# Elevator stopping at Penthouse and going down--way down--Bob Guccione dead at 79 **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 21, 2010, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881 "2010-10-21T13:53:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/21 "2010-10-21T19:29:00Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > They didn’t know. He did all the porn scenes with extras on the same set, after hours. That’s how. They should’ve guessed, just from who was directing. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/22 "2010-10-21T19:30:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > When at your small midwestern university… > > Yup. Letters section was the best draw for me, and it’s why I liked Penthouse better than Playboy. And quite a brilliant business model – making your zine’s biggest draw the work of writers **you don’t have to pay!** 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Nametag](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nametag/32/406_2.png) [@Nametag](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nametag)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/23 "2010-10-21T19:34:11Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > They should’ve guessed, just from who was directing. Tinto Brass was a perfectly respectable director. Guccione co-produced, along with Franco Rossellini, directed the sex scenes, and directed post-production. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/24 "2010-10-21T19:34:37Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > And quite a brilliant business model – making your zine’s biggest draw the work of writers **you don’t have to pay!** 🙂 Maybe. Either the “writers” were staff, or they were so heavily edited as to be written by staff… or all the fans of the magazine went to the SAME liberal midwestern university and had the same creative writing teacher… because the tone of many of their letters was suspiciously similar to the tone of many _other_ of their letters. ---
**Author:** ![Giles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/giles/32/60_2.png) [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/25 "2010-10-21T19:40:01Z")
I would expect they would get unsolicited contributions from readers for the letters section, but they would probably have just thrown 99.9% of them away as either too unoriginal, too bizarre, or requiring too much editing. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/26 "2010-10-21T19:43:48Z")
The photography was also better than Playboy, the choice of models, the letters column, and also Xaveria Hollander’s column. All excellent. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/27 "2010-10-21T19:50:03Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Maybe. > > Either the “writers” were staff, or they were so heavily edited as to be written by staff… or all the fans of the magazine went to the SAME liberal midwestern university and had the same creative writing teacher… because the tone of many of their letters was suspiciously similar to the tone of many _other_ of their letters. My guess would be, over the first few years, a distinctive style evolved, and then no one would think of submitting a letter without modeling it on that style. It’s the same way artistic styles, professional or demotic, develop in any culture or period. Why do you think all African folk art looks so similar? And so different from Polynesian or American Indian folk art? ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 8:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/28 "2010-10-21T20:11:12Z")
I agree with Bricker. The letters were too consistently good for them to be relying solely on reader submissions. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/29 "2010-10-21T20:16:46Z")
I’m sure they got at least some editorial gloss (or maybe a lot), but I’m not quite ready to believe they were complete editorial fabrications based on no real public submissions at all. This would be a great question for Cecil. Were the Penthouse letters real? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/30 "2010-10-21T20:21:36Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > This would be a great question for Cecil. Were the Penthouse letters real? Defining “real,” of course, as “the work of readers rather than staff,” not as “accurately describing real-life events.” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/31 "2010-10-21T20:29:15Z")
Of course. Asking if they were TRUE would just be begging to be insulted. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/32 "2010-10-21T21:46:05Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Of course. Asking if they were TRUE would just be begging to be insulted. Why I also thought so until that one night when First Sergeant Baldwin, Pfc. Delirious and this blonde 38DD 2dLT fresh out of ROTC were out on night maneouvers at Fort Benning… 😛 😉 I’d say that there were probably enough “submissions” as it were, from actual readers, to provide the base scenarios that would then be used by a consistent team of editors to be rendered into the “house style”. Ah, good bye, Bob, master of soft focus (which by 1990 was mostly abandoned), ye who first pinked the world of “respectable” skin mags. Aye, ye spread 😃 so much knowledge of anatomy in those pre-web days! (I suppose it was a reaction to the upsurge in net porn that he made the decision to take the pictorials hardcore in the late 90s. And after the bankruptcy the property does not look like it has recovered.) Of the “big three” he did have the dubious distinction of being the one who proceeded to lose all he had built – since the 70s, Hef had his onetime empire go through dramatic contractions but was able to save the core business and even have something of a comeback; Flynt got over getting shot and taken to the Supreme Court, to diversify accross the sex industry; but Guccione ran his businesses into the ground slow and steady, and ended up with everything sold from under him. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/33 "2010-10-21T21:48:50Z")
> [@JRDelirious](#): > > And after the bankruptcy the property does not look like it has recovered.) Since the reorganization it has become deadly boring. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/34 "2010-10-21T21:55:51Z")
I wonder if the following from the article is intentional - > [@](#): > > Guccione and longtime business collaborator Kathy Keeton, who later became his third wife, also published more mainstream fare, such as … Longevity, a health advice magazine. Keeton died of cancer in 1997 following surgery. No wonder it folded. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/35 "2010-10-21T22:23:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > My guess would be, over the first few years, a distinctive style evolved, and then no one would think of submitting a letter without modeling it on that style. > > It’s the same way artistic styles, professional or demotic, develop in any culture or period. Why do you think all African folk art looks so similar? And so different from Polynesian or American Indian folk art? Um… all African folk art does not look similar. ---
**Author:** ![FriarTed](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friarted/32/1052_2.png) [@FriarTed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriarTed)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/36 "2010-10-21T22:28:42Z")
Various observations~ PENTHOUSE- in the 70’s, the Vasoline was on the lens; by the 90’s, it was on the girls. Main difference between Hefner & Guccione: Hefner was a Protestant pornographer- restrained & no frills; Guccione was a Catholic pornographer- ornate & explicit; the empty cross vs. the bloody crucifix. Malcolm McDowell told the story of Conan that yes, the verenerable actors were the day shift, the porn actors on the night shift & he was there for both shifts. If one mag can atone for the sins of another (it can’t, but if it could), then OMNI should get Guccione into Heaven. My late former GF Deb should greet Bob in the Afterlife & thank him. I also learned all I know about female anatomy from him. (Yes, I can wear white at my wedding… except for the gloves.) ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_A.Robrin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sam_a.robrin/32/14497_2.png) [@Sam\_A.Robrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_A.Robrin)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/37 "2010-10-21T23:06:32Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Maybe. > > Either the “writers” were staff, or they were so heavily edited as to be written by staff… or all the fans of the magazine went to the SAME liberal midwestern university and had the same creative writing teacher… because the tone of many of their letters was suspiciously similar to the tone of many _other_ of their letters. A former _Penthouse_ editor (Robert J. Shea) told me that all the letters genuinely came from readers, but were quite heavily edited. ---
**Author:** ![calgreg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@calgreg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/calgreg)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/38 "2010-10-21T23:09:28Z")
Why would anyone give a damn? I mean, a businessman dies. His publication goes on (assuming it hasn’t gone under already. Don’t know as the Internet killed magazine porn, right?) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [October 21, 2010, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/39 "2010-10-21T23:18:40Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Um… all African folk art does not look similar. Well, in the sense that it’s all recognizable as African. And I mean SubSaharan only. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [October 22, 2010, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881/40 "2010-10-22T00:03:28Z")
> [@Sam\_A.Robrin](#): > > A former _Penthouse_ editor (Robert J. Shea) told me that all the letters genuinely came from readers, but were quite heavily edited. Not necessarily the case now. I am very vaguely acquainted with a woman who has written stories professionally for a Penthouse Letters publication ( a seperate mag these days, apparently with stories interspersed w/ hardcore porn shoots ). ETA: Guccione really does deserve kudos for helping bankroll Omni back in the day. At its height, before it went kooky, it was the best SF mag around. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elevator-stopping-at-penthouse-and-going-down-way-down-bob-guccione-dead-at-79/557881.md?page=3)