# ESPN and the coach's racist remarks: A question of journalistic ethics **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 30, 2005, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899 "2005-04-30T22:49:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/21 "2005-05-02T04:39:39Z")
Hmmm, I would say it’s all semantics, but I don’t want anybody to think I hate Jews. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![mhendo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mhendo/32/3159_2.png) [@mhendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mhendo)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 4:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/22 "2005-05-02T04:45:29Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > From what I read I just think Cochell has a problem with a certain segment of blacks. Blacks that are lazy or bad students, and in his mind these types of blacks are “niggers.” Here’s a suggestion. Maybe, if he’s talking about a black person who is lazy, or a bad student, he could call them “lazy” or “a bad student.” Pretty radical idea, huh? ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/23 "2005-05-02T04:50:30Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > When talking about groups of people we dislike we tend to oversimplify things. > > You talk about Nazis for example you get oversimplifications. There’s lots of Nazis that really weren’t bad people, and they were in a situation where they didn’t have many choices or didn’t perceive many choices other than joining the party. > > I tend to use racist when talking about someone that shows prejudice from a position of power, or obviously finds his race to be superior to others. He certainly thinks blacks are inferior. His comments clearly imply he thinks black are niggers until proved otherwise. Thinking that blacks or any other group are more lazy, etc. by nature makes you racist. > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > We haven’t really seen that here. Bill Cosby for example decries what he sees as a large segment of young black America that has become basically worthless because of bad parenting and a lack of personal drive. Cosby has made a stand against a segment of a population, that doesn’t mean he’s “racist” or “self-hating.” He’s just correctly or incorrectly found a segment of a population that he has problems with. Bill Cosby didn’t use racial epithets, nor did he make statements that are prejudiced and bigoted. It’s a completely different scenario. > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > From what I read I just think Cochell has a problem with a certain segment of blacks. Blacks that are lazy or bad students, and in his mind these types of blacks are “niggers.” The particular word is a “racist” word (as racist as a word can be, anyways) and shows a lack of tact and empathy for the problems of racial minorities. But he’s also showing that he doesn’t have prejudiced feelings about blacks as a population, and if you don’t have prejudiced feelings about blacks in general then you aren’t racist. He assumes blacks are lazy, etc., so when one doesn’t exhibit those traits, he/she is worthy of praise. This is as racist as it gets. In fact, it’s worse than being open about it. That’s why he said what he said. He thought it was a compliment. A statement of his amazement that this one black guy didn’t act like the person his skin color dictates he should be. > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > For example if I hate white truck drivers because I think they’re all fat stupid losers, that doesn’t make me a racist just because the truck drivers are white. There are so many problem with this analogy, it’s not even worth deconstructing. > [@Martin Hyde](#): > > Or for another example, if you hate pit bulls that doesn’t mean you are a specist or “anti dog.” It just means you hate a particular type of dog (and in all of the cases I’ve listed, and including Cochell’s case, we can’t really say that hating one particular group is acceptable, it just isn’t the same as racism which is the irrational hatred or dislike of an entire population.) > > It’s still a form of prejudice that’s not really socially acceptable but it isn’t racism. Again, another terrible analogy. The worst part of this whole thing is that meeting this kid didn’t make him re-evaluate his opinion of blacks. That kid became an exception to the rule, rather than an indication that the rule was bullshit. I don’t understand how this is so hard to see. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 5:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/24 "2005-05-02T05:05:25Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > He certainly thinks blacks are inferior. His comments clearly imply he thinks black are niggers until proved otherwise. Horseshit. You have no clue what percentage of blacks this guy thinks are lazy, and you have no clue what sort of person he is and what his attitudes are. Some people do, though: > [@](#): > > “He has apologized,” Joe Dunigan Jr. told The Oklahoman. "Those words are powerful and derisive. They were inappropriate and offensive. But he is a man who has done so many good things in his life. > > “He has treated us like family,” he continued. “We have broken bread with him. I know he is a Christian man. We all say things that we don’t mean, and I hope people down there don’t color him as a racist because he made a mistake.” > > Both Dunigans and Charles Caufield, the father of Chuckie Caufield, the only other black player on the team, had told The Oklahoman they wanted Cochell to keep his job. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/25 "2005-05-02T05:11:55Z")
> [@furt](#): > > Horseshit. You have no clue what percentage of blacks this guy thinks are lazy, and you have no clue what sort of person he is and what his attitudes are. Some people do, though: I think it’s perfectly valid to judge a person by the things they say. I bet most racists have a few people that will testify about how great their people are, it doesn’t mean they aren’t racist. I didn’t say the other things he’s done shouldn’t be weighed in consideration of how good a person he is. What I said was that his comments show he is racist. It doesn’t matter what percentage of any group he thinks is lazy. It’s the fact that he thinks a group is inherently lazy that is the problem. ---
**Author:** ![furt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/439d5e/32.png) [@furt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/furt)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/26 "2005-05-02T06:15:54Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > What I said was that his comments show he is racist. It doesn’t matter what percentage of any group he thinks is lazy. It’s the fact that he thinks a group is inherently lazy that is the problem. A “fact” which you don’t know. You have chosen to extrapolate that, but he has not said it, and you do not know what he thinks. Do you have anything whatsoever to base your opinion of his character on other than what you’ve read in this thread? Do you feel that it would be appropriate for someone to judge your entire character based on one sentance you said? There is a big, big difference between condemning something the man said and condemning the whole man. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/27 "2005-05-02T07:56:29Z")
> [@mhendo](#): > > Here’s a suggestion. > > Maybe, if he’s talking about a black person who is lazy, or a bad student, he could call them “lazy” or “a bad student.” > > Pretty radical idea, huh? I don’t disagree at all. But I think we have to realize that people take a long time to change, society takes a long time to change. Forty years ago Cochell wouldn’t have any black players on his team, because he wouldn’t want to see a black player anywhere around his lockeroom unless he was cleaning up. Now Cochell is able to complement a black player as a great athlete and student, and I’d say Cochell was glad that he was on his team. He had to spoil his compliment (and by extension his career) by inserting a racial slur, but I think Cochell is among the many people in the world who have been raised ignorant of certain things; I don’t think he’s truly a malicious figure though. That’s why I made the distinction that I did. ---
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2005, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899/28 "2005-05-02T08:04:10Z")
Brickbacon your entire argument is not much different than mine, I tried to show how Cochell’s statements don’t necessarily show that he’s a racist or that he dislikes all blacks or that he is prejudiced against them. His statements clearly could be in the vein that, “Many people think all blacks are niggers, but they aren’t.” Now, the problem with that statement is it’s still not a shining example of tolerance and acceptance. But considering Cochell’s age, background, etc I think it shows he’s more open than many people in similar situations. All of the things you asserted were nothing more than idle speculation, and as you didn’t give my open speculation any credence, I’m not going to give your speculation disguised as facts any credence either. Also, if you’d like to tear down analogies in the future, have the temerity to explain or at least list “the many reasons this analogy is wrong” just simply saying something is wrong is very meaningless if you can’t give me a reason. Personally I think my analogy worked perfectly. Cochell has certain prejudices against a _segment_ of the black population. My analogy was a situation involving a certain segment of the white population. The fact is Cochell has feelings about “niggers” based on perceived behavior, not innate feelings of superiority. I have feelings like this about many groups. Rapists for example, and Ku Klux Klan members. It’s not the best thing in the world to try to collectively label any groups, but the fact is all of us do it to some degree (how many people on this forum lump all Christians and all Republicans into one monolithic group? In casual conversation the proportion is very high.) I also agree that we can make judgments about people based on what they say. But making judgments about someone based on what they say when one or two sentences is all you have probably ever heard from them, and with an unknown context is foolish indeed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espn-and-the-coachs-racist-remarks-a-question-of-journalistic-ethics/301899.md?page=1)