# Electric Vehicle critics **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 24, 2019, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254 "2019-10-24T20:43:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![YamatoTwinkie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/cc9497/32.png) [@YamatoTwinkie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YamatoTwinkie)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/601 "2019-11-12T21:22:21Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > You’re not going to admit that you’re saying it, but that’s what you are implying even if you won’t be open about it. You’re trying to pretend that the set of events ‘Went out late Thursday, didn’t plug the charger in, decided to take a short trip to visit a friend on the weekend, while driving my usual commute to work’ is a confluence of extremely unlikely and unrelated events like ‘receiving a Monday telemarketer call while wearing red socks on your birthday’. I’ve asked you previously to estimate the chances that you think all those things happen to line up before, which would have been great to have an actual serious starting point to work from. Here’s my rough guess at throwing numbers out there, for what it’s worth. “Forgetting to plug in” : Maybe 5 days out of the year. (5/365) “20+ miles of going out”: 3 days a week (3/7) “commuting 50 miles” : top 20% of commuters (1/5) “Visit a friend the next town over, stay overnight” : 1 day a week (1/7) “During cold weather/EV battery degradation conditions”😕 Half the year/lifetime of the vehicle, maybe (1/2) If all of these items are independent events, you’d expect them to line up maybe once every 33 years. More than the lifetime of the vehicle. And sure, this isn’t describing you in particular, since you commute this distance every day. And these may not be independent events, since this particular sequence of events may just be part of a weekly routine you do during winter, and maybe the 20+ miles of going out leaves you in a condition where forgetting to plug in is more likely to occur. And this is just one scenario, and there are many others like it. But really what it boils down to is the chances to: 1. Have to drive a whole bunch of miles (~200) in one day. 2. Forget to plug in at home 3. Have to drive more than the remaining range (~50+ miles) the following day, and delays of an hour or more are not tolerable. 4. Have no convenient access to fast chargers, or other alternatives (trading car with a spouse for a day) Sure, I’ve done #1 multiple times (weekend trips getting home on Sunday night). And I’ve done #2 multiple times. And I drive 50+ miles every day for work, so #3 would be pretty likely for me too. But #1, #2, and #3 combined would be an extremely rare event for me. I don’t live anywhere near a convenient supercharger, but I can trade cars, so it wouldn’t be an issue for me even if it happened. But that’s my situation, and I’m not going to claim its the same for everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/602 "2019-11-12T21:27:33Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > You’re not going to admit that you’re saying it, but that’s what you are implying even if you won’t be open about it. You’re trying to pretend that the set of events ‘Went out late Thursday, didn’t plug the charger in, decided to take a short trip to visit a friend on the weekend, while driving my usual commute to work’ is a confluence of extremely unlikely and unrelated events like ‘receiving a Monday telemarketer call while wearing red socks on your birthday’. If your round trip to work is 50 miles, you can manage two days of commuting AND about another 100 miles of miscellaneous travel (even in winter) over two days for nearly every EV on the market today. So let’s get this straight – someone drives to work on day one, drives another 50 miles, and then drives back home, but forgets to plug in because he isn’t an automaton. Then on day two, he drives to work, drives another 50 miles, and drives home… and then forgets to plug in AGAIN because he is STILL not an automaton? And then on day three, he can’t get to work OH NOES! This is what you’re trying to convince us of? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/603 "2019-11-12T21:35:34Z")
The best part about this is he’s claiming that a person who knows they’re going to be driving 100 mile the next day won’t glance at their gas gauge the day before. As if the cars are all secret about the fact that their battery level is at 65% at the end of the day. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/604 "2019-11-12T21:40:40Z")
I expect that when shutting down the car, there may be a reminder to the owner that the battery is low, which should lead the owner to plug it in before going inside. I also suspect that most of these cars have smartphone apps, so if it’s sitting in the garage, with the battery at a low level and not plugged in, it might pop up a reminder on the phone to go out and plug it in. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/605 "2019-11-12T21:46:03Z")
Naw, they’re just all so expensive that the only people who own them have a butler who can be made responsible for ensuring that there’s a full charge on the car in the morning. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/606 "2019-11-12T22:27:05Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > and in spite of the empirical evidence that actual EV batterys drop to 80% of capacity in the ‘typical case’ and 90% of capacity in the best case according to sources provided by EV proponents is pretty telling. No, that’s false. [Here is a scatter chart](https://electrek.co/wp-content/uploads/sites/3/2018/04/screen-shot-2018-04-14-at-2-54-02-pm.jpg?quality=82&strip=all&w=1000) of battery degradation on the Model S/X. _None_ of the points are as low as 80%, and it certainly isn’t typical. Almost all the cars stay above 90%, even as far out as 250,000 km. It’s too early to be sure, but the Model 3 is likely even better (expected, given their changes to the cell architecture). The first Model 3 [to go 100,000 miles](https://electrek.co/2019/10/21/tesla-model-3-100000-miles/) has only experienced ~2.5% degradation. The car may well reach a half million miles before degrading to 80% capacity. This might just be a lucky outlier, since it’s just one data point. But even the older Model S, for which there is good data available, experiences far less degradation that your claims. The first gen Nissan Leaf did experience significant degradation due to poor design and a small capacity. That should not be taken as at all representative. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/607 "2019-11-12T22:38:31Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > I expect that when shutting down the car, there may be a reminder to the owner that the battery is low, which should lead the owner to plug it in before going inside. I also suspect that most of these cars have smartphone apps, so if it’s sitting in the garage, with the battery at a low level and not plugged in, it might pop up a reminder on the phone to go out and plug it in. I’ve setup automation so that if my car is below 30% of charge, I’m home, and it is not plugged in at 10pm, then send me a reminder. I guess if there is a chance I’m in the bathroom at 10pm, I could set it to run every 30 minutes. The conditions for the reminder to be sent have never once been met. I’m sure it will happen to some people, though. Because even with gas stations on every corner and every freeway exit, people still manage to run out of gas. ---
**Author:** ![swampspruce](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/swampspruce/32/261_2.png) [@swampspruce](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/swampspruce)\ **Post date:** [November 12, 2019, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/608 "2019-11-12T22:54:25Z")
> [@jz78817](#): > > unfortunately, the slow sales of everything not-Tesla doesn’t bode well… the market for EVs needs to be bigger than the Elon Musk Fan Club. It also needs to make them something I would want to buy. I like my vehicles to have at least a modicum of sportiness, aesthetically pleasing looks and practicality; properties the Focus EV, Leaf, and Bolt lack in large proportion. I did a hard look at the Volt and I still think it is one of the better choices out there, but I’ve had a hate on for GM and Chryco ever since they had to be bailed out. I won’t support a company that is still that badly mismanaged and clueless. JMO, of course. I’m gagging on the idea of spending $65k CAD for a Model 3 as well. Maybe the ID3 is my next car. ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/609 "2019-11-13T00:47:03Z")
> [@swampspruce](#): > > It also needs to make them something I would want to buy. I like my vehicles to have at least a modicum of sportiness, aesthetically pleasing looks and practicality; properties the Focus EV, Leaf, and Bolt lack in large proportion. I did a hard look at the Volt and I still think it is one of the better choices out there, but I’ve had a hate on for GM and Chryco ever since they had to be bailed out. I won’t support a company that is still that badly mismanaged and clueless. JMO, of course. > I’m gagging on the idea of spending $65k CAD for a Model 3 as well. Maybe the ID3 is my next car. This, to me, depends on whether you’re comparing based on $$$ or features. Taking the LEAF as an example - the nearest in size and utility would be the Nissan Tiida - having spent a good amount of time in both… The Leaf far outshines the Tiida in every respect except for range. From driving dynamics to acceleration to noise control etc. Of course well it should given the price point… however, the lower running costs (if the range is suitable) offsets that ---
**Author:** ![bengangmo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@bengangmo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bengangmo)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/610 "2019-11-13T00:55:08Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > Actual people, as opposed to automatons sometimes come home, need to pee badly, so zip into the house to hit the bathroom rather than do car stuff, then since it’s comfy inside stay inside. And sometimes they just don’t plug in a device like a phone or vape even though it’s going to run out of juice later. For the garage door thing, the vast majority of people that I know either do not have a garage, or don’t use it to store a car so don’t close the door every night. And for people that do, if they don’t have an automatic garage door opener to close the door at the push of a button, they do in fact fail to close the garage door sometimes. Or is there an automatic car-plugger-inner that I’m unaware of? > > If EV proponents are going to insist that people (or maybe just ‘people with EVs’) act like automatons that follow a proscribed routine every night without fail, I’m going to point out that real people aren’t automatons. > > What argument do you even think I’m making? You seem to be engaging with a pretty heavy duty strawman. I found very much that when I was driving an EV my thinking changed to be more aware of charging. Just as, when I lived in the country (far away from petrol station) I was far more aware of how much fuel I had left. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/611 "2019-11-13T01:23:35Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > 1. EV’s don’t have enough range. (variant on the commuting 350 km/day above). They have enough range for a huge majority of people. > As I try to say to many of them - "If an EV does not work for your personal situation - fine. But don’t try to tell me what works for MY SITUATION. The above is from your OP. However, you’re doing the opposite side of the coin of what you’re bitching about in your OP. If they work for you, great! However, they don’t work for everyone. They don’t work for people who don’t have dedicated (powered) parking spots at home &/or work, including city dwellers & many apartment residents. They don’t work for people who need 4WD, like **enipla** because they don’t make a 4WD variant yet. They don’t work for people who regularly drive long distances in remote areas like **Kent Clark** or myself. If/when the range/recharge infrastructure & vehicle type improves enough that my range/recharge issues go away I’d consider one for my next car; however, they’re nowhere near that today. I would have had issues two of the last three weekends with an EV - It’s not practical. The irony is that, in the ICE world, the cheap econoboxes get the best MPG; sure, a Chevy Suburban may get more range but that’s only because it’s gas tank is 2x or 3x the size of that in the econobox. However, in the EV world, the best range & recharging options are in the more expensive available models; that’s adds affordability to the list of people who can’t get one. > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > It seems to me that “EV critics” can be divided into a few categories: > > 1. Those who make up or repeat absolute crap and lies in order to disparage EV’s. For example, posting pictures of an open pit copper mine, and say “here is a lithium mine” or saying that EV batteries only last 2 years and then can never be recycled. Thankfully, there are none of this category here on the SDMB > > 2. “Edge case” folks who genuinely would have difficulty in purchasing/using an EV today. This would include people who live in extreme conditions of remoteness or weather. If you have to navigate 4 feet of snow for 200 miles to get to work, an EV will not be a good choice for you. Probably you need a specialized 4WD. If you live in a downtown condo in Manhatten with no access to parking at all, an EV probably will not work for you. You’d be better off using transit. Other, not so extreme examples are also certainly valid. I’m not sure why they would post their personal limitations about transportation in this thread, and think that they would apply to everyone, but there you go. For a not-insignificant proportion of the driving public, EV’s are not a good option at this time. And that’s OK. You don’t have to get one. But for a very large proportion of the public, EV’s ARE a good option. > > 3. Folks who like to argue for the sake of arguing. Often this can be seen by the moving goalposts. A 100 mile commute becomes a 400 mile commute when it’s pointed out that the range of EV’s has increased lately. Suddenly, home charging is impossible, or too expensive, or long vacations must be taken after along commute. Something else always pops up to make an EV impractical. Cherry picking also occurs. The most expensive EV is used to show that EV’s are too expensive. The most expensive charging price is used to show that not much money is saved by EV’s. The shortest range of an EV is used to show that all EV ranges are too short. > > 4. Some who genuinely cannot grasp that EV’s are “fueled” in a fundamentally different way. That if you have home charging, you may never need to visit an external charger. We’re so accustomed to our ICE cars and visiting a gas station regularly, that it’s hard to make the leap to thinking of a car where you NEVER have to go anywhere to get “fuel” Likewise, it’s hard for those who have never driven an EV to realize what a great experience it is. > Also, folks who cannot grasp that EV’s are changing and evolving for the better at a rapid rate. Ranges are going up. Prices are coming down. The charging network is getting better and better. An EV may not work for you TODAY. But check them in a few years when you’re looking for a car - they may work for you THEN. In the same way that a SmartCar or a Miata doesn’t work for a family of four, EV’s don’t work for huge portions of the population; that doesn’t mean that we’re ‘critics’ of them. I’d love to have a Miata to go zipping around topless in the summer; however, the lack of seats/storage means it would need to be a second car as I couldn’t use it a lot of times. That’s why I don’t have one; same logic with an EV. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/612 "2019-11-13T01:37:49Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > They don’t work for people who need 4WD, like **enipla** because they don’t make a 4WD variant yet. To be clear, the 4WDness is not the issue. The AWD system on a Tesla is excellent; far superior to most ICE AWD systems and probably comparable in practice to most 4WD systems. It’s the ground clearance that’s the issue, and to some extent the form factor. There’s no equivalent to an EV Jeep yet. But on roads which are just snowy/icy/muddy, and aren’t covered with rocks or whatever, a Tesla is great. I realize you’re probably using “4WD” a synonym for a high ground clearance, truck-like vehicle–I just wanted to clarify the difference here. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/613 "2019-11-13T01:42:10Z")
> [@swampspruce](#): > > It also needs to make them something I would want to buy. I like my vehicles to have at least a modicum of sportiness, aesthetically pleasing looks and practicality; properties the Focus EV, Leaf, and Bolt lack in large proportion. I did a hard look at the Volt and I still think it is one of the better choices out there, but I’ve had a hate on for GM and Chryco ever since they had to be bailed out. I won’t support a company that is still that badly mismanaged and clueless. JMO, of course. > I’m gagging on the idea of spending $65k CAD for a Model 3 as well. Maybe the ID3 is my next car. so basically you want a mainstream car company spend billions making a one-of-one vehicle which perfectly suits you. yeah, you’ll be waiting a while for that. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/614 "2019-11-13T01:46:48Z")
> [@Spiderman](#): > > The above is from your OP. However, you’re doing the opposite side of the coin of what you’re bitching about in your OP. If they work for you, great! However, they don’t work for everyone. Please show me, using quotes if possible, where I have in any way implied that EV’s work for everyone, and I am “doing the opposite side of the coin” I will repeat - EV’s do not work for everyone. There are many cases where they do not. I think I even said that a while back. Oh yes, I did - there it is: > [@](#): > > Originally posted by Me: For a not-insignificant proportion of the driving public, EV’s are not a good option at this time. And that’s OK. You don’t have to get one. But for a very large proportion of the public, EV’s ARE a good option. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/615 "2019-11-13T01:57:02Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > I can only infer that he’s worried that all the gas stations will go out of business due to lack of demand. > > Which could happen. If the scenario occurs where in most areas EVs conquer the market but in some areas ICEVs remain in use because of environmental conditions, owners of ICEVs could find themselves no longer able to make those cross-country drives due to there not being any gas stations outside of the frozen north. Which would be a bit of an ironic reversal - having to rent an EV car when you want to take a trip, because your ICEV doesn’t have the range. If it were a literal reversal, with gas stations as far away as charging stations are today, it would be no problem, especially as you could carry a gas can to extend the range of a hybrid for a lot longer than the range of an electric vehicle today. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/616 "2019-11-13T02:07:42Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > If it were a literal reversal, with gas stations as far away as charging stations are today, it would be no problem, especially as you could carry a gas can to extend the range of a hybrid for a lot longer than the range of an electric vehicle today. No problem? Suppose you live 50 miles from the nearest gas station, as one might today be 50 miles from the nearest fast charging station. Charging at home is sufficient for EV drivers as long as they stay within a certain radius. But there’s no home gas stations, so one would have to make extremely inconvenient trips just for daily usage. This is why hydrogen fuel cells are a dead-end, IMO. Without home fueling, they require a public station density comparable to gas stations. And of course that doesn’t exist and probably never will. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/617 "2019-11-13T02:15:36Z")
If I had a garage that could fit a charging station, I’d be able to keep extra gas in it so I would only have to fill up every couple months. The hardest part would be the gas going bad. ---
**Author:** ![Spiderman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spiderman/32/230_2.png) [@Spiderman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spiderman)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/618 "2019-11-13T02:27:20Z")
> [@Dr.Strangelove](#): > > To be clear, the 4WDness is not the issue. The AWD system on a Tesla is excellent; far superior to most ICE AWD systems and probably comparable in practice to most 4WD systems. > > It’s the ground clearance that’s the issue, and to some extent the form factor. There’s no equivalent to an EV Jeep yet. But on roads which are just snowy/icy/muddy, and aren’t covered with rocks or whatever, a Tesla is great. > > I realize you’re probably using “4WD” a synonym for a high ground clearance, truck-like vehicle–I just wanted to clarify the difference here. Yup, I tend to think of AWD as cars that get power to all four wheels but where ‘offroad’ is not much more than a grass parking lot whereas 4WD tends to be higher ground clearance & knobby tires; something you can take on a trail - a Jeep, a pickup, etc. Maybe there are options but standard road tires, which is what the Tesla comes with, are not nearly as good in crap conditions as off-road/knobby tires are; they can’t get the same traction/‘bite’ that an off-road tire can. > [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Please show me, using quotes if possible, where I have in any way implied that EV’s work for everyone, and I am “doing the opposite side of the coin” > > I will repeat - EV’s do not work for everyone. There are many cases where they do not. I think I even said that a while back. Oh yes, I did - there it is: Post 587, which I quoted; where you called people who don’t have them 'EV critics" & ‘edge cases’; a third (or more) of the population isn’t an edge case. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 2:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/619 "2019-11-13T02:27:30Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > If I had a garage that could fit a charging station, I’d be able to keep extra gas in it so I would only have to fill up every couple months. The hardest part would be the gas going bad. Yeah, because keeping a 55 gallon drum of gas in my garage is super convenient and safe. I think you may be overestimating the amount of floor space required for a home charging station. The actual number is zero. ---
**Author:** ![SamuelA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@SamuelA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SamuelA)\ **Post date:** [November 13, 2019, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254/620 "2019-11-13T02:41:55Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > If I had a garage that could fit a charging station, I’d be able to keep extra gas in it so I would only have to fill up every couple months. The hardest part would be the gas going bad. An EV charger is just a small box. About the size of a couple toasters. And you can mount it outside and charge cars parked in your driveway. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/electric-vehicle-critics/842254.md?page=32)