# Entrapment - Police whores and stupid fundamentalists **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 19, 2012, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353 "2012-02-19T21:14:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/41 "2012-02-21T17:20:25Z")
> [@Testy](#): > > I would think that Florida would be a place where seriously dangerous drugs (crack/meth/major opiates) would be quite common. Chasing kids (or young adults) around for smoking pot seems to be focusing on a minor problem while ignoring a major one. Spoken like a man who’s never watched _Reefer Madness_. Ignorance is bliss. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/42 "2012-02-21T17:40:09Z")
It’s a gateway retail product. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/43 "2012-02-21T18:00:43Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Your problem is not the conduct of the officer. You simply don’t believe the conduct should be illegal, period. > > Right? Wrong. I can believe that jaywalking should be illegal and still be angry that the police department is putting attractive female officers in the middle of a city block trying to get young men to cross the street with her. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/44 "2012-02-21T18:07:11Z")
> [@saoirse](#): > > Wrong. I can believe that jaywalking should be illegal and still be angry that the police department is putting attractive female officers in the middle of a city block trying to get young men to cross the street with her. Yes, you “can.” What do you actually believe with respect to pot? ---
**Author:** ![Dissonance](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/85f322/32.png) [@Dissonance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dissonance)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/45 "2012-02-21T18:10:40Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Outrageous? Why? > > Absent the presence of an undercover officer, we might easily imagine that a high schooler would be asked by a classmate to find drugs. That’s the precise evil being combatted here. > > Your problem is not the conduct of the officer. You simply don’t believe the conduct should be illegal, period. > > Right? Absent the presence of an undercover officer, we might easily imagine that a high schooler would be asked by a classmate to find alcohol. When the last time an undercover officer was sent to try to see if they could score a six-pack from a teenager? It’s possible to find it outrageous on a basis other than pot legalization. ---
**Author:** ![Testy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c37758/32.png) [@Testy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Testy)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/46 "2012-02-21T18:23:45Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > Spoken like a man who’s never watched _Reefer Madness_. Ignorance is bliss. **Kobal2** I always thought it was the _pianos_ that actually caused the problem.🙂 Testy ---
**Author:** ![Evil\_Captor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/f17d59/32.png) [@Evil\_Captor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Evil_Captor)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/47 "2012-02-21T18:30:10Z")
Both cases, serious waste of resources. Pointless and stupid. Book em, Dano! ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/48 "2012-02-21T18:51:00Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Absent the presence of an undercover officer, we might easily imagine that a high schooler would be asked by a classmate to find alcohol. When the last time an undercover officer was sent to try to see if they could score a six-pack from a teenager? I don’t know, but how is this question relevant? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/49 "2012-02-21T19:49:21Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Given that an 18-year-old “boy” is legally an adult and considered fully responsible for his own actions, I’m not sure I agree that “my dick made me do it” ought to be accepted as a mitigating excuse. > > If young men are really that helpless at controlling their behavior when confronted with feminine wiles, that might be an argument for raising the legal age of majority for males from 18 back to 21, or whatever age it’s reasonable to consider young men to be responsible adults. Hell, let’s just take away the vote from all of us guys, and let you women run the world. (Y’all can’t do any worse than we have.) At pretty much any age, we men are, as a group, pretty stupid when our dicks are trying to call the shots, whether we’re talking about pussy, or manhood-related issues like war. ---
**Author:** ![miss\_elizabeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/838e76/32.png) [@miss\_elizabeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/miss_elizabeth)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/50 "2012-02-21T21:47:33Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > Hell, let’s just take away the vote from all of us guys, and let you women run the world. (Y’all can’t do any worse than we have.) > > At pretty much any age, we men are, as a group, pretty stupid when our dicks are trying to call the shots, whether we’re talking about pussy, or manhood-related issues like war. That’s a pretty sexist statement. I think men and women alike can be pretty foolish when it comes to sex and love. Certainly, a great many women have done dumb shit for someone they cared for. I think humanity is just a flawed species. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Angel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/d26b3c/32.png) [@Johnny\_Angel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Angel)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2012, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/51 "2012-02-21T23:22:05Z")
I have a hypothesis which may be relevant to the issue of entrapment in general. Recently, a US representative got in trouble for sending pictures of himself around the internet. By its nature, this kind of behavior is new, except that there have presumably always been those with exhibitionist tendencies, which manifested in different intensities according to the individual. Those we know as flashers have exhibitionist desires intense enough to drive them out to public parks wearing sneakers and a raincoat. In others, the desire did not manifest itself in such behavior, because the barrier to fulfillment exceeded desire. I think perhaps with the internet, we’re going to see a lot of people come out of the woodwork whose exhibitionism is low-level enough to be acted on only when it becomes comparatively easy to do, as it now is on the internet. Likewise, I think that there are probably many people out there who would commit a horrible act only if the opportunity were handed to them on a silver platter. And we’re not just talking about Muslims angry at America, but many Americans angry at Americans. Let’s say, just as an example, that for every person who would plan the execution-style murder of an abortion provider, there are more than a few who would never actually shoot an abortion doctor if they had to provide the initiative themselves, but would if the logistics were handled for them. To what extent are potential murders who have to be hand-fed the ways and means to commit the crime a threat? And how would spending enormous resources to take out only one such person significantly diminish the threat? One argument I could see them making is that the real goal is to make impressionable young potential terrorists skittish about trusting fellow Muslims who appear eager to recruit them. I’ve never heard of a law enforcement agency acknowledging such a tactic, but on first blush it sounds like it might be useful to foster distrust in a community. As for the approach law enforcement takes to pot, I don’t think marijuana is a serious threat, but if you need to count coup, it’s probably easier to pick on potheads. They’re less likely to be armed, and they’re more likely to have property worth seizing than, say, crackheads. I recently watched A/K/A Tommy Chong, a documentary which may skew the Netflix recommendations I receive for a while. The setup by which the Justice Department nailed Tommy Chong is an eye-roller, and while I don’t have any proof, I blame marijuana for the fact that they fell for it. Tommy Chong had a bong-making business, or his son did I guess, and The Law kept nagging them to ship them to a state where they were not allowed to ship them. They finally sent the guy around to the actual storefront where he ordered one of everything they didn’t currently have on display, and he said he was coming to pick them up when the order was ready. Then the Justice Department sat back and snickered while this order clogged up the loading docs until finally Chong et al just shipped the damned things. Busted. It was a pro-Chong documentary, but the press conference clips seemed to unabashedly admit that Tommy Chong had been targeted specifically because he made films that “glamorized drugs” and ridiculed law enforcement efforts to combat them. It sounded to me like they were admitting to a backdoor first-amendment violation, but I’m not a civil rights attorney. Anyway, Tommy Chong got I think eight months in minimum security. It sure looks to me like the whole operation was chicken-shit from end-to-end. They picked on an old pothead because of some films he made decades ago (are they still in heavy rotation at Comedy Central?) to score a facile merely symbolic victory that changed nothing except inter-departmental circle-jerk, a little publicity and career advancement. That’ll teach the young people not to ship bongs across certain state lines! ---
**Author:** ![newcomer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e5b9ba/32.png) [@newcomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newcomer)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/52 "2012-02-22T02:06:32Z")
> [@Johnny\_Angel](#): > > One argument I could see them making is that the real goal is to make impressionable young potential terrorists skittish about trusting fellow Muslims who appear eager to recruit them. I’ve never heard of a law enforcement agency acknowledging such a tactic, but on first blush it sounds like it might be useful to foster distrust in a community. I’d agree with this if this was something with less consequences for the community itself and global impact this kind of theatre brings. To follow your example, just imagine how would serial entrapment of potential abortion clinics bombers do to the discourse in American politics. So, while I agree with your general thinking (as in, you’ll find people in a certain state of mind ready to do things for various reasons) I disagree with a specific reason. On contrary, I think the reason is to maintain the level of manufactured fear for political purposes. As in, do you really think that they netted Spitzer by chance? Same thing. Someone has an agenda. ---
**Author:** ![jlzania](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/67e7ee/32.png) [@jlzania](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jlzania)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/53 "2012-02-22T14:56:29Z")
According to recent FBI statistics, violent crime has dropped by about 6% and crimes against property by 2.7%. However there has been a surge in the privation of the penal system since the 1980s by companies like CCA, GEO group and Wackenhut . > [@](#): > > Founded in the 1980s and fueled by the increase in mass incarceration, companies such as CCA and the GEO Group saw explosive growth through the early 1990s. As tough-on-crime measures such as mandatory minimum sentencing, truth-in-sentencing and Three-Strikes laws helped to pack American prisons, corrections companies saw a windfall in profits. > > In the early 1980s, there were hardly any private adult prisons in the U.S. By 1990, there were 67 privately run detention facilities, with an average population of 7,000 inmates. > > For decades, the corporations that manage private prisons have been considered solid investments for hedge fund managers. However, with the drop in crimes rates and early release programs, corporations like CCA (Corrections Corporation of America) and GEO saw profits falling. > Luckily, 911 proved a windfall for both… > > In the aftermath of the terror attacks, private prisons landed profitable contracts with the U.S. Marshals, the federal Bureau of Prisons, and Immigration and Customs Enforcement, which began to expand its detention of immigrants. > > “It was because of [concerns about] immigration and the uptick in federal detention contracts that they were able to survive,” said Emily Tucker, advocacy policy director of Detention Watch. “Between about 2001 and 2011, it’s been a pretty solid investment.” > > And a profitable one: by 2010, GEO Group and CCA combined were posting annual revenues of nearly $3 billion. > > Although financial analysts still rate the GEO Group and CCA as solid investments, they note that budget constraints and trends toward decarceration will slow growth, unless states hard push for privatization. > [THECRIMEREPORT.ORG](http://www.thecrimereport.org/archive/2012-02-profiting-from-prisons) In February, CCA (Corrections Coporation of America) sent a letter to 48 cash strapped states offering to purchase prisons outright. The catch? The states had to guarantee a 90% occupancy rate. And who better to stock the prisons with than pot smokers and incompetent terrorists? ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/54 "2012-02-22T15:02:12Z")
> [@jlzania](#): > > In February, CCA (Corrections Coporation of America) sent a letter to 48 cash strapped states offering to purchase prisons outright. > The catch? > The states had to guarantee a 90% occupancy rate. > And who better to stock the prisons with than pot smokers and incompetent terrorists? Well, anyone besides incompetent terrorists? They go to federal prisons, not state prisons. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/55 "2012-02-22T15:02:40Z")
I’m pretty sure the Feds haven’t guaranteed a minimum occupancy rate. ---
**Author:** ![jlzania](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/67e7ee/32.png) [@jlzania](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jlzania)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/56 "2012-02-22T15:22:56Z")
No the fed’s haven’t guaranteed an occupancy rate (nor have any states yet, at least to the best of my knowledge) but if you’ll reread the quote I provided, "“It was because of [concerns about] immigration and the\*\* uptick in federal detention contracts \*\*that they were able to survive,” said Emily Tucker, advocacy policy director of Detention Watch. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/57 "2012-02-22T15:27:51Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Yes, you “can.” > > What do you actually believe with respect to pot? That’s irrelevant, unless you were using “simply” in some unconventional way. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/58 "2012-02-22T15:30:19Z")
> [@Johnny\_Angel](#): > > I recently watched A/K/A Tommy Chong, a documentary which may skew the Netflix recommendations I receive for a while. The setup by which the Justice Department nailed Tommy Chong is an eye-roller, and while I don’t have any proof, I blame marijuana for the fact that they fell for it. Tommy Chong had a bong-making business, or his son did I guess, and The Law kept nagging them to ship them to a state where they were not allowed to ship them. They finally sent the guy around to the actual storefront where he ordered one of everything they didn’t currently have on display, and he said he was coming to pick them up when the order was ready. Then the Justice Department sat back and snickered while this order clogged up the loading docs until finally Chong et al just shipped the damned things. Busted. Does that scenario even make sense to you? There’s a federal crime committed when you ship bongs to certain states, but not to other states, based solely on the state’s laws? No. Under federal law (21 USC § 863), it is a crime anywhere in the country to sell or offer for sale drug paraphernalia, to use the mails or any other facility of interstate commerce to transport drug paraphernalia, or to import or export drug paraphernalia. You may dislike this law, but you can hardly argue that Chong, and his son, were violating it. They weren’t harangued or tempted into violating it. They had a business which sold bongs. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/59 "2012-02-22T15:32:25Z")
> [@saoirse](#): > > That’s irrelevant, unless you were using “simply” in some unconventional way. No. I made a prediction. My prediction is either correct or incorrect. ---
**Author:** ![saoirse](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5daacb/32.png) [@saoirse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/saoirse)\ **Post date:** [February 22, 2012, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353/60 "2012-02-22T15:36:19Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > No. I made a prediction. My prediction is either correct or incorrect. Assuming that you are using “simply” the way an ordinary person would in that sentence, you are wrong, and I would guess you are wrong about everyone who has posted in this thread so far. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entrapment-police-whores-and-stupid-fundamentalists/613353.md?page=4)