# Ebay - my scam-sense is tingling. What do you think? **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [November 27, 2013, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949 "2013-11-27T20:27:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/1 "2013-11-27T20:27:49Z")
I sold a used laptop on eBay (working but without a hard drive - for spares/repair). The buyer didn’t pay straight away, so I sent an invoice after a couple of days as a reminder. No response, so after another couple of days, I sent another - and I got this response: > [@](#): > > hi > i want to pay you now, by the time you will be reading this , i would probably have already been paid, but i would like to ask you if i could arrange the postage since i dont trust the royal mail,or parcelforce for that matter,so is it possible to do that?, i am making the payment which will include the postage you calculated but since i am going to arrange the courier there is no point to be charged twice, so when you see the payment in if you could refund me the postage charges, since i am going to be paying ups, dhl, or fedex to bring it to me,looking forward to hearing from you, > regards My gut feeling on this is that something is amiss and this is the setup for a scam - maybe one of the following: Overpayment scam: Huge ‘accidental’ overpayment of the postage, which I refund out of my own account (because the payment doesn’t clear immediately), then the original payment is reversed because it was made on a stolen card or some such - and I’m out of pocket. or: A courier turns up and takes my laptop away, then the buyer claims it never arrived - and I have no tracking details to prove anything - eBay finds in favour of the buyer and refunds their payment in full. What do you think? ETA: the wording of “by the time you will be reading this , i would probably have already been paid” also screams ‘scammer’ to me. ---
**Author:** ![Inna\_Minnit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Inna\_Minnit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inna_Minnit)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/2 "2013-11-27T20:35:32Z")
How does a laptop work without a harddrive? I wouln’t ship without confirmed payment as agreed in hand. If it was a money order, I would wait until it cleared. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/3 "2013-11-27T20:40:22Z")
> [@Inna\_Minnit](#): > > How does a laptop work without a harddrive? The hard drive failed and was removed but everything else is in working order (tested by inserting a different hard drive) - sold with appropriate title and description including “Sold for parts/repair only, as no hard drive or OS is included.” ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/4 "2013-11-27T20:42:54Z")
> [@Inna\_Minnit](#): > > How does a laptop work without a harddrive? You turn it upside down and shake it to reboot. 😉 10 Internet points to those who recognize the source. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/5 "2013-11-27T20:45:23Z")
Sounds scammy. Why didn’t he email you _before_ he made the payment? If it was legit, he could have arranged to pay just for the laptop sans the delivery cost. Try the Ebay sellers page and ask them what the implications might be. ---
**Author:** ![Kimballkid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b5a626/32.png) [@Kimballkid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimballkid)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/6 "2013-11-27T20:46:54Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > You turn it upside down and shake it to reboot. 😉 > > 10 Internet points to those who recognize the source. Dilbert. We had that one on the wall in the break room for quite some time. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/7 "2013-11-27T20:48:40Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > Dilbert. We had that one on the wall in the break room for quite some time. On the nosie! ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2013, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/8 "2013-11-27T21:41:34Z")
The eBay seller community folks all agreed it’s highly irregular - at the very least unnecessary (as I can arrange a different courier if really required), and at worst, a probable setup for overpayment or claim of non-delivery scams. I’ve replied: > [@](#): > > Sorry - this is not an option. If you wish me to use some other method than RM or Parcelforce, I can arrange to send by that method myself. There is no need for complicated arrangements involving collections and refunds here. We’ll see what happens next… ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2013, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/9 "2013-11-28T02:51:35Z")
This couldn’t be more obviously a scam unless it were signed Scammy McScammerson. ---
**Author:** ![SpyOne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/82dd89/32.png) [@SpyOne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpyOne)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2013, 6:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/10 "2013-11-28T06:58:48Z")
Okay, smells scammish? Yes. Must be a scam? No. Either the buyer has limited English skills, or … No, the question is does he have a good excuse. As in: born in a country that doesn’t speak English is a good excuse, and “born in country that does speak English but couldn’t be bothered to learn how to do it right” is not. I think you’ve handled this decently: You will arrange shipping with a courier of his choice, with a refund of the difference if there is savings involved I assume, all to occur AFTER his payment has cleared. That this starts out with payment being late is not a good omen. ---
**Author:** ![usedtobe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ec9cab/32.png) [@usedtobe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/usedtobe)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2013, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/11 "2013-11-28T07:56:16Z")
I don’t remember ebay’s required dance-before-you-can-cancel-transaction, but findout what it is and dump this twit. I haven’t done ebay since this paypal scam has become universal. Above all else - get the money away from paypal the instant it arrives - it can take weeks for them to resolve even the most obvious scam/fraudulent claim. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2013, 8:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/12 "2013-11-28T08:03:15Z")
> [@Kimballkid](#): > > Dilbert. We had that one on the wall in the break room for quite some time. I’ve seen the [joke sheet around on the net](http://www.dr1.com/forums/clown-bin/27845-etch-sketch-replace-desktop-computers.html) since years and years ago, but I never knew if it originated with Dilbert. I guessed it had been around a lot longer. Did that _whole list_ of operating instructions appear in Dilbert strips? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 28, 2013, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/13 "2013-11-28T08:05:50Z")
> [@SpyOne](#): > > Okay, smells scammish? Yes. Must be a scam? No. > > Either the buyer has limited English skills, or … No, the question is does he have a good excuse. > As in: born in a country that doesn’t speak English is a good excuse, and “born in country that does speak English but couldn’t be bothered to learn how to do it right” is not. Agreed - the language thing is only an incidental detail and may mean nothing. The suspicious thing is the proposal. > [@](#): > > I think you’ve handled this decently: You will arrange shipping with a courier of his choice, with a refund of the difference if there is savings involved I assume, all to occur AFTER his payment has cleared. I’ll actually lose a couple of pounds on the shipping if I use one of the big name couriers - but I’m happy to absorb that out of the profit on the item. If the buyer pays, which I don’t feel hopeful about. > [@](#): > > That this starts out with payment being late is not a good omen. Could be waiting for payday at the end of the month - that _could_ be what is meant by the bit that says “by the time you will be reading this , i would probably have already been paid”. Or not. We’ll see. The NPB process kicks in after a couple more days. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/14 "2013-11-29T20:49:46Z")
So… no payment after the second invoice and no response to my message, so I opened a NPB case. Next day (today) the buyer paid, but it’s an ‘eCheque’ - which means it won’t clear into my account for 5 to 10 days (and PayPal advises not to part with the item until then). Plus I got a message from the buyer, saying: “hi i tried to pay you today but because you added postage it bumped up the payment so it was out of money, since i paid a deposit of 20 quid with the promise to pay the rest in full to the couriers to transport it, so why dont you please resend me the invoice but without the full postage fee, just charge me a 5 quid or something for the postage , or contact paypal and tell them you want to reduce postage and to go ahead with the echeque since with the reduced postage by 10 quid or so you get the 5er for the packing and i get to pay the laptop and the couriers to transport it, so could you please amend the postage charges and just keep 5 quid for the packing please, with utmost respect” So I think he’s trying to say that he’s already engaged the courier and can’t back out of that, so can I do some sort of jiggery-pokery. Not sure if this is just a broke, incompetent idiot who doesn’t understand that collection was not an option and negotiation is supposed to happen before the sale, or if it’s just someone who is trying to hustle me into thinking I’ve been paid for just long enough to let the item slip out of my hands. ---
**Author:** ![Rocketeer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocketeer/32/4437_2.png) [@Rocketeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rocketeer)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/15 "2013-11-29T22:13:56Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > So… no payment after the second invoice and no response to my message, so I opened a NPB case. > > Next day (today) the buyer paid, but it’s an ‘eCheque’ - which means it won’t clear into my account for 5 to 10 days (and PayPal advises not to part with the item until then). > > Plus I got a message from the buyer, saying: “hi > i tried to pay you today but because you added postage it bumped up the payment so it was out of money, since i paid a deposit of 20 quid with the promise to pay the rest in full to the couriers to transport it, so why dont you please resend me the invoice but without the full postage fee, just charge me a 5 quid or something for the postage , or contact paypal and tell them you want to reduce postage and to go ahead with the echeque since with the reduced postage by 10 quid or so you get the 5er for the packing and i get to pay the laptop and the couriers to transport it, so could you please amend the postage charges and just keep 5 quid for the packing please, > with utmost respect” > > So I think he’s trying to say that he’s already engaged the courier and can’t back out of that, so can I do some sort of jiggery-pokery. > > Not sure if this is just a broke, incompetent idiot who doesn’t understand that collection was not an option and negotiation is supposed to happen before the sale, or if it’s just someone who is trying to hustle me into thinking I’ve been paid for just long enough to let the item slip out of my hands. Good heavens. I’d back out of that deal as fast as i could, if I were you. ---
**Author:** ![running\_coach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/running_coach/32/15836_2.png) [@running\_coach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/running_coach)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/16 "2013-11-29T22:24:09Z")
> [@Mangetout](#): > > **Not sure if this is just a broke, incompetent idiot who doesn’t understand that collection was not an option and negotiation is supposed to happen before the sale** , or if it’s just someone who is trying to hustle me into thinking I’ve been paid for just long enough to let the item slip out of my hands. That’s what he want’s you to believe. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/17 "2013-11-29T22:30:21Z")
Yeah - got to be, really, the £20 deposit story just sounds like bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 10:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/18 "2013-11-29T22:45:53Z")
I’ve sold thousands and thousands of items in the US and never had someone arrange and pay for pick up vs my simply shipping it. If your feedback is solid why in the world would they do that? It makes no sense. Is this paid for pick up something ebay buyers do regularly in the UK? ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [November 29, 2013, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/19 "2013-11-29T22:58:47Z")
> [@astro](#): > > I’ve sold thousands and thousands of items in the US and never had someone arrange and pay for pick up vs my simply shipping it. If your feedback is solid why in the world would they do that? It makes no sense. Is this paid for pick up something ebay buyers do regularly in the UK? Not that I know of. I mean, it’s quite possible to arrange for a courier to go and pick up something and bring it to you - I’ve heard of eBay buyers doing it for heavy items that are sold as ‘collection in person only’, but I’m pretty sure I’m just being hustled here. ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [December 1, 2013, 11:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949/20 "2013-12-01T11:18:35Z")
Well, it looks like I got shafted. After several rounds of discussion where the buyer was ranting at me for being unreasonable and demanding (while I was just civilly pointing out that collection is not an option), he asked to cancel the transaction, saying that there’s no point in me sending it to his home address, as he’s not there and the parcel would just be returned. So I refunded the PayPal eCheque (before it even hit my account) - no problem. He then paid again, the full amount (balance this time, not eCheque), asking me to refund it (and reiterating that there’s no point in me sending it, as it would be returned). I refunded, but his payment closed the eBay dispute case, so now I don’t get my final value fees refunded. OK, I still have the item, but I just paid about 20% of its value to eBay for nothing. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebay-my-scam-sense-is-tingling-what-do-you-think/674949.md?page=2)