# Enterprise Borderland **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 29, 2004, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791 "2004-10-29T03:00:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/101 "2004-11-02T16:10:32Z")
Roman style slavery seemed to morph into the fuedal (futile) system of the Dark and Middle Ages which persisted in ways in the British Empire (rack renting landlords) of Colonial times. American slavery was simply the latest twist of man dominating man. YMMV It was a line that allowed viewers to put in perspective the wrongity\* of Soong’s ideals. And Trip helped put it Trek perspective by noting how those subjects of the Khanites no doubt felt. So, even tho it rankles me that people still link the South of today with the American system of slavery (which the South admittedly was loathe to give up), in this context it works. (is that a retraction of my comment in my play by play posts? I post so much, it’s hard to tell. 😛 ) - it IS too a word! Look it up, I dares ya! ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/102 "2004-11-02T16:16:49Z")
> [@tracer](#): > > Presenting _Star Trek: The Original Series: SPECIAL EDITION_ ! > > We’ve digitally altered every Klingon to have head bumps, and have redone the previously **awful** effects sequence from “The Deadly Years” where 3 Romulan Birds of Prey looked like just one ship moving back and forth. Furthermore, we’ve replaced the crew’s phasers with walkie-talkies, and have changed “Devil in the Dark” so that the Horta fires first. We’ve also replaced the fine coffee Yeoman Colt normaly serves with a mixture of crushed dilithium, glass shards, and runny targ feces. How will Captain Pike react? Let’s watch… ---
**Author:** ![tracer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tracer/32/20578_2.png) [@tracer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tracer)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/103 "2004-11-02T16:27:10Z")
> [@NoClueBoy](#): > > American slavery was simply the latest twist of man dominating man. > > It was a line that allowed viewers to put in perspective the wrongity\* of Soong’s ideals. And Trip helped put it Trek perspective by noting how those subjects of the Khanites no doubt felt. The thing is, the Augments may have **so** many genetic differences from the average human that they could qualify as a whole 'nother species. (Much like mutants are considered _homo superior_ in the Marvel Comics universe.) In which case, their enslavement of normal humans would be on par with our use of pack animals. Nobody other that PETA calls it “slavery” if we enslave cows or horses. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/104 "2004-11-02T16:31:24Z")
Then we will have to push up the time table for the monkey rebellion. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/105 "2004-11-02T16:36:38Z")
_For too long, apes and monkeys have been under the thumb of man and the time has finally come to oppose that thumb!_ ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/106 "2004-11-02T17:22:29Z")
The unbelievable part is not that a technologically advanced civilization would still traffic in slaves - the part that I find hard to swallow is that they could get away with “randomly” kidnapping people from passing ships. That sort of thing is bound to attract the attention of surrounding systems that are gonna be less than pleased. So unless they have complete military dominance in their area, they wouldn’t last for long. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/107 "2004-11-02T17:31:50Z")
Don’t waste the horses, goddammit! Send a couple of pink skins. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/108 "2004-11-02T17:39:22Z")
> [@tracer](#): > > Nobody other that PETA calls it “slavery” if we enslave cows or horses. Cows and horses can’t talk. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/109 "2004-11-02T17:40:33Z")
Neither can mutes. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/110 "2004-11-02T17:42:01Z")
> [@NoClueBoy](#): > > it rankles me that people still link the South of today with the American system of slavery Forget not Delaware, my son. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/111 "2004-11-02T17:49:25Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > Neither can mutes. Humans have the ability to learn to communicate with each other. My point being some species are animals and another is called man. But this is one heck of a digression. Please pay the nurse. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/112 "2004-11-02T17:55:12Z")
Humans and dogs can and do communicate with one another, although non-verbally. If you want to discount them, then consider Lucy the Gorilla. Non-verbal again but there’s definite intelligence. Man is an animal as well. We just have pointier sticks and ways to throw rocks faster and harder. ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/113 "2004-11-02T18:07:05Z")
It may be a digression, but it’s an important one, and hopefully one that will be covered in more detail. Much like the TNG episode “Measure of a Man” established that a sentient android has rights in the federation, I think that an exploration of just what qualifies a species as sentient could make for an interesting episode in the best tradition of science fiction. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/114 "2004-11-02T19:41:26Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > Humans and dogs can and do communicate with one another, although non-verbally. If you want to discount them, then consider Lucy the Gorilla. As the spouse of a dog trainer, I assure you that dogs do not communicate, they learn that if I say A and they do B, they get a reward. Sophisticated, like the Rottie that was trained to dail 911 when his owner had siezures, and open the door for the med techs, but still only learned behavior. There are those who discount the signing apes. Koko is the one I’m vaguely familiar with. There is discussion that like Mrs. Plants dogs, she knows that making the sign for food gets an obvious reward. There was also discussion that she could only communicate with the person who trained her to use ASL. That would surely be a test; she should be able to sign to Handy “Help me get out of this cage!” A dog in Germany was recently in the news because of his incredible vocabulary in identifing his toys by name. Ask him “Where’s the DUCK, Alf?” and he will bring you the duck. But he can’t ask for another duck or say he is tired of teddy bears. Anyway, Mr. Smart Guy, only humans have written Gilgamesh, MacBeth and Star Trek. Blow that out your Jeffries tubes. ^:dubious:^ ---
**Author:** ![Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ebca7d/32.png) [@Linus\_Van\_Pelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linus_Van_Pelt)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/115 "2004-11-02T20:00:47Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > Anyway, Mr. Smart Guy, only humans have written Gilgamesh, MacBeth and Star Trek. Blow that out your Jeffries tubes. > > ^:dubious:^ Now what am I going to do with these million typing monkeys? “Best of times, Blurst of times” Sheesh! ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/116 "2004-11-02T20:04:54Z")
Sounds like an Alice Cooper song. Million! Typing mon-keys! ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/117 "2004-11-02T20:49:22Z")
> [@Linus Van Pelt](#): > > Now what am I going to do with these million typing monkeys? Submit scripts to Andromeda? ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/118 "2004-11-02T23:45:30Z")
Koko is who I meant… no idea why I said Lucy. So far as speaking and writing _Gilgamesh_, _Trek_, and \*MacBeth \*goes: 1a) we’re one of only a dozen or so species with paws dexterous enough to write 1b) we’re one of even less species with larynxes specialized enough to use such a wide variety of noises and 2) writing was independently invented by only two or three cultures (Phoenicians and Chinese are the only two that come immediately to mind), so they must be more intelligent than all those before or after by your standards. And, finally, take a five year old human and a chimpanzee of equivalant age and put them both on a deserted island and see which one lives longer. Which is smarter then? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2004, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/119 "2004-11-03T00:42:44Z")
I’m going to speak to your Mother about letting you stay up and watch _Planet of the Apes_. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2004, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791/120 "2004-11-03T00:44:58Z")
I’ve never seen the first one and am quite proud of it too. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/enterprise-borderland/271791.md?page=7)