# Election Day \[Week\]\[Month\[s\]\] \[Year\] 2020 follow-along thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [November 3, 2020, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618 "2020-11-03T05:36:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 372
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7435 "2020-12-06T04:08:53Z")
That, unfortunately, is as shocking to hear as: Trump had breakfast this morning. ---
**Author:** ![Deeg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/deeg/32/2955_2.png) [@Deeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deeg)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7436 "2020-12-06T04:14:56Z")
According to the article on Fox the governor does not have that authority, although the Sec of State does. Trump is so stupid he called the wrong pol. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7437 "2020-12-06T04:17:45Z")
Or Trump is smart enough to know the Georgia SoS is unlikely to take his call at this point AND even less likely to consider doing this for a hot second. And I’m not so sure how likely I am to believe an article on Fox about this. Any chance you could share a link? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7438 "2020-12-06T04:24:27Z")
There’s an article on WaPo but it’s paywalled: > **[Trump calls Georgia governor to pressure him for help overturning Biden’s win...](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-kemp-call-georgia/2020/12/05/fd8d677c-3721-11eb-8d38-6aea1adb3839_story.html)** > > Georgia Gov. Brian Kemp declined the entreaty from Trump, which came hours before the president held a rally in Georgia on behalf of the state’s two GOP senators. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7439 "2020-12-06T04:29:49Z")
I suspect it’s Republican politicians being politicians and not wanting the loose cannon lame duck gorilla perched atop their party to wreck the GA runoffs before leaving town in January, which they all know he is destined to do. Seems to me that if you have that many people in Congress doing the same thing (ie, ignoring the media on these types of questions), they were likely whipped to do so. So this tells me that 25 (now 26) congressional Republicans ignored their leadership. And I don’t really care that the rest didn’t. This WaPo poll isn’t indicative of anything other than the Republican party doesn’t want to piss Trump off and lose the Senate too. Biden still wins, Trump still loses. Ymmv. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7440 "2020-12-06T04:52:06Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > There’s an article on WaPo but it’s paywalled: > > [https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-kemp-call-georgia/2020/12/05/fd8d677c-3721-11eb-8d38-6aea1adb3839\_story.html](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/trump-kemp-call-georgia/2020/12/05/fd8d677c-3721-11eb-8d38-6aea1adb3839_story.html) Thanks for the response but not what I was asking about. I’ve actually read multiple articles this evening recounting basically the same details. NONE of them explain how Gov. Kemp could overturn the election by calling a special session of the legislature. Trump blathering that it CAN be done counts for nothing here. Also, the link you provided doesn’t back up the claim made by **Deeg** that the Georgia SOS could do that either. Further, the final paragraph of the article you linked has this to say: > Lawyers for Raffensperger have determined that current law gives Georgia legislators no role in seating electors. And the governor does not think the legislature has the power to change the law with retroactive effect, according to people familiar with his views. So, other than Trump’s lunatic ramblings, where does anything in GA law say the Gov or SoS can do what Trump is demanding? Deeg said there is an article on FOX making the claim it can be done. I doubt pretty much anything FOX has to say about his but I would, again, love to see a link to said article. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7441 "2020-12-06T05:05:28Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > So, other than Trump’s lunatic ramblings, where does anything in GA law say the Gov or SoS can do what Trump is demanding? > **[Trump campaigns in Georgia amid crucial Senate race](https://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2020-55203838)** > > The president holds a rally in Georgia where two run-offs will determine control of the US Senate. _According to the Washington Post, Mr Trump called Mr Kemp on Saturday morning and asked him to demand an audit of absentee ballot signatures. Mr Kemp - who has no power to order such an audit - turned down the requests, a source told the newspaper…He added: “At least immediately ask for a Special Session of the Legislature. That you can easily, and immediately, do.”_ > **[Trump calls Georgia governor for help to overturn Biden's victory in the state](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/trump-calls-georgia-governor-help-overturn-biden-s-victory-state-n1250123)** > > Gov. Brian Kemp's office said that Georgia law prohibits the governor from interfering in elections. In a statement issued to NBC News, Kemp’s office said that Georgia law prohibits the governor from interfering in elections. That power rests with the secretary of state, who is an elected officer of the state. ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7442 "2020-12-06T05:15:06Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > **[Trump calls Georgia governor for help to overturn Biden's victory in the state](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2020-election/trump-calls-georgia-governor-help-overturn-biden-s-victory-state-n1250123)** > > Gov. Brian Kemp's office said that Georgia law prohibits the governor from interfering in elections. > [@](#): > > In a statement issued to NBC News, Kemp’s office said that Georgia law prohibits the governor from **interfering in elections.** That power rests with the secretary of state, who is an elected officer of the state. Bolding is mine. I don’t see “interfering in elections” to be the same as calling a special session of the state legislature. I take that to mean the SoS oversees and certifies elections. He can call for an audit apparently as well. But I have never been aware of any state where the SoS can call a special session. That is something typically reserved for state governors. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 5:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7443 "2020-12-06T05:31:32Z")
Sorry, I misunderstood. First, the authority of the Governor to convene a special session of the Legislature is set out in the Constitution of the State of George, at Article V, Section 2, Paragraph VII (p. 40 of the pdf version): [https://sos.ga.gov/admin/files/Constitution\_2013\_Final\_Printed.pdf](https://sos.ga.gov/admin/files/Constitution_2013_Final_Printed.pdf) That appears to give the Governor the power to set the agenda for the special session. Next, the United States Constitution provides that the legislatures provide for the appointment of the electors, in [Article II, Section 1, Clause 2](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_Two_of_the_United_States_Constitution#Clause_2:_Method_of_choosing_electors): > [@](#): > > Each State shall appoint, in such Manner as the Legislature thereof may direct, a Number of Electors, equal to the whole Number of Senators and Representatives to which the State may be entitled in the Congress: However, the Legislature of Georgia has so directed, in state law: [2010 Georgia Code - TITLE 21 - ELECTIONS - CHAPTER 2 - ELECTIONS AND PRIMARIES GENERALLY - ARTICLE 1 - GENERAL PROVISIONS - § 21-2-10 - Election of presidential electors](https://law.justia.com/codes/georgia/2010/title-21/chapter-2/article-1/21-2-10/) > [@](#): > > 21-2-10. Election of presidential electors > > At the November election to be held in the year 1964 and every fourth year thereafter, there shall be elected by the electors of this state persons to be known as electors of President and Vice President of the United States and referred to in this chapter as presidential electors, equal in number to the whole number of senators and representatives to which this state may be entitled in the Congress of the United States. In order for the state Legislature to change that, they would have to repeal that statutory provision, and pass a new provision, directing the appointment of the the Republican electors. Could they do that? It would seem to be contrary to a federal law, known as the “safe harbour” law, [3 USC s. 5](https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/3/5): > [@](#): > > If any [State](https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/uscode.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=3-USC-80204913-1227756099&term_occur=999&term_src=title:3:chapter:1:section:5) shall have provided, by laws enacted prior to the day fixed for the appointment of the electors, for its final determination of any controversy or contest concerning the appointment of all or any of the electors of such [State](https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/uscode.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=3-USC-80204913-1227756099&term_occur=999&term_src=title:3:chapter:1:section:5), by judicial or other methods or procedures, and such determination shall have been made at least six days before the time fixed for the meeting of the electors, such determination made pursuant to such law so existing on said day, and made at least six days prior to said time of meeting of the electors, shall be conclusive, and shall govern in the counting of the electoral votes as provided in the Constitution, and as hereinafter regulated, so far as the ascertainment of the electors appointed by such [State](https://www.law.cornell.edu/definitions/uscode.php?width=840&height=800&iframe=true&def_id=3-USC-80204913-1227756099&term_occur=999&term_src=title:3:chapter:1:section:5) is concerned. Lots of legalese, but the key point seems to be that if the Legislature has provided by statute, prior to the day fixed for the appointment of the electors, a method to determine all controversy, including judicial challenges, and that determination has been made, six days before the day fixed by federal law for the meeting of the electors, then that determination of the electors is conclusive. That’s what has happened here: Georgia provided that the electors will be elected on election day in November, and prior to that date, the Legislature passed a detailed set of laws to provide for any challenges. That process for challenges has run its course and the election has been certified by the Georgia Secretary of State, at least six days before the electors are to meet, on December 14. That means that the determination of electors is conclusive, based on the federal law, and it suggests that even if the state legislature tried to change the law for the appointment of electors, it wouldn’t have any effect. Leastways, that’s my understanding from various op-eds and news articles I’ve read in the past month. And obviously, I don’t practice law in Georgia, so I could be completely out to lunch here, but that seems to be what the media have been saying. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7444 "2020-12-06T05:32:50Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > And yet, the President is demanding the NAMES! of the Republicans who said he lost and Biden won. The names are out there. That WaPo article (the one with the results of their 3-question survey) includes itemized lists of the names of everyone and how they responded. IIRC, that includes the names of everyone who didn’t respond at all, which was the great majority of them. ETA: The two who insist that Trump won are: > [@WaPo article](#): > > Reps. Paul A. Gosar (Ariz.) and Mo Brooks (Ala.) are the only Republicans in Congress who have publicly insisted Trump is the winner. Gosar has spent several weeks embracing the disproved conspiracy theory that the Dominion voting machines used in Arizona, Georgia and some other states manipulated the results and stole the election for Biden. More ETA: [Here is the link to the itemized results of the WaPo survey.](https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2020/politics/congress-republicans-trump-election-claims/) ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 5:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7445 "2020-12-06T05:36:06Z")
Thanks **Northern\_Piper**. That was what I suspected. So as I said, yet another example of Trump having no clue how any of this “government” stuff works. And [according to this website](https://www.ncsl.org/research/about-state-legislatures/special-sessions472.aspx), only the governor or, in some states, the legislature can call for a special session. In none of the 50 states does the SoS have that authority. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7446 "2020-12-06T06:30:25Z")
> [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](#): > > Thanks **Northern\_Piper**. That was what I suspected. So as I said, yet another example of Trump having no clue how any of this “government” stuff works. It almost certainly wouldn’t work, but the legal theory that Trump would depend on is that [Article II, Section 1, Clause 2](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Article_Two_of_the_United_States_Constitution#Clause_2:_Method_of_choosing_electors) gives State Legislatures unfettered authority to direct how electors shall be appointed. Federal statute has no authority to restrict when or how they do so, so if the State Legislature decides tomorrow that they want to throw out their laws for deciding electoral votes by direct election and just appoint their own electors, they can do so. Practically, what that would mean is that when the joint session of Congress convenes in January to count the electoral votes, they would have two slates of electors from Georgia. As @Northern_Piper points out, the stature requires them to count the slate certified by the state prior to the safe harbor date. But a Senator and Representative could object, and under the law it would take both chambers voting to reject the certified electors or else they would be counted. And that’s when Trump goes to court, and hopes that there’s enough ambiguity and questions of Constitutionality around the [Electoral Count Act](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electoral_Count_Act) that he can force his electors through with a sympathetic Supreme Court. All of this is a Hail Mary, but Hail Mary’s are all Trump has left. ---
**Author:** ![aurora\_maire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aurora_maire/32/328_2.png) [@aurora\_maire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aurora_maire)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 6:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7447 "2020-12-06T06:39:37Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > and it suggests that even if the state legislature tried to change the law for the appointment of electors, it wouldn’t have any effect. They can’t change the law for _this_ election. I wonder how many Republican legislatures will be changing the way electors are chosen before the next one? My guess would be all of them. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7448 "2020-12-06T06:45:37Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > They can’t change the law for _this_ election. That’s the point in issue: can Congress by passing the “safe harbour” law set out above, prevent the state Legislature from changing the means of appointment of the electors? As **flurb** points out, the argument is that the US Constitution gives an unfettered power to the state legislatures, and that the Congress can’t impose limits on that constitutional power, so the Georgia Legislature could change the slate, notwithstanding the November election. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 1:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7449 "2020-12-06T13:52:42Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > I wonder how many Republican legislatures will be changing the way electors are chosen before the next one? My guess would be all of them. You think all of the state legislatures that are majority Republican are going to change the law so that in 2024 their constituents won’t get to vote for President? ---
**Author:** ![ThelmaLou](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thelmalou/32/390_2.png) [@ThelmaLou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThelmaLou)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7450 "2020-12-06T14:52:36Z")
> **['MyPillow Guy' Wigs Out At Trump Rally, Says 'People Will Go To Prison' For...](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/mike-lindell-mypillow-election-coup-trump-georgia-rally_n_5fcc4429c5b6636e0925e4c7)** > > Mike Lindell, CEO of MyPillow, spelled out how he thinks Trump could claim victory of the presidential election that Joe Biden won. > Lindell, known for his [starring roles in MyPillow ads](https://youtu.be/3FqPmkq7_Ek) for the company he founded, laid out his — and Trump’s — plan to snatch the Georgia election from voters. It’s the same basic plan the president [rolled out in a phone call](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/georgia-gov-brian-kemp-trump_n_5fcbebf8c5b6636e0925c594) to Republican Gov. [Brian Kemp](https://www.huffpost.com/topic/brian-kemp) earlier Saturday. (Kemp explained to the president that he doesn’t have the power to [overturn an election in a democracy](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/trump-kemp-georgia-vote-criminality-harry-reid_n_5fcc075cc5b63a1534526730)). > > Then they would grab the _entire_ election, Lindell vowed. He was a bit fuzzy on details, though. > > “We have to get this governor … **Brian Kemp has to give an order to have a Congress meeting, whatever they do, their legislators, and pull Georgia down and don’t give it to Biden,” Lindell shouted. “It doesn’t matter who they give it to; don’t give it to Biden and find out all your corruption.”** > > He added: “If you pull down Georgia, Pennsylvania and crooked Nevada, now nobody has 270 [electoral] votes, and on December 14 it goes to the [Electoral College] vote and Donald Trump wins the election!” > … Ta-DAH! Pretty haigh-falutin rhetoric in the paragraph I bolded. _“…have a Congress meeting, whatever they do, their legislators…”_ Gotcha. 👍🏽 ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7451 "2020-12-06T14:55:16Z")
It’s still so weird seeing people getting all worked up about Joe Biden, of all people. Joe Biden! ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7452 "2020-12-06T15:32:40Z")
> [@aurora\_maire](#): > > They can’t change the law for _this_ election. I wonder how many Republican legislatures will be changing the way electors are chosen before the next one? My guess would be all of them. No state is going to change their laws so that the presidential electors are appointed by some process other than direct election. In the current debacle, even the most in-the-bag Trumpists like Kemp have been unwilling to go that route. As elected politicians, these state officials would be very wary of setting such a high-profile precedent that voting is meaningless. What they’ll do is focus on changes to state voting statutes and practices designed to make sure the “right” people vote – i.e. stringent voter ID requirements, reducing polling places in Democratic districts, restricting absentee voting, etc. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7453 "2020-12-06T15:38:40Z")
Jesus. I’d never heard of “My Pillow” before this guy started piping up about the election, but presumably he wants to sell _some_ pillows to Biden voters, right? I mean, the pillow industry seems like it would be fairly nonpartisan. Or does he exclusively sell full-length Trump body pillows for MAGA-heads to cuddle up with as they mutter about QAnon conspiracies? ---
**Author:** ![not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/not_what_you_d_expect/32/3246_2.png) [@not\_what\_you\_d\_expect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/not_what_you_d_expect)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2020, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618/7454 "2020-12-06T16:07:24Z")
His commercials are on MSNBC constantly, which also makes no sense to me. I mute him as quickly as I do Trump. I never used to give two shits about who made the pillow I purchase, but you can bet I look these days. For what NOT to buy. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618.md?page=371) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/election-day-week-month-s-year-2020-follow-along-thread/924618.md?page=373)