# Elon Musk **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 29, 2018, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765 "2018-01-29T23:24:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 11
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2018, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/201 "2018-09-09T19:08:02Z")
I started literally laughing out loud when I read that post. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2018, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/202 "2018-09-10T17:33:38Z")
Well, this is rich: > [@](#): > > In August 2017 Crystal Guardado was fired from Tesla as she began participating in union organizing and speaking up about the unsafe working conditions. “Some of my most vivid memories are asking questions about the union to colleagues and being told to shut up or I’d get fired,” Guardado said. She started working at Tesla in April 2017 and began speaking up after she hurt her eyes from chemicals used on door handles and was told by a doctor it was due to allergies. “They retaliated against me, I believe, because I was speaking up about my safety and the conditions in the factory.” > > **A Tesla spokesperson said Guardado was fired for failing the company’s substance abuse and testing policy** , but Guardado argued she has possessed a medical marijuana card in California for the past five years due to panic anxiety issues and her efforts to provide human resources with the documentation leading up to the test were ignored. > **[Tesla workers speak out: 'Anything pro-union is shut down really fast'](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2018/sep/10/tesla-workers-union-elon-musk)** > > Elon Musk has said he is ‘neutral’ about a union but former employees blame their firing on their efforts to organize while current workers say a ‘culture of fear’ persists ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/203 "2018-09-11T09:02:30Z")
I’ll have what **Smurf** is drinking. Make it a double. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/204 "2018-09-18T16:26:37Z")
There’s now a [criminal probe](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-09-18/tesla-faces-u-s-criminal-probe-over-musk-statements) into Musk’s tweet about taking Tesla private. This is in addition to the SEC investigation. ---
**Author:** ![JohnT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnt/32/15048_2.png) [@JohnT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JohnT)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/205 "2018-09-18T16:45:05Z")
His new defense: “Hey, I was high! It doesn’t count if you’re fucked up!” ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/206 "2018-09-18T16:54:54Z")
Well, the $420 per share price for the buyout _was_ a giant green flag. ---
**Author:** ![WolfpackJeep](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpackjeep/32/2921_2.png) [@WolfpackJeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WolfpackJeep)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/207 "2018-09-18T23:18:02Z")
Oh look, the diver showed up with a [lawsuit](https://www.apnews.com/4f4ddea4fa0c43ae984447fae85cf644/Diver-who-helped-with-Thai-cave-rescue-sues-Elon-Musk). ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2018, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/208 "2018-09-18T23:40:56Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Oh yeah, this pitting will go the way you think it will; sure. Huh. I guess you were right. I have been duly admonished and hang my head in shame for criticizing the man. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/209 "2018-09-19T00:53:31Z")
> [@WolfpackJeep](#): > > Oh look, the diver showed up with a [lawsuit](https://www.apnews.com/4f4ddea4fa0c43ae984447fae85cf644/Diver-who-helped-with-Thai-cave-rescue-sues-Elon-Musk). I think he should claim damages of $1 per follower of Musk’s Twitter feed. That would only be $22 million dollars. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/210 "2018-09-19T01:04:10Z")
Musk is full-on nutso. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2018, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/211 "2018-09-19T01:26:40Z")
No way I’m going to predict what comes of this, but the “funding secured” issue seems to have become more serious. The DoJ is investigating in addition to the SEC. > **[Tesla under criminal investigation over Musk tweet, according to reports](https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/tesla-under-criminal-investigation-over-musk-tweet-according-reports-n910766)** > > The electric automaker had already received a subpoena regarding the matter from the SEC, the federal enforcer responsible for civil securities fraud. Some reports have indicated that an SEC generally involves a civil penalty like a fine if wrongdoing is discovered; but a DOJ probe would probably indicate a criminal investigation. ---
**Author:** ![GreenWyvern](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/greenwyvern/32/2834_2.png) [@GreenWyvern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreenWyvern)\ **Post date:** [September 21, 2018, 7:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/212 "2018-09-21T07:32:47Z")
The NYT has a good article about Tesla’s finances: [Tesla’s Biggest Problem Isn’t Elon Musk](https://www.nytimes.com/2018/09/20/opinion/tesla-elon-musk.html) _ **The company can survive its chief executive’s strange behavior. But it cannot escape $11 billion in debt.** _ > [@](#): > > Tesla’s finances are fragile. It has around $11 billion in long-term debt and no profits. “That is not a sustainable business model,” Jim Collins, a longtime auto industry research analyst, wrote in Forbes in April. “Not even close.” > > From January to June of this year, Tesla generated revenues of $7.4 billion, but it had an operating loss of $1.7 billion, burning through its cash on hand. It has $2.2 billion left, most of which will be needed to cover operating losses. Romit Shah, a research analyst at Nomura Instinet and once one of Tesla’s biggest boosters, reversed course last week, calling the company “no longer investable.” > … > > Not surprisingly, bond investors have become increasingly skittish about Tesla. In March, the bond-rating company Moody’s moved Tesla’s corporate debt rating lower on its noninvestment grade, or “junk,” scale. > > In its explanation of the downgrade, Moody’s acknowledged that the market continues to admire Tesla’s cars: Advance purchase reservations and deposits for them “remain high.” But that hasn’t been enough to solve Tesla’s fundamental financial reality: It isn’t producing cars fast enough to meet demand, its operations are running at a loss, and it has huge debts coming due. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2018, 10:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/213 "2018-09-27T22:04:55Z")
From an [SEC press release](https://www.sec.gov/news/press-release/2018-219) today, “The Securities and Exchange Commission today charged Elon Musk, CEO and Chairman of Silicon Valley-based Tesla Inc., with securities fraud for a series of false and misleading tweets about a potential transaction to take Tesla private.” It goes on to say, “The SEC’s complaint, filed in federal district court in the Southern District of New York, alleges that Musk violated antifraud provisions of the federal securities laws, and seeks a permanent injunction, disgorgement, civil penalties, and a bar prohibiting Musk from serving as an officer or director of a public company.” ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2018, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/214 "2018-09-27T22:11:25Z")
Ouch! Buckle up, Folks! We’re in for a wild ride! ---
**Author:** ![Delayed\_Reflex](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/delayed_reflex/32/3172_2.png) [@Delayed\_Reflex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Delayed_Reflex)\ **Post date:** [September 27, 2018, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/215 "2018-09-27T23:06:36Z")
Shit, I definitely got bamboozled by Musk… I thought there’s no way he would have said “funding secured” without that actually being the case :smack:. Looks like TSLA stock has plummeted another 12% in after-hours trading after the SEC press release. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/216 "2018-09-28T00:25:29Z")
Quick, somebody take away his Martian passport! ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/217 "2018-09-28T00:34:51Z")
I used to idolize Musk, but his behavior over the last year has been nothing short of bat-shit insane. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/218 "2018-09-28T01:32:20Z")
> [@asahi](#): > > I used to idolize Musk, but his behavior over the last year has been nothing short of bat-shit insane. I know a lot of people believe that he’s started behaving differently in the last couple of years but he’s been like this for a long time. He was thrown out of Paypal for exactly this kind of mercurial behavior, and he’s been a blustery, capricious jerk since at least the early days of SpaceX, and of course he was responsible for forcing out the actual founders of Tesla, Marc Tarpenning and Martin Eberhard. Regardless of what you think of Musk’s supposed genius and vision, he is objectively unsuited to being the CEO of a company that has moved past its conceptual innovation phase and is in the midst of developing into production manufacturing. Musk was smart—or lucky—enuogh to hire a competent COO at SpaceX, and should have done the same thing with Tesla three or four years ago. He is clearly out of his depth at Tesla, and while his behavior alone isn’t going to sink the company, his lack of effective planning and leadership, combined with the enormous debt that Tesla has borne in its earlier attempts at extreme automation (something other players in the automotive industry realized had limited returns) has put Tesla in a precarious financial position regardless of the technical and popular success of its products. Even if the Tesla board votes to cut Musk loose they are still saddled with massive debt that they cannot pay down with foreseeable profit. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/219 "2018-09-28T02:12:46Z")
Musk strikes me as being very similar to his hero, Nikola Tesla. Like Tesla, he can be a brilliant visionary, but also like Tesla he has ideas that are just nutty and has poor control over his impulses. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [September 28, 2018, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765/220 "2018-09-28T02:18:05Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > Musk strikes me as being very similar to his hero, Nikola Tesla. Like Tesla, he can be a brilliant visionary, but also like Tesla he has ideas that are just nutty and has poor control over his impulses. Yeah but did Tesla smoke pot on a podcast? Or on…the first radio station? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765.md?page=10) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/elon-musk/807765.md?page=12)