# Entropy Question: How is the Sun more ordered than Earth? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 26, 2012, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205 "2012-11-26T22:17:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Strain\_of\_Thought](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3be4f8/32.png) [@Strain\_of\_Thought](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strain_of_Thought)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2012, 6:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205/21 "2012-11-27T06:13:49Z")
> [@Hero\_From\_Sector\_7G](#): > > While it doesn’t officially address the biology questions, [this](http://www.poe-news.com/forums/sp.php?pi=1002151287) is the absolute best layman explanation of entropy I have ever read. This was a really fascinating link, and it illustrates some things I already mostly knew very very well and introduces some things I didn’t in very creative ways, but it doesn’t actually explain what entropy is- the author explicitly states several times that he hasn’t gotten to entropy yet, that it’s all primer, spread over several posts, and I’ve read through the whole thread and he never ultimately gets to entropy before running out of steam. Or caloric, I suppose. It supports the stuff people are saying here about perceiving the Sun in terms of a Hot Sun/Cold Space system, but it actually contradicts what’s being said about an increase in entropy resulting in an increase in information, and meshes with a lot of how I currently conceive of physical information. Essentially, information requires unevenness. In order for a thing to exist in a pattern, that thing must vary between at least two states. In a system with maximum entropy, everything is “flat”. Entropy cannot increase because energy is evenly distributed and has no impulse to move around any further. So there’s nowhere to record information- it’s like trying to write your name with a fountain pen on the surface of a pool of ink. ---
**Author:** ![Frylock](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ce7236/32.png) [@Frylock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frylock)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2012, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205/22 "2012-11-27T10:59:21Z")
> [@Strain\_of\_Thought](#): > > Essentially, information requires unevenness. In order for a thing to exist in a pattern, that thing must vary between at least two states. In a system with maximum entropy, everything is “flat”. Entropy cannot increase because energy is evenly distributed and has no impulse to move around any further. So there’s nowhere to record information- it’s like trying to write your name with a fountain pen on the surface of a pool of ink. This is what I believed as well. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Strangelove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.strangelove/32/6613_2.png) [@Dr.Strangelove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Strangelove)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2012, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205/23 "2012-11-27T11:25:57Z")
> [@Strain\_of\_Thought](#): > > Essentially, information requires unevenness. In order for a thing to exist in a pattern, that thing must vary between at least two states. In a system with maximum entropy, everything is “flat”. Entropy cannot increase because energy is evenly distributed and has no impulse to move around any further. So there’s nowhere to record information- it’s like trying to write your name with a fountain pen on the surface of a pool of ink. Assuming you’re talking about something like a thermal gas–it’s flat macroscopically, but not microscopically. Microscopically, it’s highly disordered and uneven. As such, it contains a great deal of information (although it may not be useful to you). Contrast with something like a perfect crystal. Again flat macroscopically, but microscopically as well. It cannot contain any information unless the pattern is disturbed–and that must necessarily increase the entropy. ---
**Author:** ![naita](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naita/32/5862_2.png) [@naita](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/naita)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2012, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205/24 "2012-11-27T12:05:10Z")
Sun state 1. protons neatly contained in a hot ball state 2. helium nuclei + photons and neutrinos eventually shooting into space state 2 has higher entropy than step 1 Earth state 1. various elements somewhat randomly distributed in a rocky ball state 2. rocky ball with highly organised organic molecules all over the surface state 2 has lower entropy than state 1 Sun-Earth state 1. frigging huge ball of protons and tiny rocky ball state 2. frigging huge ball of protons, plus huge, but comparably tiny amount of helium, plus actually tiny rocky ball with insignificant amounts of highly organised organic molecules all over the surface, and an insignificantly lower number of photons speeding into space, oh, and neutrinos. state 2 has higher entropy than state 1 ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [November 27, 2012, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205/25 "2012-11-27T20:25:04Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > … or the directions for assembling your Ikea bookshelf: There’s plenty of information there now. You have apparently never read a set of Ikea instructions. 😉 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/entropy-question-how-is-the-sun-more-ordered-than-earth/642205.md?page=1)