# Eat my shit George W. Bush **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 19, 2005, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237 "2005-12-19T02:07:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/141 "2005-12-20T12:38:19Z")
> [@John Carter of Mars](#): > > I called no-one a pussy. As best I can tell, you and Hentor are the only posters in this thread that called someone a pussy. I had no idea you BoBB’s felt so manhood-challenged. Next time I’ll try to avoid stepping on your little pink toesies. Why don’t you have the guts to just say what you mean, instead of saying things about having never played competitive sports or having pink toesies? How is it that competitive sports is the only place to learn about dealing with adversity? It’s not? Then what was your real point in bringing up competitive sports? Don’t be a simpering pussy - say what you mean. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 12:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/142 "2005-12-20T12:43:34Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Actually, I’m sick of Republicans, and I fervently wish the Democrats would be more serious and put up a credible fight. If I were American, I could easily see myself voting for Hillary or Joe Biden or another serious Democrat for President, hoping for a split government. I’m not sure Republicans play very nicely when they have the whole sandbox to themselves. Well, then, for someone so sick of Republicans, you sure have an odd interpretation of Bush’s “going out of his way” to accept responsibility. Color me unimpressed with your “critical” evaluation of the Republicans or thoughts about what the Democrats need to do about it. I’m quite glad you like Hillary or Joe Biden (why not Joe Lieberman anymore?), but the DLC Democrats are on their way out the door, and they can take their pablum-like appeals to the right with them. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/143 "2005-12-20T13:45:07Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > But then, [CNN’s most recent poll](http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/12/19/bush.poll/index.html) finds Bush getting no bump in the polls from his recent speeches and the elections in Iraq. Of course he didn’t… he pissed off the whole “Family Guy” demographic. Sheer political suicide. ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/144 "2005-12-20T14:22:05Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > Actually, I’ve been quiet as of late simply because I generally have no desire to debate with most of the people on the SDMB. Sorry, but that’s the way it is. My last foray into Great Debates ended with one of the usual suspects calling me a chickenhawk and demanding that I enlist in the military or shut up. Life is too short to put up with idiots like that, and I’m tired of fighting them. So I limit myself to the occasional comment where I think it’s appropriate, and prepare to abandon the thread as soon as the usual nonsense starts. It took you 14,000 posts to get to this point? Sheesh. I’ve felt the same way for quite some time now. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/145 "2005-12-20T14:24:16Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > I can’t believe anyone is upset about Family Guy. That show sucks big time. I think everyone from both sides of the aisle can come together in non-partisan cooperation to denounce this rediculous statement. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/146 "2005-12-20T14:45:46Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > Cheney’s welcome in Iraq during his supposedly surprise visit was not very enthusiastic. From what I can tell, he doesn’t give a damn about the troops. [That liberal commie rag Forbes reports](http://www.forbes.com/business/feeds/ap/2005/12/18/ap2400133.html) > [@](#): > > “From our perspective, we don’t see much as far as gains,” said Marine Cpl. Bradley Warren… Another Marine, Cpl. R.P. Zapella, asked, “Sir, what are the benefits of doing all this work to get Iraq on its feet?” … Shouts of “hooah!” from the audience interrupted Cheney a few times, but mostly the service members listened intently. When he delivered the applause line, “We’re in this fight to win. These colors don’t run,” the only sound was a lone whistle. ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/147 "2005-12-20T14:56:43Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Well, then, for someone so sick of Republicans, you sure have an odd interpretation of Bush’s “going out of his way” to accept responsibility. In that speech in particular, he took responsibility for the war twice. Look, my point wasn’t to show what a great guy Bush is. In fact, my point was that he \*wouldn’t have accepted responsibility if everything is going to hell in Iraq like most people on this board believe. The fact that he was explicitly taking responsibility in a nationwide speech seemed to me evidence that the administration believes the Iraq war is going to turn out well. > [@](#): > > Color me unimpressed with your “critical” evaluation of the Republicans or thoughts about what the Democrats need to do about it. Oh, you mean I don’t have the Hentor seal of approval of my thought process? Whatever will I do? > [@](#): > > I’m quite glad you like Hillary or Joe Biden (why not Joe Lieberman anymore?), I should have mentioned Lieberman first. I like the guy. He’s stood for what he believes in, even when the war was highly unpopular both with the public and within his own party. Say what you like about the war, but Joe Lieberman has integrity. > [@](#): > > but the DLC Democrats are on their way out the door, and they can take their pablum-like appeals to the right with them. I sure hope not, because if the Deaniac wing of the party takes over, the Republicans will stay in power for the next decade. And one thing you can learn from Canada is that it’s never very good for a Democracy when there is no opposition. But the one thing you can count on from the Democrats is to shoot themselves in the foot every time Bush gives them some ammo. You should stop doing that. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/148 "2005-12-20T15:13:07Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > I sure hope not, because if the Deaniac wing of the party takes over, the Republicans will stay in power for the next decade. I’m sure this advice (the Democrats will lose power if they don’t do [behavior X that aligns with the Republican party] would be more meaningful if there was at least one circumstance in which you didn’t say it. Since you always say it, one begins to suspect that there is no real evaluative process going on behind it. > [@](#): > > But the one thing you can count on from the Democrats is to shoot themselves in the foot every time Bush gives them some ammo. You should stop doing that. Actually, I would suggest that during the entire past year, the Democrats have been kicking Bush’s ass at every turn. Remember Social Security reform and the impending crisis that meant that privatization was the only way to go? Thanks again for your well-reasoned advice. I guess you’d say we shouldn’t say anything unpleasant about the whole domestic spying thing either. Boy, would we be shooting ourselves in the foot! Let’s hope Bush gets another bump up in the polls, so that you’ll be sure to come back and visit us again. Oh, I mean to say, it’s us mean Democrats who have been keeping you away, not the shame and the embarrassment that is the Republican party. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/149 "2005-12-20T15:13:24Z")
> [@Sam Stone](#): > > My last foray into Great Debates ended with one of the usual suspects calling me a chickenhawk and demanding that I enlist in the military or shut up. Interesting interpretation there. Cite? The increasing extent to which Bush loyalists have had to torture their arguments and/or venture into the world of imagination when participating in GD has indeed been notable, as has the number who have apparently been able to face reality and have stopped trying. There are always going to be some holdouts, though - I can picture a platoon of them on a Pacific island, like abandoned Japanese soldiers, still chanting “Bush didn’t lie us into a war! Saddam had WMD’s! Bush’s budget deficits are good! Those detainees \*needed \* torturing! 9/11 changed everything! _Banzai!_” ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/150 "2005-12-20T15:20:14Z")
Here’s what people mean when they say that Bush is a fucking liar. From the White House, via [Atrios](http://atrios.blogspot.com/2005_12_18_atrios_archive.html#113508617747970852): > [@Bush](#): > > Secondly, there are such things as roving wiretaps. Now, by the way, any time you hear the United States government talking about wiretap, it requires – a wiretap requires a court order. Nothing has changed, by the way. When we’re talking about chasing down terrorists, we’re talking about getting a court order before we do so. It’s important for our fellow citizens to understand, when you think Patriot Act, constitutional guarantees are in place when it comes to doing what is necessary to protect our homeland, because we value the Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/8edcca/32.png) [@Hentor\_the\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hentor_the_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/151 "2005-12-20T15:21:56Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Here’s what people mean when they say that Bush is a fucking liar.From the White House, via [Atrios](http://atrios.blogspot.com/2005_12_18_atrios_archive.html#113508617747970852): Sorry - to clarify, this speech was delivered on April 20, 2004. It was entitled “Information Sharing, Patriot Act Vital to Homeland Security” - Remarks by the President in a Conversation on the USA Patriot Act Kleinshans Music Hall, Buffalo, New York ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 6:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/152 "2005-12-20T18:24:33Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > The fuck they are. I know that because I took a class on polling as part of my Poly Sci major during an election year. Some types of polls are statistically valid, and with a fairly distributed sample you can get results that are indicative of what much larger groups of people think from a surprisingly small number of people polled. Straw polls and exit polls are not among the types of polls that have scientific or statistical validity. Do some homework before you spout off. I have. Lots of it. I have a bachelor’s in math and economics (you take stats classes in both), and a master’s in Operations Research. Do you want to refute anything _specific_ I said, like that exit polls are used to verify that elections are ‘clean’ abroad, or that no exit poll has ever been off like the ones were after the last election, or that before the last election, people from _both_ sides agreed they were valid, or do you just want to keep dismissing it all generally and vaguely? ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/153 "2005-12-20T19:44:16Z")
> [@bup](#): > > I have. Lots of it. I have a bachelor’s in math and economics (you take stats classes in both), and a master’s in Operations Research. > > Do you want to refute anything _specific_ I said, like that exit polls are used to verify that elections are ‘clean’ abroad, or that no exit poll has ever been off like the ones were after the last election, or that before the last election, people from _both_ sides agreed they were valid, or do you just want to keep dismissing it all generally and vaguely? There is no way to get a statistically representative sample of the voting population as a whole from an exit poll. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/154 "2005-12-20T19:51:17Z")
A river in Egypt, Dave. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/155 "2005-12-20T19:53:01Z")
As a further point of fact, the exit poll numbers that you are claiming are so wildly off the certified results only show a 4% difference in the results, interestingly enough Bob’s link that trumpets them makes no mention of the error margin for the poll, but a 4% margin of error for something as unscientific as an exit poll doesn’t seem unreasonable to me; even when you are able to make sure that your sample accurately reflects the demographic breakdown of the population as a whole you usually have a 3% margin of error or so. As a stats guy, you should be ashamed of yourself for perpetrating the lies, damn lies and statistics stereotype. In short, based upon your last post, you should know better. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/156 "2005-12-20T19:54:36Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > A river in Egypt, Dave. Blow me out of the water with facts or proof, Elvis. Oh, right, you don’t have any. If denial is a river in Egypt, where is delusion located? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/157 "2005-12-20T20:06:41Z")
Read an elementary statistics text first, Dave. Maybe somebody can help you with the big words. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/158 "2005-12-20T20:28:42Z")
> [@Weirddave](#): > > As a further point of fact, the exit poll numbers that you are claiming are so wildly off the certified results only show a 4% difference in the results, interestingly enough Bob’s link that trumpets them makes no mention of the error margin for the poll, but a 4% margin of error for something as unscientific as an exit poll doesn’t seem unreasonable to me; even when you are able to make sure that your sample accurately reflects the demographic breakdown of the population as a whole you usually have a 3% margin of error or so. As a stats guy, you should be ashamed of yourself for perpetrating the lies, damn lies and statistics stereotype. In short, based upon your last post, you should know better. So now you’re accusing me of deliberately misleading. Bite me. [An exit pollster himself for over 20 years, Saint Louis University professor of political science Ken Warren (2003) has never had an error greater than 2 percent, except one time – in a 1982 St. Louis primary. In that election, massive voter fraud was subsequently uncovered…](http://demiorator.blogspot.com/2005/01/still-analyzing-those-pesky-exit-polls.html) (warning: pdf) ["Thom Hartmann writes that in Germany…‘the news media’s exit polls, for two generations, have never been more than a tenth of a percent off…’](http://www.smith-family.com/hannah/archive/The_unexplained_exit_poll_discrepancy_v00l.pdf) [The National Election Data Archive (NEDA) is a nonprofit organization of statisticians and mathematicians devoted to the accuracy of U.S. vote counts… Exit polls have historically been accurate, in both the USA and abroad. Wherever **paper ballots are hand counted, they are typically within 1% of the exit polls, and this was the case in the USA in 2004**.](http://uscountvotes.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=111&Itemid=41) (emphasis mine) ---
**Author:** ![John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/2bfe46/32.png) [@John\_Carter\_of\_Mars](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Carter_of_Mars)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/159 "2005-12-20T21:15:17Z")
> [@Hentor the Barbarian](#): > > Why don’t you have the guts to just say what you mean, instead of saying things about having never played competitive sports or having pink toesies? \ Don’t be a simpering pussy - say what you mean. I already said exactly what I mean, **Hentor**. I said y’all are acting like a bunch of whining, griping, sore losers. You members of the BoBB (Brotherhood of Bush Bashers[sup]TM[/sup]) are acting like people that have never played on competitive sports teams and learned to deal with a loss. Right now, you should be “practicing” to get better. In this case, you should be working to develop a candidate that’s electable instead of wasting all this time and energy with crybaby shit about how the other guy cheated when you have no evidence that there was any cheating in ’00 or ’04. Is that clear enough for you, or does it step on your widdle, pink, crybaby toesies again? ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2005, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237/160 "2005-12-20T21:50:52Z")
> [@bup](#): > > So now you’re accusing me of deliberately misleading. Bite me. Well I wasn’t until I checked out those “cites” that you just linked. The first one is a blog, and therefore worthless. The second looked interesting, until I actually started to read it. I offer the following qualifying excerpts: "Author’s note: Given the timeliness of the subject matter, I have released this paper despite not having the opportunity to use normal academic safeguards. " " To hold it (the report) to an academic standard of rigor, however, requires extensive peer review; this work has barely begun to be challenged by and improved from this peer review process. I will revise the paper as legitimate objections are raised, as more data becomes available, and as I learn more" (_My note-no revisions appear to have been made since the November 2004 original publishing date_) " exit polls have not been academically studied" Furthermore, his conclusion is as follows: “My purpose in this paper has not been to allege election theft, let alone explain it. \ Systematic fraud or mistabulation is a premature conclusion, but the election’s unexplained exit poll discrepancies make it an unavoidable hypothesis, one that is the responsibility of the media, academia, polling agencies, and the public to investigate” The bulk of the paper is simply about how statistically unlikely several different outcomes of the election were, but makes no accusation that there was vote fraud or even claims to prove that there was, so we’re back to where I started All you’ve provided so far is speculation. I actually agree with the conclusion of the report in case you’re interested-investigate. Investigate long and investigate hard. However, here we are more than a year down the road from the election and so far, one thing as managed to escape the butterfly nets of the ardent conspiracy theorists…PROOF. Got any? The third cite needs a new web designer, but 20 minutes on their website turned up no evidence that they weren’t a partisan cite. Non-profit, yes, nowhere did I see any claims that it’s non-partisan. Nowhere did I see any proof offered there either, just the same type of hair brained speculation and nonsense as surrounds this issue like a cloud from the Democratic side. So, based upon what you offer as “cites”. I am now prepared to state that you are being deliberately misleading on this subject. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eat-my-shit-george-w-bush/336237.md?page=9)