# Epic Story! "The Mystery Of The Transvestite And The Stolen Car "\[now a debate on slurs\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 30, 2012, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766 "2012-06-30T02:16:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/61 "2012-07-07T06:49:42Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > This is a “caught in a compromising situation” story, not a “make fun of somebody because they are different” story. I could not disagree more. This is a ‘laugh at the person who is different’ story. Don’t believe it? Turn the prostitute into a sexy woman. The story ceases to have any meaning or purpose. ---
**Author:** ![Kenm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bc79bd/32.png) [@Kenm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kenm)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 6:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/62 "2012-07-07T06:50:07Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > Look at Eve’s first post. The proper option would have been for **Eve** not to try to elevate the situation out of proportion by equating the word tranny to the same level as nigger and faggot. [**Urban Dictionary:**](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tranny) > [@](#): > > An extremely offensive term for a transsexual man or woman, or any of the transgendered community. > > On the same level as “nigger”, and “cunt” for most people, though, like “dyke”, some of the transgendered community are trying to reclaim the word, without much success. > “So your girlfriend’s a tranny?” “… Please don’t say that… She’s a woman, just like you are.” [**Wikipedia:**](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tranny) > [@](#): > > Pejorative term for: > • Transgender, a general term applied to a variety of individuals, behaviors, and groups involving tendencies to vary from culturally conventional gender roles [**ChaCha:**](http://www.chacha.com/question/what-is-a-tranny) > [@](#): > > A tranny - a derogatory term for a transgender person [**Renee James:**](http://reneejamesauthor.com/tag/tranny/) > [@](#): > > The universal target of transgender word police—and most of the rest of us–is the word tranny. It is widely considered a pejorative term among transgender people, mainly because of its association with smut web sites. Those sites also exploit the term she-male which is even more abhorrent to most transwomen. ---
**Author:** ![jackdavinci](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackdavinci/32/3259_2.png) [@jackdavinci](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackdavinci)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/63 "2012-07-07T07:11:44Z")
> [@DocCathode](#): > > I could not disagree more. This is a ‘laugh at the person who is different’ story. Don’t believe it? Turn the prostitute into a sexy woman. The story ceases to have any meaning or purpose. The man is angry his car got stolen. The valet mentions its a shame, because she was a smoking hot babe in tight yellow pants that left nothing to the imagination. Yellow pants? The man starts to perspire and hastily avoids talking to the police having realized the woman he cheated on his wife with stole his car. Same story, same point. The cross dressing added a tiny bit of extra color and a reason for the guy to realize he knew who stole the car. ---
**Author:** ![MostlyClueless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@MostlyClueless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MostlyClueless)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 8:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/64 "2012-07-07T08:26:43Z")
Holy shit, just a couple of posts more and we’ve got a derailment bingo! [You can play along!](http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l4tsm8Y6d71qzwpsgo1_1280.jpg) I’m with Eve here. ‘Tranny’ is a slur. I’m willing to believe some of you didn’t know. Now you do. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/65 "2012-07-07T10:58:50Z")
> [@MostlyClueless](#): > > Holy shit, just a couple of posts more and we’ve got a derailment bingo! > > [You can play along!](http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l4tsm8Y6d71qzwpsgo1_1280.jpg) > > I’m with Eve here. ‘Tranny’ is a slur. I’m willing to believe some of you didn’t know. Now you do. While it is a slur, the word “transvestite” is too long and technical for regular speech. Trans, if not tranny, or something is going to become the norm, and I think that most use of the word “tranny” in the case of the Dope or the New York Times is simply to move in that direction. If you try to move people towards saying, “transvestite”, you’re going to fail, but trans is probably an easy sell. (Fundamentally, a word is only derogatory if there’s any negative intent.) ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 1:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/66 "2012-07-07T13:13:27Z")
> [@jackdavinci](#): > > The man is angry his car got stolen. The valet mentions its a shame, because she was a smoking hot babe in tight yellow pants that left nothing to the imagination. Yellow pants? The man starts to perspire and hastily avoids talking to the police having realized the woman he cheated on his wife with stole his car. > > Same story, same point. So, without the cross dressing the cheater only sweats a bit? But with the cross dressing he bursts into tears and is willing to give up his truck? And you think it’s still the same story? **Sage Rat** Jap is shorter than ‘Japanese person’ should we use that too? Paki is shorter than ‘Pakistani’ should we use that too? ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 1:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/67 "2012-07-07T13:30:58Z")
> [@Sage\_Rat](#): > > While it is a slur, the word “transvestite” is too long and technical for regular speech. No offense, but if the excuse for someone using “tranny” is that it’s too haaaaaaaaard or too complicated to type all those words, they’re beyond help and should probably not leave their mom’s basement. Some of you folks, doggone it…how disappointing. I don’t want to lecture or hector (but that’s exactly what I’m doing… :smack: )…I can’t believe folks (not referring to Sage Rat whose post I quoted) interact with human beings in real-life society the way you do on the SDMB. Internet tough talk is just that, because I’m sure the first time anyone walked up to a relevant audience and exclaimed “hey, nigger is just a word, words don’t have any power!” or “hey Jews, don’t pressure me into not using kike! It’s just, like, words and stuff, man!” or even “why don’t you like Polack jokes, Jerzy? Do you hate free speech?” they’d either be shunned from society or would get their ass kicked. I don’t think I have ever heard “tranny” used in anything but a derogatory manner, and I think I’ve only heard an actual TS/TG person use it a couple of times themselves. The people who don’t think it’s offensive likely don’t treat it seriously because all those “trannies” running around are, well, _funny._ They’re just dudes dressing up as chicks to have sex, right? Or milquetoast ersatz males feminized by a domineering wife with rolling pin in hand. Or ultra butch dykes who want to steal the white man’s womenfolk. Of course the reality is that they’re the last major group who it’s still “teh kewl” to denigrate and I while I don’t think she coined the phrase, I quote Guinastasia for writing the painful words to the effect of “you may not be pulled over for ‘driving while transsexual,’ but you won’t be disowned by your entire family for being black.” Even the LGB community tends to show thinly veiled contempt for those embarrassing “T’s”, and my experience with a very large number of those “T’s” is that some of them tend to be quite vicious, backbiting, and cruel even towards each other. I’ve certainly witnessed it on the SDMB, as well as IRL. Many other oppressed minorities in history at least had their family and community to rely on - transsexuals and the transgendered are often cast out to the metaphorical wolves, and to survive requires extraordinary strength of will and self-reliance. Doing them the service of typing a few extra letters seems like a small enough courtesy, I mean, in lieu of giving them the right to marry who they want, enacting legal workplace anti-discrimination protection, or recognizing the right not to be jeered at, physically abused, or even killed outright (need I visit Google to find links?) Hell, you can even type “TG” or “TS”; fewer letters still (except you are required to press the \ key…UNLESS YOU TYPE IN ALL CAPS IN WHICH CASE ITS COOL.) If “tranny” is used out of ignorance I don’t want to hold anyone’s feet to the fire; it’s a mistake and doesn’t need to be harped on. But when told it’s offensive, by several persons, please consider that it might just be that, and err on the side of politeness? ---
**Author:** ![living\_in\_hell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3d9bf3/32.png) [@living\_in\_hell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/living_in_hell)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/68 "2012-07-07T14:22:38Z")
@Una: You know the difference between how I talk about people in real life? I ASK them. Yes, I really do. I ask, “does x term offend you? How do you prefer to be identified/described whatever?” I don’t come in and speak for others about what should or should not be said… That is the equivalent of spreading Christ throughout the uninlightened countries…let people tell you what they want. If you ask, they will. 😉 @Guin: That’s a great comparison. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Una\_Persson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/una_persson/32/346_2.png) [@Una\_Persson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Una_Persson)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/69 "2012-07-07T14:29:04Z")
> [@living\_in\_hell](#): > > @Una: > You know the difference between how I talk about people in real life? I ASK them. Yes, I really do. I ask, "does x term offend you? Sounds like a good policy in general. But if you can’t ask because you’re referring to, say a news article or an event, you need a default mode of politely referring to a person, true? ---
**Author:** ![living\_in\_hell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3d9bf3/32.png) [@living\_in\_hell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/living_in_hell)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/70 "2012-07-07T14:38:35Z")
Great question. I tend to use the accumulated majority preferred term from my own experience, among the population in question. For example, if I asked 50 Puerto Ricans over the years what identifiers they preferred, and they all said, “Puerto Rican” then I would use it. In fact, every Puerto Rican I have mentioned “Latino” to, looks at me like I have ten heads. African American is another one. :rolleyes: People can do more damage with that term than they think. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/71 "2012-07-07T15:11:56Z")
> [@living\_in\_hell](#): > > I don’t come in and speak for others about what should or should not be said… So only a black person can say that nigger is offensive? Only a gay man can say that faggot is offensive? > [@](#): > > That is the equivalent of spreading Christ throughout the uninlightened countries Have you read the board slogan lately? Our whole purpose is for those who know something to share with those who don’t know. ---
**Author:** ![living\_in\_hell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3d9bf3/32.png) [@living\_in\_hell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/living_in_hell)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/72 "2012-07-07T15:50:26Z")
“Have you read the board slogan lately? Our whole purpose is for those who know something to share with those who don’t know.” Riiiiiiiiight. Because everyone here is so smart and enlightened that they could fight the ignorance of the rest of the world by schooling them on how to be fooled by a skydiving quad? 😃 Give me a break. I have met homeless, unemployed, high school dropouts smarter than a lot of people here. Get over your holier than thou stance. You can’t say you know what is best for anyone other than yourself…unless you want us to decide what’s best for you. Yes I recognize the irony here. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/73 "2012-07-07T15:54:21Z")
> [@living\_in\_hell](#): > > Give me a break. I have met homeless, unemployed, high school dropouts smarter than a lot of people here. If your opinion of the Dopers is so low, why not leave? > [@](#): > > Get over your holier than thou stance. You can’t say you know what is best for anyone other than yourself So you ARE saying that as a white, straight man I cannot say that nigger or faggot is offensive? ---
**Author:** ![florez](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b9e5f3/32.png) [@florez](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/florez)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/74 "2012-07-07T16:40:37Z")
“Tranny” is a slur, and the last time I noticed the term being used on the board it was in a derisive comment about certain unacceptable people at gay pride events, and people noticed that the use of the term was offensive then. Also, I appreciate Eve trying to give people a clue, and I thought that Living in Hell had left and gone back to hell already. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/75 "2012-07-07T17:53:31Z")
> [@Hypno-Toad](#): > > It was a link to a mediocre story that was hijacked into an argument because one person wanted to have a fight. If Eve had simply let it go, no one would even remember this thread. > [@](#): > > It was Eve’s response to the OP that I object to. It was borderline threadshitting. I get very annoyed when people intrude on a thread just to announce that the OP is bad. Yes, how terrible people aren’t letting our use of oppressive language go by unchallenged. It makes me so upset when people call me on my shit. I ought to feel completely comfortable about using oppressive language. Why can’t they just let me use my oppressive language in peace? If they had any respect whatsoever for freedom of speech, they’d sit down and shut up. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/76 "2012-07-07T18:30:59Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m with Eve here. ‘Tranny’ is a slur. I’m willing to believe some of you didn’t know. Now you do. I didn’t know it was such an offensive word (though I never used it as it simply seemed vulgar). Now I do know and I for one am appreciative that Eve and others pointed it out. ---
**Author:** ![living\_in\_hell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3d9bf3/32.png) [@living\_in\_hell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/living_in_hell)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/77 "2012-07-07T19:47:58Z")
I was listening to all the men who identify as women on Rupaul’s Drag Race use the word “tranny.” Clearly they could learn a lot from everyone here. Shame shame shame on them. For all of you who speak on behalf of others, you do realize that is more marginalizing right? I’m curious how many saviours here actually have ever met a tranny and asked that person how they feel about the language? Anyone? Or is it easier to find a bunch of info that supports their own distorted political correctness? Telling anyone what to say or how to say it shuts down dialogue; it doesn’t open it up. We have general understanding of hate speech because it’s commonplace discourse, not because we keep it quiet. ---
**Author:** ![alice\_in\_wonderland](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alice_in_wonderland/32/176_2.png) [@alice\_in\_wonderland](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alice_in_wonderland)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/78 "2012-07-07T19:55:39Z")
> [@living\_in\_hell](#): > > I’m curious how many saviours here actually have ever met a tranny and asked that person how they feel about the language? Anyone? . Everyone participating in this thread. I think perhaps you believe that you are making a stand here for the oppressed. Or something. You are actually making yourself look like an ass. ---
**Author:** ![DocCathode](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doccathode/32/18773_2.png) [@DocCathode](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DocCathode)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 7:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/79 "2012-07-07T19:55:42Z")
> [@living\_in\_hell](#): > > I was listening to all the men who identify as women on Rupaul’s Drag Race use the word “tranny.” Clearly they could learn a lot from everyone here. Shame shame shame on them. And black rappers use the word “nigger” all the time. And gay men have been known to use the words “fag” and “faggot”. I’ve read a few issues of a magazine for Jews, by Jews entitle Heeb. > [@](#): > > I’m curious how many saviours here actually have ever met a tranny It’s been explained to you that word is offensive. Why do you insist on using it? As for your question, yes I have a friend who is a transwoman. She’s the first person I ever heard draw a direct comparison between “she male” and “nigger” > [@](#): > > Or is it easier to find a bunch of info that supports their own distorted political correctness? Avoiding hate speech is not the same as political correctness. > [@](#): > > Telling anyone what to say or how to say it shuts down dialogue; it doesn’t open it up. How does calling people trannies, kikes and niggers open up dialogue? ETA **Living In Hell** please answer the questions I asked in post 73. ---
**Author:** ![living\_in\_hell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/3d9bf3/32.png) [@living\_in\_hell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/living_in_hell)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2012, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766/80 "2012-07-07T20:01:13Z")
> [@alice\_in\_wonderland](#): > > Everyone participating in this thread. > > I think perhaps you believe that you are making a stand here for the oppressed. Or something. > > You are actually making yourself look like an ass. Everyone. :rolleyes: You know, you’re right. I am making myself look like an ass. Yes, that’s it. I have no knowledge of anything about discourse around cultural difference and am just some naiive yahoo. That’s exactly it. Thanks for personalizing it and enlightening me about me. I am wrong wrong wrong. 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/epic-story-the-mystery-of-the-transvestite-and-the-stolen-car-now-a-debate-on-slurs/626766.md?page=5)