# Edward the VIII - Abdication **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 19, 2014, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520 "2014-07-19T10:18:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Rick\_Kitchen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rick_kitchen/32/522_2.png) [@Rick\_Kitchen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick_Kitchen)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2014, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/61 "2014-07-25T01:52:50Z")
The children of Charles I’s daughter Henrietta were excluded, although only her daughter Anne Marie d’Orleans had children. Anne Marie’s descendants included Louis XV of France and Ferdinand VI of Spain. ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2014, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/62 "2014-07-25T02:10:35Z")
Issue of James VII and II: In addition to Mary and Anne, in 1689 James II had 2 living legitimate children - James (the “Old Pretender”), and Louisa (who died unmarried). The younger James later had two children of his own. Issue of Charles II: Charles II had at least a dozen children, nearly all still living in 1689, but none of them were legitimate. Issue of Charles I: Apart from Charles II and James II, Charles I had two children who themselves had children - Mary, who married into the House of Orange and was the mother of William III, and Henrietta, who married into the House of Orleans. She was dead by 1689 but had two living children, one of whom had married into the House of Savoy and already had two living children of her own. She went on to have several more. Issue of James VI and I: James I had had seven children, one of whom was Charles I. Five died without issue, mostly in infancy, and seventh, Elizabeth, married the Elector Frederick V and had numerous issue. Sophia, who was named as successor to the Crown in the Act of Settlement of 1701, was Elizabeth’s twelfth child; Sophia’s surviving older siblings, and all their issue, would have had a stronger dynastic claim than she did. As it happens, only one of her older siblings was alive by 1689 - Louise Hollandine, and not only had she become a Catholic but she had become a nun. But there were numerous living children and grandchildren of her deceased brother Charles Louis of the Palatinate, and of her deceased brother Edward of the Palatinate. Charles Louis had seventeen children, all of whom were either illegitimate, died childless or married into Catholic families; Edward became a Catholic and had three Catholic children. So that was the position in 1689. In a nutshell (apart from the descendants of James II) the House of Savoy descendants of Charles I, the descendants of Charles Louis of the Palatinate and the descendants of Edward of the Palatinate all had stronger dynastic claims than Sophia and her descendants. By the time Anne died, 18 years later, all three groups were thoroughly Catholic (so far as legitimate issue were concerned) and had become quite numerous. ---
**Author:** ![Malden\_Capell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malden_capell/32/5274_2.png) [@Malden\_Capell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malden_Capell)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2014, 6:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/63 "2014-07-25T06:35:03Z")
> [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](#): > > Plus, the desire for penny pinching spending decisions. Both political parties were largely in favour of the admittedly noble desire to spend money on the British electorate rather than spend it on “wasteful” rearmament. Its harder to get re-elected when you are spending money on bombs rather than “butter”. Never underestimate a politicians desire to be hoodwinked into an economic or political self serving act. If your political radar tells you to spend money on the electorate then you can easily convince yourself of appeasement. An awful lot of that blinkering was due to short term electoral decisions than any strategic foreign policy judgement. Appeasement was a wonderful mixture of noble ideals and sordid self interest. Exactly where the line was drawn between these two pressures only those who practised Appeasement truly know. Thankyou! That’s exactly what I was driving at 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Dangerosa](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Dangerosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dangerosa)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2014, 11:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/64 "2014-07-25T11:32:56Z")
> [@UDS](#): > > Issue of James VII and II: In addition to Mary and Anne, in 1689 James II had 2 living legitimate children - James (the “Old Pretender”), and Louisa (who died unmarried). The younger James later had two children of his own. > > Issue of Charles II: Charles II had at least a dozen children, nearly all still living in 1689, but none of them were legitimate. > > Issue of Charles I: Apart from Charles II and James II, Charles I had two children who themselves had children - Mary, who married into the House of Orange and was the mother of William III, and Henrietta, who married into the House of Orleans. She was dead by 1689 but had two living children, one of whom had married into the House of Savoy and already had two living children of her own. She went on to have several more. > > Issue of James VI and I: James I had had seven children, one of whom was Charles I. Five died without issue, mostly in infancy, and seventh, Elizabeth, married the Elector Frederick V and had numerous issue. Sophia, who was named as successor to the Crown in the Act of Settlement of 1701, was Elizabeth’s twelfth child; Sophia’s surviving older siblings, and all their issue, would have had a stronger dynastic claim than she did. As it happens, only one of her older siblings was alive by 1689 - Louise Hollandine, and not only had she become a Catholic but she had become a nun. But there were numerous living children and grandchildren of her deceased brother Charles Louis of the Palatinate, and of her deceased brother Edward of the Palatinate. Charles Louis had seventeen children, all of whom were either illegitimate, died childless or married into Catholic families; Edward became a Catholic and had three Catholic children. > > So that was the position in 1689. In a nutshell (apart from the descendants of James II) the House of Savoy descendants of Charles I, the descendants of Charles Louis of the Palatinate and the descendants of Edward of the Palatinate all had stronger dynastic claims than Sophia and her descendants. By the time Anne died, 18 years later, all three groups were thoroughly Catholic (so far as legitimate issue were concerned) and had become quite numerous. Thanks. I couldn’t google up a decent family tree that would trace descendants for me. I found Henrietta and her children. But I missed Sophia’s siblings. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 25, 2014, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/65 "2014-07-25T19:57:13Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Churchill was, for a man who was brilliant in many respect, a remarkably erratic judge of character. Roy Jenkins, in his masterful bio, quotes a 10 Downing Street aide who said, “When Churchill was right, there was no one better. But when he was wrong,\* my God!”\* > [@Rick\_Kitchen](#): > > …Charlotte, Princess of Wales, was the only legitimate child of George IV to live to maturity… She was Princess Charlotte of Wales, not “Charlotte, Princess of Wales,” right? The latter would suggest she were either Princess of Wales by marriage (as her mother was), or divorced from the Prince of Wales (as the former Lady Diana was). She took her title from her father, who was Prince of Wales: [Princess Charlotte of Wales - Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Princess_Charlotte_of_Wales) ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2018, 8:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/66 "2018-08-13T08:53:59Z")
Yes she was, correct. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2018, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/67 "2018-08-13T08:59:22Z")
:smack: Replied without realising this was an old thread. Sorry guys. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2018, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520/68 "2018-08-13T21:07:49Z")
No worries. Nice to be backed up, even four years later. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/edward-the-viii-abdication/693520.md?page=3)