# Election 2004 is cancelled **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 15, 2003, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872 "2003-04-15T14:02:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/41 "2003-04-15T19:42:30Z")
You guys are missing out on the real question. What if all the anti-war protestors got up and started buring our churches, forcing women to get abortions, outlawing christianity, and converting our children to homosexuality? Unlikely I know. But if the anti-war people DID do that, what would you do? Would you try to stop them from destroying America? Or would you simply go along with the liberal threat to our way of life? I think my speculation proves that anti-war protestors are a threat to America, and should be rounded up and put in camps so that they cannot enact their godless agenda. After all, if they would do such things, they MUST be evil, right? ---
**Author:** ![scotandrsn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a4c791/32.png) [@scotandrsn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotandrsn)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 7:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/42 "2003-04-15T19:54:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by El\_Kabong \* > \*\* If you are simply trolling for chances to chastise people over what you deem to be a lack of engagement with government, then look eslewhere. \*\* Not looking to chastise, just finding out how people feel. This thread never really got off the ground the way I’d hoped. I stepped on partisan toes, and got some important facts wrong. Try [this one](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=177508) instead. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/43 "2003-04-15T19:59:43Z")
Certainly the state legislature can choose its electors in any way it prefers, down to having them go at it with quarterstaffs on a bridge across a stream in a state park – the winners being those who avoid getting toppled into the water. (Charging admission to watch this might be a good way to improve the state finances!) However, one small problem lies in the failure to permit a popular vote to choose the electors – the state loses its representation in the House: > [@](#): > > Section 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several states according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each state, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the executive and judicial officers of a state, or the members of the legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such state, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime, the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such state. (Article of Amendment XIV; the male citizens 21 years of age has been modified to citizens 18 years of age by two later amendments.) And there would be 49 states prepared to insist that the penalty be imposed – it gives them more representatives. (I’m thinking of Utah’s protest against N.C. after the last census as a good example of the extent to which they will push the issue.) As for my senators and representative, Bob Etheridge is the latter, and as a good moderate Democrat, he would be raising the roof about the cancellation of elections – and I need not say what office Liddy and John aspire to and how they’d react to having it placed out of their reach, need I? 🙂 In all seriousness, what makes this such a ridiculous hypothetical is GWB’s own personality – I’m sure he sees himself as a white knight leading the forces of goodness against the Axis of Evil – but he’s also been surprisingly moderate in many ways, not kowtowing to the extreme right wing of his own party but within his own personal ideology trying to do the “big tent” thing. (A high member of his staff met with HRC recently, and the religious right were outraged – “He’s supposed to listen to us, not them!” was what their remarks boiled down to. ---
**Author:** ![SwimmingwithChickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@SwimmingwithChickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SwimmingwithChickens)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/44 "2003-04-15T20:28:06Z")
Since my first reply disappeared, I’ll try again… First question: Is this thread (as well as some of Scot’s other threads) an attempt to start a flame war? Shouldn’t this sort of thread be in IMHO?? Second question: How old are you Scot? Have you taken a government class in high school? Third question: Not to pick on CA, but since it’s Scot’s current location, but do people there honestly believe that’s where the country is headed? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Raven\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@The\_Raven\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Raven_1)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/45 "2003-04-15T20:34:38Z")
Fourth question: If **SwimmingwithChickens** were to collide with **RunningwithScissors** , would we end up with a pool full of chicken soup? 😃 -Rav ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/46 "2003-04-15T20:42:39Z")
> [@](#): > > I think my speculation proves that anti-war protestors are a threat to America, and should be rounded up and put in camps so that they cannot enact their godless agenda. Well, OK, I’ll go, as long as there’s volleyball. And canoeing. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 15, 2003, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/47 "2003-04-15T21:47:46Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Polycarp \* > \*\* (A high member of his staff met with HRC recently, and the religious right were outraged – “He’s supposed to listen to us, not them!” was what their remarks boiled down to. \*\* I think it was the Chairman of the RNC. Some of those comments were funny, though…🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 1:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/48 "2003-04-16T01:05:25Z")
> [@](#): > > Let’s pretend (I’m not saying it WOULD happen, but let’s pretend) that the Justice Department, with Bush’s blessing, announces that, given the extraordinary circumstances, will not seek to pressure any of these states into holding elections, and they can assign the offices as proposed. > > What would you personally want to happen in this situation, and what would you do to make it happen? I would work to assist the flying purple monkeys who would come down from the planet Zarkon to impose benevolent dictatorship and distribute free pudding to all. Then I would go shopping for new shoes, vacuum the living room, and set up a puppet government headed by my sister’s Golden Labrador. What exactly is the purpose of these scenarios? What would you do in case of alien invasion? What if the law of gravity is revoked every second Wednesday? What if Michael Jackson turns out to be the love child of Elvis and Bigfoot? The advantage of fantasy is the same as the disadvantage. The laws of probability don’t apply. There is effectively zero chance that Bush will suspend elections. There is effectively zero chance that anyone would abide by a decision by him to do so. There is effectively zero chance that the Justice Department or any Republican in Congress or any state government who would support him. The Supreme Court would instantly overturn such a decision, the military would not act in obedience to enforce such a decision, and every voter in America would reject the idea out of hand. So why are you fretting about it? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/49 "2003-04-16T01:37:31Z")
> [@](#): > > So why are you fretting about it? Because, **Shodan** , to any good Liberal or any good Conservative, the guys on the other side are pure eeee-villll, out to destroy American [values/freedom – (select the proper term for your protest)] and not caring a whit for the rights of the opposition. I think you and I ought to protest – we didn’t get the memo announcing this! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Governor\_Quinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@Governor\_Quinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Governor_Quinn)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/50 "2003-04-16T03:14:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by SwimmingwithChickens \* > \*\* > Not to pick on CA, but since it’s Scot’s current location, but do people there honestly believe that’s where the country is headed? \*\* As a resident of California, I can honestly say that that view is not a common one. It won’t happen. Why would the Reps cancel an election that they plan to (and, especially with the House, probably will) win? ---
**Author:** ![Fenris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fenris/32/498_2.png) [@Fenris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fenris)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/51 "2003-04-16T03:38:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by scotandrsn \* > \*\*An elected official up for re-election who has direct control of polling procedures your voting district announces, citing moderately compelling reasons, that the democratic process must be suspended in favor of the broader interests of the community. > > Remember, we’re just playing “Think about the unthinkable” here. > > What is your PERSONAL reaction? What do you think? what action do you take? > > ESPECIALLY if the official is someone you currently support? \*\* You want “Think the unthinkable”? As long as we’re playing “Let’s make believe!”, let’s actually use our imaginations! My personal take on your scenario is as follows: I’d use this crisis to spring into action. As last surviving person from the planet Krypton, I’ve grown up on Earth with powers and abilities far beyond those of normal men. Having rewoven the baby-blankets that wrapped me in the rocket as it hurled through the void towards Earth into an eye-catching costume, I publically reveal myself. I casually hurl the Constitution-breaking bastards from their false seats of power, restoring the elections and bringing **TRUTH, JUSTICE, AND THE AMERICAN WAY!** back to the people. Thrilled by this, the people, as one, vote for a constitutional ammendment to suspend (for me only) the “have to be born a U.S. citizen”\* bit in the constitution and I’m elected president of the United States, getting a 99% turnout (of eligible voters) and of that 99%, capturing 99% of that (giving me every electoral vote: the only demographics I didn’t sweep were the “manical bald scientist” group and the “5th dimensional imp” demo.) Once in power, I parlay my ability to solve the national debt by using a combination of super strength and heat vision to turn plain coal into diamonds. I also use my X-Ray vision to find sunken pirate treasure. I not only balance the budget but have so much of a surplus that we not only have guns AND butter, we also have rifles and mocha-hazelnut frappes for EVERYONE! Then, once the masses are lulled into a false sense of security, my reign of terror will begin. First, I pass a law forbidding any woman to wear lead-lined underwear… Super-Fenris \*cause I’m using the Earth-One version, not the Byrne version, that’s why. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/52 "2003-04-16T18:37:11Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Polycarp \* > \*\*Because, **Shodan** , to any good Liberal or any good Conservative, the guys on the other side are pure eeee-villll, out to destroy American [values/freedom – (select the proper term for your protest)] and not caring a whit for the rights of the opposition. > > I think you and I ought to protest – we didn’t get the memo announcing this! 🙂 \*\* Actually, **Polycarp** , I don’t mind that part. As a proud member of the Vast, Right-Wing Conspiracy, I take pride in my commitment to bringing an end to the rights of anyone who disagrees with me in the slightest. But these bizarre scenarios annoy me. We don’t get enough information. It’s like what they used to do in fourth grade - "What if you had to choose between eating a cow flop and dropping a live wolverine into your undershorts? " I need more context than that before I can choose. For a coup as predicated to last longer than a lunch break, there has to be some kind of popular support, or else an occupying force (either foreign or domestic) to enforce the dictatorship. The OP rules out invasion, and as a conservative, I have never met any conservative - literally never - who advocated a change to a dictatorship in the US. Maybe I don’t get out as much as I should, but I cannot believe there are vast numbers of secret fascists in the US. Therefore an announcement that elections had been suspended would be met (IMO) with a mixture of incredulity, annoyance, and the automatic expectation that whoever attempted it would be in custody somewhat sooner than convenient. And suggestions that the Republicans (or Democrats if Clinton had tried it) would go along with it is ludicrous. Not a single member of Congress would consider it for a split second. This is especially so, because the OP suggests that the suspension of elections happened for “moderately compelling reasons”. This is simply impossible. And anyone who thinks that there is any chance that Republicans would go for it, or Americans would accept it, is so far out of touch as to be delusional. So if you can have your delusions, I can have them about flying monkeys as well. (On preview, **Super-Fenris** has my vote to resolve the crisis. Although I would recommend against basing the currency on diamonds - too much power to the DeBeers Company. Instead, use your super-powers to build a solar energy collection array around the sun, and beam unlimited cheap energy via microwaves back to earth. Although I would begin work on my idea for a Kryptonite-lined IUD for Lois Lane at once. Call me mad, would you? I’ll show them who’s mad! Bwahahahaha!) Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/53 "2003-04-16T18:46:02Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by scotandrsn \* > \*\*Interesting. I’ll take you at your word. What would you do for food, how would you keep tabs on what going on outside of your hiding place, and how many people would be there with you? \*\* Don’t take me too seriously. I don’t think the conditions in the US are anywhere near allowing an attempt at a ham-handed junta. I like that, “ham-handed junta.” Anyway, who the hell knows? I’d probably get shot by a federale the first week. Rebellions suck for the rebels. They have all the sattelites and tanks. We’d just have the mountains. ---
**Author:** ![Beagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/85f322/32.png) [@Beagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beagle)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/54 "2003-04-16T18:53:09Z")
My kingdom for a spell checker. Anyway, would anyone let the president cancel elections for a good reason,\* much less a pretext? I’d rather be one of the people who died fighting. Seriously. \*Ah… ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/55 "2003-04-16T19:20:21Z")
This is a silly scenario, but if you want a serious answer, I probably would just stay home and bitch. I mean, I wouldn’t like it, but I really don’t see myself going all rebel. The poor vision and poor coordination would mean I couldn’t really hit anybody with a bullet, the hay fever would mean camping in the mountains wouldn’t be fun, and the morbid obesity would mean that I can’t run from the police or army coming to arrest me. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2003, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/56 "2003-04-16T20:28:59Z")
> [@](#): > > Maybe I don’t get out as much as I should, but I cannot believe there are vast numbers of secret fascists in the US. I do believe you’ve written yourself a .sig line here, my friend! 🙂 Seriously, I think that the incremental demonization and factionalization of this country is really getting absurd. I played **Scot** ’s game in the same way as I answered the Adam and Eve’s children in Eden question – as an interesting hypothetical exercise, or a “What would happen if the Supreme Court declared the Civil Rights Act of 1964 unconstitutional – retroactively to when it was passed?” debate. But I’m a liberal (not card carrying, unfortunately, if you don’t count my Social Security card! ;)) and I have to agree with you that conservatives are just people who see things differently than I do but are motivated by what they see as the common good. And I’d hope that the same could be said by many a conservative about us left-wing radical pinkos out to destroy American values wholesale.\* Me, if any of this happens, I will just cool it, make my way to Colorado, where **Fenris** will of course have found the Citadel, and then proclaim myself as the Chief Prophet of Og the Mighty. We’ll see how long GWB can resist a combination of good old American razzle-dazzle and the magnetogravitic spectrum. (The OP said to use our imaginations!) - Well, really, we’re working it retail – the old Fabian thing, you know! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Raven\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@The\_Raven\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Raven_1)\ **Post date:** [April 23, 2003, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872/57 "2003-04-23T14:38:55Z")
Hold on jes’ a minute there, folks… Now I bet you thought this was all monkeyshines, didn’'t you? Now I’m a-gonna tell you, down heah in Alabammy, we are gonna circumvent the electorial procedure by moving that there primary election back befoah the Republican Con-vention, therefore relegating that “Shrub” character to a write-in candidacy. [http://www.nbc5.com/news/2152634/detail.html](http://www.nbc5.com/news/2152634/detail.html) -Rav [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-2004-is-cancelled/168872.md?page=2)