# Enough with the Francophobia! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 1, 2003, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341 "2003-03-01T05:40:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Trucido](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@Trucido](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trucido)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/21 "2003-03-01T19:05:57Z")
Personally, I will continue to bash the French mercilessly, much as one never lets a sibling get away with anything without proper mocking. I bash 'em because I love the bastards. I’ll continue to drink their excellent wine, while reminding them that nearly all their grapes are American in origin, and continue to eat their cheese, desperate the hilarious proliferation of types. The fries will always be French, no matter what some jingoistic restaurant owner with a dull normal IQ and a hard-on for flags thinks. Their wine will still be good no matter that some other restaurant owner thinks he shapes political policy by his rotgut of choice. On the military front, I will never let Napoleon, Vauban, and Carnot be mentioned without gleefully bringing up Petain and Napoleon III. In the end, we have an enormous shared cultural heritage with the French, and it’s a shame that we don’t agree more often. Yes, so they don’t support us in Iraq. Americans don’t all support Americans attacking Iraq. When this crap has all blown over and Bush has shot his load, the 90% of the American population that can’t find France on a map will go back to whatever the hell it is they do for fun, and the rest of us can appreciate France without it being a fucking political statement. ---
**Author:** ![Trucido](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/ea5d25/32.png) [@Trucido](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trucido)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/22 "2003-03-01T19:08:52Z")
How “despite” became “desperate” I’ll never know. ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/23 "2003-03-01T19:21:50Z")
You’ll take my French bashing when you pry it from my cold dead hands! ---
**Author:** ![UncleBill](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/d26b3c/32.png) [@UncleBill](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBill)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/24 "2003-03-01T20:32:12Z")
The sure make good ticklers. What? ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/25 "2003-03-01T20:33:52Z")
Molly Ivins wrote a decent [editorial about this](http://www.sacbee.com/content/opinion/national/ivins/story/6136732p-7092269c.html) recently. I think that the closing paragraph strikes at the crux of the thing: > [@](#): > > This is where I think the real difference is: We Americans are famously ahistorical. We can barely be bothered to remember what happened last week, or last month, much less last year. The French are really stuck on history. (Some might claim this is because the French are better educated than we are. I won’t go there.) Does it not occur to anyone that these are very old friends of ours, trying to tell us what they think they know about being hated by weak enemies in the Third World? (IMHO, Canadians in general suffer from a lack of any sense of history to much the same degree that Americans do, as well.) ---
**Author:** ![red\_dragon60](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ce73a5/32.png) [@red\_dragon60](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/red_dragon60)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/26 "2003-03-01T20:46:01Z")
See, french fries don’t come from France, yet we still want to rename them. It goes along with the damn Dutchies brewing Heiney and us thinking it’s German. So you see, I was right all along. ::covering ass:: ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/27 "2003-03-01T20:59:52Z")
I’m just curious as to what has happened to US _croissant_ consumption recently. French pastry fashioned after an Islamic religious icon-- gasp – sounds like fixin’s for a treasonous teatime. ---
**Author:** ![Shade](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2bfe46/32.png) [@Shade](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shade)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/28 "2003-03-01T22:36:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by UncleBill \* > \*\*I’m not afraid of them at all. \*\* Damn you, that’s my joke! And it wasn’t funny the first time! Wait, this isn’t what I meant, is it? ---
**Author:** ![Michael\_Ellis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/977dab/32.png) [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 11:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/29 "2003-03-01T23:34:55Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Larry Mudd \* > \*\*I’m just curious as to what has happened to US _croissant_ consumption recently. French pastry fashioned after an Islamic religious icon-- gasp – sounds like fixin’s for a treasonous teatime. \*\* Oh shit, I ate one of those yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![NinetyWt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/cc9497/32.png) [@NinetyWt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NinetyWt)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/30 "2003-03-02T01:20:42Z")
I agree; enough ! Our neighborhood liquor store is in on the act; yesterday he “gave away” all French wine in his store. Here was his picture in the paper: backed by an American flag, he’s standing stalwart with a look of fiery indignation in his eye as he stares into the camera. Here’s what he said > [@](#): > > I’m tired of the French taking such a hard line. PUH ~ LEEZE !!! ugh. What a maroon. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 2:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/31 "2003-03-02T02:12:07Z")
> [@](#): > > I agree; enough ! Our neighborhood liquor store is in on the act; yesterday he “gave away” all French wine in his store. Here was his picture in the paper: backed by an American flag, he’s standing stalwart with a look of fiery indignation in his eye as he stares into the camera. > > Here’s what he said > quote:I’m tired of the French taking such a hard line. PUH ~ LEEZE !!! ugh. What a maroon. Somebody gave away oodles and boodles of free wine and I wasn’t there!?!?!?! Oh, the horror, the horror. ---
**Author:** ![Governor\_Quinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/d26b3c/32.png) [@Governor\_Quinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Governor_Quinn)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/32 "2003-03-02T02:14:19Z")
Personally, I like the comment a friend of mine who grew up in Paris made on the subject. “The Americans complain about our view on the war because they love us dearly. Since they don’t care for Russia, China, or Germany, they can ignore what they say, but what the French think truly concerns the U.S.” ---
**Author:** ![Banger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@Banger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Banger)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/33 "2003-03-02T03:00:29Z")
I can’t understand this. The guy is second on the all-time saves list, he’s playing for the hometown team he rooted for as a kid, and he’s a great clubhouse guy who is respected by both teammates and opponents. I just hope he can come back from his elbow surgery to provide help as a lefty setup man. ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/34 "2003-03-02T03:02:03Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Governor Quinn \* > \*\*Personally, I like the comment a friend of mine who grew up in Paris made on the subject. > > “The Americans complain about our view on the war because they love us dearly. Since they don’t care for Russia, China, or Germany, they can ignore what they say, but what the French think truly concerns the U.S.” \*\* Quite a bit of truth to that, I imagine. Russia and China are chock-full of playah hate-ahs, commies, and other unsavory types. Might as well write off what comes out there. Anyways, I don’t see Russia and China bending over backwards to find peaceful solutions to Chechnya, Tibet, etc. Most of the brave Germans died about 58 years ago. So what you have now is largely the offspring of those who hid under tables. So long as they don’t start getting all reminiscent about Sudetenland or some crap, it is safe to disregard them. But France? Our nations were founded by similiarly-inspired revolutionaries. We’ve helped each other out so many times throughout history. And now they are playing the role of the 'ho to Saddams pimp? Come on, France. You won’t lose _all_ of your Iraqi oil and weapons contracts after the war. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/35 "2003-03-02T03:04:58Z")
Umm, Brutus, barring the American Revolution – and possibly the Civil War, when France stayed neutral – when have the French helped us? And barring the World Wars and the Marshall Plan, what have we done for the French? ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/36 "2003-03-02T03:11:52Z")
If we quit stamping our little foot over France, do we get to threaten to hold our breath until the Turkish parliament votes to let us use their country as a staging area? ---
**Author:** ![Brutus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/91b2a8/32.png) [@Brutus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Brutus)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/37 "2003-03-02T03:16:26Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by The Peyote Coyote \* > \*\*Umm, Brutus, barring the American Revolution – and possibly the Civil War, when France stayed neutral – when have the French helped us? > > And barring the World Wars and the Marshall Plan, what have we done for the French? \*\* That more then most nations have in common, especially given the scope of those two acts. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/38 "2003-03-02T03:43:40Z")
Well, just for the sake of argument, Brutus, the French helped us in the Revolution more because they wanted to screw with the English than because they loved us. Remember reading about the war’s aftermath, when John Jay & our other ambassadors went behind France’s back to deal directly with the English because the French wanted to keep us relatively weak and confined to the Atlantic Seaboard? As for WW1, there were these little things called the Zimmerman Note and unrestricted submarine warfare. As for WW2, after Dec. 11, did we have any realistic choice? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Blalron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@Blalron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blalron)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/39 "2003-03-02T03:50:14Z")
> [@](#): > > barring the American Revolution – and possibly the Civil War, when France stayed neutral – when have the French helped us? What about when they gave us the Statue of fucking Liberty? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/5f8ce5/32.png) [@The\_Peyote\_Coyote](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Peyote_Coyote)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341/40 "2003-03-02T03:51:59Z")
I fucking forgot about that, Blalron, m’kay? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enough-with-the-francophobia/158341.md?page=3)