# Dystopian novels **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 9, 2015, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923 "2015-12-09T08:44:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 7:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/41 "2015-12-10T07:00:40Z")
The Road - Cormac McCarthy Earth Abides - George Stewart By the way, Stewart also wrote an amazing book on the Donner Party. I know little of this author but his writing is wonderful. ---
**Author:** ![Scytheria](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/76d3ee/32.png) [@Scytheria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scytheria)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/42 "2015-12-10T15:31:05Z")
There seems to be a general misunderstanding that Dystopian fiction requires a post-apocalyptic setting - it often has one, but only as a plot device to facilitate the flawed society explored. The fiction really needs to be about a perversion of societal norms to count in this genre. For this reason, books like The Road and I Am Legend don’t really count - they describe worlds without societies altogether. Anyway, I’d add Erewhon (Samuel Butler) to this list - one of the finest and funniest ‘topsy turvy’ worlds ever created. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/43 "2015-12-10T15:40:36Z")
_City of Endless Night, Half Past Human/The Godwhale_, the Draka\* series, and both _Brave New World_ and \*We \*are either not post-apocalyptic or so far past the apocalypse it’s about as relevant as Noah’s Flood to the story. - Ok, the Draka taking over the world might qualify as the apocalypse, but plenty of the rest of the story occurs before that. ---
**Author:** ![Cardigan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cardigan/32/187_2.png) [@Cardigan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cardigan)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/44 "2015-12-10T17:14:39Z")
It’s really more of a short story, but there’s always Vonnegut’s ‘Harrison Bergeron’ ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/45 "2015-12-10T17:31:13Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > I’ve read “The Hunger Games” series, and also the first “Divergent” book; however, finishing “Divergent” was a chore because the story got really weird about 3/4 of the way into it. I’m with you, and I’ll add I didn’t like the whole concept of Divergent. I don’t believe the author developed any backstory. The only way that world exists is if the Judeo-Christian God creates it _in media res_. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/46 "2015-12-10T17:38:41Z")
Ayn Rand’s _Anthem_ (which we’ve all read because it was the shortest book on the summer reading list) ---
**Author:** ![Marvin\_the\_Martian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/marvin_the_martian/32/2898_2.png) [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marvin_the_Martian)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/47 "2015-12-10T18:53:28Z")
I wonder what would be considered the earliest dystopian novel. _We_ was written in 1921, but I would propose _The Time Machine_ (1895) as an earlier example… ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/48 "2015-12-10T19:16:11Z")
> [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](#): > > I wonder what would be considered the earliest dystopian novel. _We_ was written in 1921, but I would propose _The Time Machine_ (1895) as an earlier example… Wouldnt some of the Greek tragedies qualify? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/49 "2015-12-10T19:43:21Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Wouldnt some of the Greek tragedies qualify? They’re not really about dystopian societies, they’re about ordinary Greek societies where events have gone to shit. Not the same thing. A novel set during the American Civil War or the Great Depression might be depressing, but it is not a dystopian novel. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/50 "2015-12-10T20:39:18Z")
_**[After London](http://www.gutenberg.org/ebooks/13944)**_ is 1885. I bet someone comes up with something ancient, though. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/51 "2015-12-10T20:58:06Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I bet someone comes up with something ancient, though. Sure - Plato’s _Republic_, from around 380 BC. The division of society into ridged castes (gold, silver, bronze, iron), the abolishment of the family so that parents and children do not know each other, and controlled breeding of human beings dictated by the “philosopher-kings” is not where I would want to live. I’m sure it would be fine if you were at the very top but I don’t think those on the bottom would have such a wonderful life. It actually sounds a bit like _Brave New World_ or _We_. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/52 "2015-12-10T21:05:17Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > Sure - Plato’s _Republic_, from around 380 BC. The division of society into ridged castes (gold, silver, bronze, iron), the abolishment of the family so that parents and children do not know each other, and controlled breeding of human beings dictated by the “philosopher-kings” is not where I would want to live. I’m sure it would be fine if you were at the very top but I don’t think those on the bottom would have such a wonderful life. > > It actually sounds a bit like _Brave New World_ or _We_. You might say the same about More’s _Utopia_ – which nevertheless is a utopian novel, not a dystopian novel, and so is Plato’s _Republic._ I would not like to live in the Libertarian paradise of L. Neil Smith’s [_The Probability Broach_](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Probability_Broach) – but that’s still a utopian novel, not a dystopian novel. It’s all a matter of how the author intends it. ---
**Author:** ![CarnalK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnalk/32/486_2.png) [@CarnalK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CarnalK)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/53 "2015-12-10T21:09:46Z")
It’s been a while since I read it but I was not of the understanding that Plato’s Republic was considered a novel. I believe it’s Jibba Jabba, technically. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/54 "2015-12-10T21:37:23Z")
I’m not sure they even had what we’d call a novel back in Plato’s day. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/55 "2015-12-10T23:27:20Z")
I recently read “The Pianist” by Wladyslaw Szpilman, and although it is not a novel, it certainly reads like a dystopian novel. I highly recommend it. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2015, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/56 "2015-12-10T23:35:47Z")
“Meeks” by Julia Holmes “City of Bohane” by Kevin Barry “The Country of Ice Cream Star” by Sandra Newman “Wittgenstein’s Mistress” by David Markson “California” by Eden Lepucki “Blood Meridian” by Cormac McCarthy “The Road” by Cormac McCarthy “Chalcot Crescent” by Fay Weldon anything by Margaret Atwood “1984” (obviously) “Brave New World” (obviously) ---
**Author:** ![Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/soul_brother_number_two/32/3515_2.png) [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soul_Brother_Number_Two)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/57 "2015-12-11T00:42:42Z")
Didn’t see A Canticle For Leibowitz. A true classic. Also Vic and Blood: The Chronicles of a Boy and His Dog by Harlan Ellison. Superb B movie as well, with a young Don Johnson. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/58 "2015-12-11T05:40:49Z")
> [@nymeria](#): > > Any suggestions? Here’s an obscure one that’s well worth your time to track down a copy and read: [_Wyst: Alastor 1716_](http://www.amazon.com/Wyst-Alastor-1716-Jack-Vance/dp/0879974133/ref=sr_1_2_twi_kin_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1449812004&sr=8-2&keywords=wyst). Set in a world where advanced technology lets everyone get by with little work. Society degenerates into consumerism, hyper-sexuality, celebrity worship, and anti-intellectualism. (Perhaps this vaguely sounds familiar.) It is also an excellent adventure story with strong characters to cheer for. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/59 "2015-12-11T14:36:35Z")
> [@Soul\_Brother\_Number\_Two](#): > > Didn’t see A Canticle For Leibowitz. A true classic. > > Also Vic and Blood: The Chronicles of a Boy and His Dog by Harlan Ellison. Superb B movie as well, with a young Don Johnson. [After the End](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/AfterTheEnd) is a different thing than [Dystopia](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/Dystopia) – although the Topeka Downunder in _ABAHD_ might count as a dystopia. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2015, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923/60 "2015-12-11T15:16:10Z")
> [@Marvin\_the\_Martian](#): > > I wonder what would be considered the earliest dystopian novel. _We_ was written in 1921, but I would propose _The Time Machine_ (1895) as an earlier example… I submit Mary Shelly’s **The Last Man** for earliest sci-fi dystopia. 1826 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/dystopian-novels/739923.md?page=4)