# Early mainstream media portrayals of LGBT characters **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [June 19, 2016, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771 "2016-06-19T14:50:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![installLSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/54ee81/32.png) [@installLSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/installLSC)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/1 "2016-06-19T14:50:48Z")
Recently I found [this oddity](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYitLoZA1Sg&index=14&list=PLXqInGxO8gG7c9IOo8868B-bHohsnNuBo) on YouTube, an episode of a suspense anthology from 1968. It’s about a man-hating woman who raises her son as a girl. It got me thinking about a couple of things: –This show has got to be one of the earliest portrayals of a LGBT character in mainstream media. What other characters date from this era or even earlier. –Obviously, the characterization in this episode is not complimentary to transgendered people. What were the first positive or at least not negative portrayals of LGBT people do you remember? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 3:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/2 "2016-06-19T15:59:08Z")
ZORRO THE GAY BLADE comes to mind: yeah, it’s a comedy – but they take pains to establish that, once the straight hero is injured on the job, his gay twin (a) is perfectly willing to stand in for the guy, and (b) promptly proves _better_ at battling injustice and otherwise pulling off Robin-Hood-style feats. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/3 "2016-06-19T16:22:32Z")
Plato, as played by Sal Mineo, in _Rebel Without a Cause_ was pretty obviously gay. And Alan Sues played a few gay characters (mainly Big Al) on _Laugh In_ in the 60s. ---
**Author:** ![Baker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/bb73d2/32.png) [@Baker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baker)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/4 "2016-06-19T16:49:49Z")
There was a character who appeared three or four times on _Barney Miller_, who was name Marty. He was rather flamboyantly gay. Once he was locked up for shoplifting some luggage. Another guy, a mob accountant, was being held in the lockup for protection, and their conversation was hilarious. There was also an episode of All in the Family, in which the Meathead told Archie that a photographer acquaintance of Archie’s from the bar he went to sometimes, was gay. Archie didn’t believe him, and told the guy about it as a joke, while they armwrestled. The dude told Archie “He’s right” and Archie’s mouth drops open as he realizes he’s holding hands with a gay guy. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/5 "2016-06-19T16:55:45Z")
In 1977 Billy Crystal plays an openly gay character on Soap. Many characters have been played as effeminate before that but Jody was open and out. ---
**Author:** ![Lamia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Lamia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamia)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/6 "2016-06-19T16:57:55Z")
> [@installLSC](#): > > –This show has got to be one of the earliest portrayals of a LGBT character in mainstream media. What other characters date from this era or even earlier. I don’t have time to watch the video you linked to, but from your description it doesn’t sound like it _is_ a portrayal of an LGBT character. A boy forced to live as a girl by his mother is not transgender. If you want examples of “Out and Proud” LGBT people there aren’t a lot in the US media before the late '60s, in part because decency laws and the [Motion Picture Production Code](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Motion_Picture_Production_Code) limited overt depictions of homosexuality. But there were depictions of LGBT characters in the American media long before 1968 – see _[The Celluloid Closet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Celluloid_Closet)_ for examples from film. One that jumps out at me from the list on that Wikipedia page is _[The Children’s Hour](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Children's_Hour_%28film%29)_ (1961), as homosexuality isn’t merely implied or treated as a joke. It’s crucial to the plot that one of the main characters acknowledges that she does have romantic feelings for another woman. The movie is a pretty faithful adaptation of the [Lillian Hellman play of the same name](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Children's_Hour_%28play%29), which premiered in 1934. According to the Wikipedia article, it was at the time illegal to even mention homosexuality onstage in New York, but the authorities were willing to turn a blind eye. However, when the play was first adapted for film two years later (_These Three_) it had to be rewritten to remove any reference to homosexuality – the rumor of a lesbian affair between two teachers is replaced with a rumor about one of the teachers having an affair with the other’s fiance. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/7 "2016-06-19T17:01:01Z")
[Bringing Up Baby](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bringing_Up_Baby), 1938: > [@](#): > > It is debated by some whether Bringing Up Baby is the first fictional work (apart from pornography) to use the word “gay” in a homosexual context.[15][16] In one scene, Cary Grant’s character is wearing a woman’s marabou-trimmed négligée; when asked why, he replies exasperatedly “Because I just went gay all of a sudden!” (leaping into the air at the word “gay”). As the term “gay” did not become familiar to the general public until the Stonewall riots in 1969,[17] it is debated whether the word was used here in its original sense (meaning “happy”[18]) or is an intentional, joking reference to homosexuality.[18] > > In the film, the line was an ad-lib by Grant and not in any version of the original script.[19] According to Vito Russo in The Celluloid Closet (1981, revised 1987), the script originally had Grant’s character say “I…I suppose you think it’s odd, my wearing this. I realize it looks odd…I don’t usually…I mean, I don’t own one of these”. Russo suggests that this indicates that people in Hollywood (at least in Grant’s circles) were familiar with the slang connotations of the word; however, neither Grant nor anyone involved in the film suggested this.[17] In the 1939 _The Wizard of Oz_, the Cowardly Lion is not stated to be gay, but Bert Lahr’s portrayal fits a lot of stereotypes. In the 1941 _The Maltese Falcon_, Peter Lorre plays Joel Cairo with a lot of stereotypical mannerisms. When Sam Spade refers to Wilmer Cook as a Casper Gutman’s “gunsel”, the censors assumed he meant “gunman”. Actually, it was prison slang for “catamite”. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/8 "2016-06-19T17:04:58Z")
There were several gay characters on Barney Miller. There was Officer Zatelli. There was a gay couple whose names were Marty Morrison and Darryl Driscoll. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/9 "2016-06-19T17:20:35Z")
Some websites make a claim that there was a lesbian character on _Welcome Back Kotter_ named Deanna Legros, but I can’t find any definitive proof of that. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/10 "2016-06-19T17:26:48Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > There were several gay characters on Barney Miller. There was Officer Zatelli. There was a gay couple whose names were Marty Morrison and Darryl Driscoll. They were hilarious. Does Bugs Bunny’s Innnnterressssting Hairdresser count? Ernie Kovacs’ Percy Dovetonsils? ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/11 "2016-06-19T17:47:06Z")
[Love, Sidney](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Love,_Sidney) was a 1981 sitcom starring Tony Randall as an openly gay man. The 1967 version of _Dragnet_ once featured a brief appearance by a hairdresser with a pretty flamboyant manner. I believe he was helping Joe Friday and Bill Gannon identify a suspect who’d been in his salon. He offered his professional opinion that Joe would benefit from getting his hair cut by a “hair stylist”, but that Bill should stick with barbers. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/12 "2016-06-19T18:04:11Z")
In the TV movie that preceded the TV show _Love, Sidney_, it was explicitly stated that the main character was gay, while in the TV series itself, it was never explicitly mentioned that he was. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/13 "2016-06-19T18:23:34Z")
Two pre-Stonewall movies come to mind: _Victim_, 1961, starring Dirk Bogarde as a deeply closeted gay lawyer who goes after a blackmailer of many gay men, at the risk of exposing himself, which would have the direst consequences. Ahead of its time, it was a plea to repeal England’s anti-sodomy laws. _The Detective_, 1968, starring Frank Sinatra as a detective investigating the murder of a gay man. Near the end is a long monologue by William Windom’s gay character, full of self-hate, describing what led up to the murder. Not particularly ahead of its time, but at least the main gay character is rounded and not stereotypical, and generates some sympathy, or perhaps only pity. ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/14 "2016-06-19T18:33:49Z")
Some Like It Hot 1959 The end of the movie has the rich Osgood proposing to “Daphne” - when Daphne reveals herself to be a man, his response is “nobody’s perfect.” The movie is full of allusions, subtle enough to get over the censors. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/15 "2016-06-19T19:07:25Z")
Charlie Chaplin showed a gay prison inmate in **Modern Times**. Note [the guy two ahead of him](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ykdb8Zen-o#t=02m40s). There were often references to homosexuality in films, but they’re subtle. In one Fred Astaire movie, Edward Everett Horton (who was gay IRL) talks about how attractive he is to the ladies. Astaire says, in utter astonishment “You?” **The Boys in the Band** (1970) was the probably the first mainstream Hollywood movie where all the characters were gay (excerpt one, but there’s some question about that). ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/16 "2016-06-19T19:12:36Z")
Re: _Bringing Up Baby_. In addition to the use of “gay” as “homosexual,” later in the same scene Grant says, “I’m just waiting for a bus on 42nd Street.” According to George Chauncey’s _Gay New York_, gays in New York in the 20s (a time when Grant was living there) congregated around Times Square. If challenged by the police, they would claim to be waiting for a crosstown bus (e.g., one on 42nd Street). It was another code phrase of the time. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/17 "2016-06-19T19:22:39Z")
RealityChuck writes: \> Note the guy two ahead of him. To call this subtle is to put it mildly. Had you not mentioned this, I would never have guessed that it implied homosexuality. I’m still not sure what’s meant to be implied here. ---
**Author:** ![installLSC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/54ee81/32.png) [@installLSC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/installLSC)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/18 "2016-06-19T19:54:38Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > I don’t have time to watch the video you linked to, but from your description it doesn’t sound like it _is_ a portrayal of an LGBT character. A boy forced to live as a girl by his mother is not transgender. Then again, “forced feminization” (boy is forced by female figure to dress as a girl, then begins to like it) has long been a staple of TG fiction. I do understand your argument though. ---
**Author:** ![panache45](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/panache45/32/64_2.png) [@panache45](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panache45)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/19 "2016-06-19T19:56:55Z")
> [@Lamia](#): > > But there were depictions of LGBT characters in the American media long before 1968 – see _[The Celluloid Closet](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Celluloid_Closet)_ for examples from film. \*The Celluloid Closet \*is based on the book by the same name, by [Vito Russo](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vito_Russo). It’s a fascinating book, and I highly recommend it. Vito was a friend of mine when I lived in NYC, a remarkable man with a razor-sharp wit. Of everyone I knew who died of AIDS, he’s the one I miss the most. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2016, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/early-mainstream-media-portrayals-of-lgbt-characters/757771/20 "2016-06-19T20:02:37Z")
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