly advise you not to toss that “perpetuating the same action” sentence out there if you’re ever trying to make your point in some future discussion; it seems like it just clouds the issue. Oh, and here’s to hoping Roof is – permanently incapacitated? Can we agree on that? ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/87 "2016-12-28T17:04:53Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > I’m ashamed to admit this, but I had forgotten who Dylann Roof was … thank you OP for reminding me … that was very kind of you … > > These are the only names I remembered, how stupid of me: > > Cynthia Marie Graham Hurd (54) – Bible study member and manager for the Charleston County Public Library system; sister of Malcolm Graham. > Susie Jackson (87) – a Bible study and church choir member. > Ethel Lee Lance (70) – the church’s sexton. > Depayne Middleton-Doctor (49) – a pastor who was also employed as a school administrator and admissions coordinator at Southern Wesleyan University. > Clementa C. Pinckney (41) – the church’s pastor and a South Carolina state senator. > Tywanza Sanders (26) – a Bible study member; grandnephew of Susie Jackson. > Daniel Simmons (74) – a pastor who also served at Greater Zion AME Church in Awendaw. > Sharonda Coleman-Singleton (45) – a pastor; also a speech therapist and track coach at Goose Creek High School. > Myra Thompson (59) – a Bible study teacher. From every account all of them were wonderful-beautiful souls. And their Christian/forgiving survivors publically forgave Roof in the days immediately following his rampage. Will they testify for his life during the penalty phase of the trial? Will their wishes hold sway? ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2016, 5:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/88 "2016-12-28T17:07:10Z")
> [@Nava](#): > > I expect he refers to [Matthew 25](http://biblehub.com/niv/matthew/25.htm), specifically the bit at the end. Matthew 25, 31-46: > > When the Son of Man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, he will sit on his glorious throne. 32All the nations will be gathered before him, and he will separate the people one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats. 33He will put the sheep on his right and the goats on his left. > > 34“Then the King will say to those on his right, ‘Come, you who are blessed by my Father; take your inheritance, the kingdom prepared for you since the creation of the world. 35For I was hungry and you gave me something to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me something to drink, I was a stranger and you invited me in, 36I needed clothes and you clothed me, I was sick and you looked after me, I was in prison and you came to visit me.’ > > 37“Then the righteous will answer him, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry and feed you, or thirsty and give you something to drink? 38When did we see you a stranger and invite you in, or needing clothes and clothe you? 39When did we see you sick or in prison and go to visit you?’ > > 40“The King will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.’ > > 41“Then he will say to those on his left, ‘Depart from me, you who are cursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. 42For I was hungry and you gave me nothing to eat, I was thirsty and you gave me nothing to drink, 43I was a stranger and you did not invite me in, I needed clothes and you did not clothe me, I was sick and in prison and you did not look after me.’ > > 44“They also will answer, ‘Lord, when did we see you hungry or thirsty or a stranger or needing clothes or sick or in prison, and did not help you?’ > > 45“He will reply, ‘Truly I tell you, whatever you did not do for one of the least of these, you did not do for me.’ > > 46“Then they will go away to eternal punishment, but the righteous to eternal life.” More broadly, ask yourself which groups support food aid, prison reform, aid to refugees, and affordable housing for the poor and middle class and which groups oppose those things. ---
**Author:** ![eulalia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eulalia/32/457_2.png) [@eulalia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eulalia)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2016, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/89 "2016-12-29T04:43:34Z")
Damn it people, it’s _perpetrate_! Perpetuate means to extend the duration of something to infinity. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/90 "2017-01-10T22:28:36Z")
> [@](#): > > An unrepentant Dylann Roof was sentenced to death Tuesday for killing nine black church members during Bible study, the first person to face execution for federal hate crime convictions. > > A jury deliberated his sentence for about three hours, capping a trial in which Roof did not fight for his life or show any remorse. He was his own attorney during sentencing and insisted that he wasn’t mentally ill, but he never asked for forgiveness or mercy, or explained the crime. > **[Dylann Roof sentenced to death for killing 9 church members](https://www.yahoo.com/news/roofs-fate-soon-rest-hands-12-federal-jurors-082244212.html)** > > CHARLESTON, S.C. (AP) — An unrepentant Dylann Roof was sentenced to death Tuesday for fatally shooting nine black church members during a Bible study session, becoming the first person ordered executed for a federal hate crime. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2017, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/91 "2017-01-10T23:43:40Z")
Can we quit giving this piece of shit his time in the sun? Time to forget him and move on. Let the justice system do its job. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/92 "2017-01-11T01:09:21Z")
Wished it worked a little faster. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/93 "2017-01-11T14:21:29Z")
Are all you folks arguing for life in prison able, ready and willing to guarantee Rooff will never kill again? Someone in prison or if he gets out or escapes? I’ve never known a cop who was for the death penalty. Some people are just too dangerous to live. And too broken to be repaired. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/94 "2017-01-11T15:05:24Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Are all you folks arguing for life in prison able, ready and willing to guarantee Rooff will never kill again? Someone in prison or if he gets out or escapes? I dunno, can you guarantee no innocent person will be sentenced to death? ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/95 "2017-01-11T16:04:02Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > I dunno, can you guarantee no innocent person will be sentenced to death? This. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/96 "2017-01-11T16:04:56Z")
And, can you guarantee that in the approximately 15 years Roof will spend on death row, he won’t kill anyone? From the wiki article on [Death Row](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_row) > [@](#): > > In the United States, prisoners may wait many years before execution can be carried out due to the complex and time-consuming appeals procedures mandated in the jurisdiction. The time between sentencing and execution has increased relatively steadily between 1977 and 2010, including a 22% jump between 1989 and 1990 and a similar jump between 2008 and 2009. In 2010, a death row inmate waited an average of 178 months (roughly 15 years) between sentencing and execution.[1] **Nearly a quarter of inmates on death row in the U.S. die of natural causes while awaiting execution.** [2] So it’s a death sentence, but for a quarter of the people sentenced to death, it’s life in prison without parole. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [January 11, 2017, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/97 "2017-01-11T21:21:31Z")
Are you telling me that Rooff is innocent? I don’t think so. And my statement is that every cop I’ve ever known if definitely pro-death penalty. Even Ann Rule of The Stranger Beside Me fame agreed that some people should be put to death, including her friend Ted Bundy. She initially thought he could be fixed and didn’t deserve to die, but then realized she was keeping a monster alive. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/98 "2017-01-12T00:20:56Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Are you telling me that Rooff is innocent? I don’t think so. Either you have the death penalty, or you don’t. Unless you’re arguing that Roof and only Roof ever be sentenced to death, it’s bigger than this one case. > [@](#): > > And my statement is that every cop I’ve ever known if definitely pro-death penalty. I count that as a reason to oppose it, frankly. > [@](#): > > Even Ann Rule of The Stranger Beside Me fame agreed that some people should be put to death, including her friend Ted Bundy. She initially thought he could be fixed and didn’t deserve to die, but then realized she was keeping a monster alive. People agreed that the West Memphis Three should be put to death. How’d that work out? ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/99 "2017-01-12T00:30:14Z")
> [@Annie-Xmas](#): > > Are you telling me that Rooff is innocent? I don’t think so. No, there is no possibility that Roof is innocent. The problem is, as **Human Action** points out, that if you have the death penalty you have a very real risk of someday executing somebody who **is** innocent. The number of US [death-row inmates who have been exonerated as wrongfully convicted](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_exonerated_death_row_inmates) bears that out. Given that their eventual exonerations were usually the result of volunteer efforts rather than routine processing in the criminal justice system, it is overwhelmingly likely that some innocent people who didn’t have the advantage of similar extraordinary assistance **have** been wrongfully executed. [QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] Even Ann Rule of The Stranger Beside Me fame agreed that some people should be put to death, including her friend Ted Bundy. She initially thought he could be fixed and didn’t deserve to die, but then realized she was keeping a monster alive. [/QUOTE] The acceptability of the death penalty doesn’t depend in the least on whether a perpetrator “deserves” to die. Just because somebody is bad enough to deserve death doesn’t mean that the criminal justice system should be in the business of killing them. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [January 12, 2017, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814/100 "2017-01-12T00:44:33Z")
[This site](http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty), which does seem to have an agenda, states the costs of the Death Penalty. I don’t wanna sound like penny-pinching basterd, but I am. > [@](#): > > Cases without the death penalty cost $740,000, while cases where the death penalty is sought cost $1.26 million. Maintaining each death row prisoner costs taxpayers $90,000 more per year than a prisoner in general population. There are 714 inmates on California’s death row. 90K more, per year, for 714 inmates is …a shitload! Actually 64,260,000 per year extra. A death row inmate can be there for many, many years. > [@](#): > > Although arriving at the actual cost of the death penalty in a state is complicated, in some states $30 million per execution is a very conservative estimate: Having it and not using is pretty pricey also. > [@](#): > > New York spent about $170 million over 9 years and had no executions. New Jersey spent $253 million over a 25-year period and also had no executions. Seem to me like we can find better uses for this money. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dylann-roof-found-guilty-rot-in-hell/774814.md?page=6)