# Ebola quarantines, good or bad? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 29, 2014, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904 "2014-10-29T14:06:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/41 "2014-10-31T18:34:35Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Hickox has whined about everything else but you believe she forgot to mention she was cold because it was so obvious to you??? Complaining about inhumane or illegal treatment is not “whining”. Also, apparently we consult different news sources because on more than one being cold was mentioned. Aside from that - I’m sorry, sleeping in a paper gown in an unheated tent in a parking lot in New Jersy this time of year is cold. Unless you’ve live on the equator all your life and therefore have no experience with temperate climates you shouldn’t need that explained to you. A judge has now officially ruled that Hickox does not need to be locked up or confined, which implies the original involuntary restraint in said tent was completely unnecessary. But hey, keep trying to maintain that protesting the violation of human and civil rights is “whining”. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/42 "2014-10-31T18:39:07Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > The NJ Hickox’s case was the result of a very recent procedural change and Hickox was the first person that met the updated criteria. Hickox has also forced the Maine court system to deal with her self-serving bullshit. Going to court to maintain your right to NOT be locked up against your will is hardly “self-serving bullshit”. There is no medical or scientific reason for her to be confined in either her home OR a tent in a New Jersey parking lot. Thank Og the judge is capable of reason as so many other people seem unable to use it. New Jersey’s “update” was based on fear and politics, not medicine and science, and therefore should be trashed for something more rational. > [@](#): > > As I understood it, the CDC had also been monitoring the people who flew with the nurse that the CDC had originally said it was OK for her to fly. Yes, largely because of the shit-storm of hysteria induced by the media trying to sell fear and cornflakes. By the way - everyone of those people is healthy and without Ebola. Gee, I guess the nurse wasn’t infectious after all. > [@](#): > > Even after the nurse informed the CDC that she wasn’t feeling well. Mistakes have been made. This ebola-in-the-USA is a really new experience and people are feeling their way along. And some of them are giving in to irrational fear and hysteria. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/43 "2014-10-31T18:40:09Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Works for me. I just wouldn’t want them to parade in my town. As far as I’m concerned they’re welcome in mine. ---
**Author:** ![dracoi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90db22/32.png) [@dracoi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dracoi)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/44 "2014-10-31T18:49:16Z")
No, except as medically reasonable. I believe that people showing no symptoms can be monitored, perhaps with a combination of self-monitoring and doctor-assisted monitoring. (For example, self monitor for two days, check in with a doctor each third day. This gets you some third-party verification that monitoring is being done, without putting a particularly large burden on anyone.) As they are not yet infectious (or even known to be infected) there is no reason to quarantine them. Of course, once a person is known to be infected, then they need to be kept isolated until no longer infectious. I think Hickox’s complaints come off as a little self-righteous and shrill to my ears. The state does have a fundamental right to protect public health and quarantines are a valid method… but we come back to my opening provision:\* if medically reasonable\*. The medical science doesn’t make it necessary to quarantine her if she can be properly monitored, and therefore I agree with her to the extent that she should not have been quarantined in that manner at that time. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/45 "2014-10-31T19:07:43Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > …New Jersey’s “update” was based on fear and politics, not medicine and science, and therefore should be trashed for something more rational. > Yes, largely because of the shit-storm of hysteria induced by the media trying to sell fear and cornflakes. > > By the way - everyone of those people is healthy and without Ebola. Gee, I guess the nurse wasn’t infectious after all. > And some of them are giving in to irrational fear and hysteria. (post shortened) The NJ update was again updated and Hickox was allowed to travel to Maine. This whole media-induced debacle is still a work in progress. One Maine judge rules in favor of a quarantine and another Maine judge rules that the state can’t quarantine. :smack: I wonder if these judges were presented with the same evidence and arguments? ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/46 "2014-10-31T19:08:48Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > As far as I’m concerned they’re welcome in mine. Good for you. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/47 "2014-10-31T19:18:06Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > … > A judge has now officially ruled that Hickox does not need to be locked up or confined, **which implies the original involuntary restraint in said tent was completely unnecessary.** … The one does not imply the other. If the state’s version of events is to be believed then someone who 1)was in close contact with known Ebola patients and 2)who is within the incubation period of the disease and 3)who arrived from a region where Ebola is being transmitted and 4)who had a fever, was being quarantined. Obviously nurse Hickox disputes point #4, but I believe the other points are not in dispute. Other health care workers in West Africa have been sickened and and may have acquired such infection outside the clinic setting. It is well documented that there is substantial variation in temperature in Ebola patients. They do not always have an elevated fever that stays high. A quarantine is holding a person for evaluation. If proven infectious then that person may be placed in isolation. Holding a patient who does meet points #1-4 above until it can be ascertained whether the person has the disease is, IMHO, not unwarranted. In the case of Ebola other symptoms would soon be expected if a patient truly has a fever caused by the disease. But they do need to hold such person in reasonable conditions. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2014, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/48 "2014-10-31T22:44:03Z")
> [@Iggy](#): > > If the state’s version of events is to be believed then someone who 1)was in close contact with known Ebola patients and 2)who is within the incubation period of the disease and 3)who arrived from a region where Ebola is being transmitted and 4)who had a fever, was being quarantined. > > Obviously nurse Hickox disputes point #4, but I believe the other points are not in dispute. Those other three points do not justify involuntary quarantine. The “fever” Hickox had at the airport was detected with an instrument of limited liability (which is why she requested a re-test with a more reliable oral thermometer, which did not occur until after she was put into isolation) and did not reach the 100.4 F threshold recommended by the CDC and was entirely consistent with the “fever” that high emotion (such as being held involuntarily) can cause. _If she had actually been sick_ she would have had an ACTUAL temperature when retested with a reliable instrument and maintained a fever. Which she did not. Which means she was never sick and never should have been confined against her will. The conditions under which she was kept in New Jersey were just salt in the wound. > [@](#): > > A quarantine is holding a person for evaluation. If proven infectious then that person may be placed in isolation. Incorrect. She was put _directly into isolation_ before any medical person could perform an actual evaluation. It was politically and fear motivated. > [@](#): > > But they do need to hold such person in reasonable conditions. On this we agree. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/49 "2014-11-03T22:25:05Z")
What qualifies me to vote? What qualifies MOST of us to vote? Could it be… nothing? ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/50 "2014-11-03T23:39:27Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > … > > _If she had actually been sick_ she would have had an ACTUAL temperature when retested with a reliable instrument \*\*and maintained a fever. \*\* Which she did not. Which means she was never sick and never should have been confined against her will. How does a state health official in charge of public health matters determine if a patient “maintained a fever” if there are not multiple readings over time? They could just send them on their way and ask them to call if they feel ill. But public health officials have to judge potential risk to the public in such circumstances. And given that Ebola patients can have temperature swings between feverish and below normal, how would they know that the initial reading is faulty if not for multiple readings over time? Hickox stated that she intended not to comply with state officials. Why would the public health official then believe that she would comply with self-monitoring? > [@Broomstick](#): > > > [@Iggy](#): > > > > A quarantine is holding a person for evaluation. If proven infectious then that person may be placed in isolation. > > Incorrect. She was put _directly into isolation_ before any medical person could perform an actual evaluation. It was politically and fear motivated. You have it wrong again. To quote the [CDC](http://www.cdc.gov/quarantine/)… > [@](#): > > ``` > **Isolation** separates sick people with a contagious disease from people who are not sick. > **Quarantine** separates and restricts the movement of people who were exposed to a contagious disease to see if they become sick. > > ``` Health and Human Services [elaborates](http://www.hhs.gov/answers/public-health-safety/dealing-with-communicable-disease/isolation-quarantine-differences.html) > [@](#): > > \*\*Isolation \*\*is used to separate ill persons who have a communicable disease from those who are healthy. Isolation restricts the movement of ill persons to help stop the spread of certain diseases. For example, hospitals use isolation for patients with infectious tuberculosis. > > \*\*Quarantine \*\*is used to separate and restrict the movement of well persons who may have been exposed to a communicable disease to see if they become ill. These people may have been exposed to a disease and do not know it, or they may have the disease but do not show symptoms. Quarantine can also help limit the spread of communicable disease. So the term \*\*isolation \*\*is only used when dealing with persons known to be ill. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2014, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/51 "2014-11-03T23:56:22Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > I personally think we made the mistake in allowing **any** ebola patients back to the US. Kent Brantley, should have been treated at a US military hospital outside of the US. His successful recovery in the US was probably one of the worst things that could have happened for our own security. People that contract the disease will now take extraordinary steps to come to the US, as that is where you can be cured. They will lie about their circumstances to get to the US for treatment…see Duncan in Dallas. This puts more people, even those that didn’t sign up to personally expose themselves to this disease, at risk. I’m surprised that all of the people who contracted it in Africa were brought back here, and not taken to the Hospital for Tropical Diseases in London, or a similar facility in Antwerp. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2014, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904/52 "2014-11-04T02:16:15Z")
I love it that the those who complain that the new Ebola Czar has no scientific/medical expertise turn around reject advice on quarantines from those who do have the expertise. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ebola-quarantines-good-or-bad/702904.md?page=2)