# ESPN's Greatest Sports Films of All Time list. Agree? Disagree? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 3, 2002, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826 "2002-09-03T16:46:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Milossarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Milossarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milossarian)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/1 "2002-09-03T16:46:19Z")
[ESPN’s list](http://msn.espn.go.com/page2/movies/s/top20/no20.html) (they elaborate more than I’m going to): 1. Bull Durham 2. Rocky 3. Raging Bull 4. Hoosiers 5. Slap Shot 6. The Natural 7. Field of Dreams 8. Caddyshack 9. The Hustler 10. The Longest Yard 11. North Dallas Forty 12. Jerry Maguire 13. Hoop Dreams 14. Breaking Away 15. White Men Can’t Jump 16. Bad News Bears 17. Chariots of Fire 18. Brian’s Song 19. Eight Men Out 20. When We Were Kings Some initial reactions I had were: - surprise that “Bang the Drum Slowly” didn’t make the Top 20. - I _like_ Slapshot. And I’m a hockey nut. But it is **way** overrated, on this list and otherwise. It’s not even the best sports comedy of all time. That would be Caddyshack. - Bull Durham is great. But number 1? Over some of those other movies? Come on! - I know Raging Bull gets all the hype. And I thought it was good. But it always struck me as a little too believing in its own self-importance. It doesn’t make my top 10, as you’re about to see. My list goes like this: **1. The Natural**. This is one of my all-time favorite movies of any genre. It is beautifully filmed, written, directed, acted. It is full of unforgettable scenes. A lyrical movie. **2. Rocky**. This movie doesn’t get its due now, and Stallone doesn’t get his due for his performance now, because of all the uneven sequels it spawned. Think of it standing alone, and it is a true masterpiece, that tells one of the great, human, American, underdog stories ever put on film. Rocky doesn’t win, but he does. As one of ESPN’s critics puts it, “that’s not only ground-breaking; that’s crucial.” **3. The Hustler**. If you have never seen this movie (which I imagine most of you haven’t), seek it out. I own a copy. Paul Newman and Jackie Gleason are perfect as Fast Eddie Felson and Minnesota Fats. Newman reprised this role in a movie with Tom Cruise, “The Color of Money.” This black-and-white original is infinitely better. **4. Caddyshack.** Still hilarious today. One of the most memorable line-spawning movies for guys ever. A sophomoric comedy that in many ways transformed how golfers look at their sport. Think about that. Happy Gilmore **wishes** it was Caddyshack. **5. Hoosiers**. Gene Hackman is perfect as the coach. The ESPN reviewers do a great job explaining why this movie is so excellent. > [@](#): > > Probably the best constructed of all sports movies. We’re introduced to a team, given a chance to learn to like them, and then we root for them like they’re the favorite team we grew up with. No gimmicks. No obvious attempts to pull at our heartstrings. No love story. Just a great high school basketball game with the underdog coming out on top. And what makes it all the more powerful is, it actually happened. That last scene, where the little kid is dribbling a ball, alone, and the camera pans to a photo on the wall of the REAL team that did it, gives me chills just thinking about it. **6. North Dallas Forty**. An excellent behind-the-scenes look at the dark underside of pro football. This movie really sticks with you, and it’s one of those great ones to watch and re-watch. At times hilarious, at times disturbing. Powerful. The opening scene of Nick Nolte trying to get out of bed and around, in agony, the morning after a game is haunting. **7. Rollerball**. I may be cheating here, but I consider it a sports movie. And, hopefully, it goes without saying that I’m talking about the original with James Caan. A disturbing image of where sports may be headed, back to its gladiator roots. (And as a kid, you just thought the concept of that sport was _so_ cool.) **8. Bull Durham**. A funny and endearing movie. But no way should it be number one, in my book. **9. The Longest Yard.** It never gets old. Funny movie, but not a shallow one. **10. Jerry Maguire**. I remember thinking when this came out, “A movie about a sports agent? Why is it getting all these great reviews?” But it’s excellent. Funny, and a great love story with a great message. And enough sports to keep it from falling into the “chick flick” realm. 🙂 **Honorable Mention: The Bad News Bears in Breaking Training**. I always liked this sequel better than the original. Something about the thrill of the kids going and doing it on their own really resonated with you, as a kid. You wished you were with them. “Let them play! Let them play! Let them play!” ---
**Author:** ![plnnr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7ea924/32.png) [@plnnr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/plnnr)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/2 "2002-09-03T18:10:51Z")
No “Pride of the Yankees?” I’ll agree with you about The Hustler, though. Gleason is terrific and you can practically see Paul Newman shit his pants at the end. ---
**Author:** ![Mullinator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c2a13f/32.png) [@Mullinator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mullinator)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/3 "2002-09-03T18:49:08Z")
Yup, what is essentially a chick flick with sports related wrapping paper made the #1 spot. Any list of sports movies that doesn’t begin with “Hoosiers” holds no weight with me. But, I am extremely biased. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_Torque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Max\_Torque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_Torque)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/4 "2002-09-03T19:04:58Z")
It feels like they felt obligated to put a baseball movie at number one. Given that, though, they should have gone with _The Natural_ instead. I found _Bull Durham_ to be very dull, and it barely qualifies as a “sports movie”; what **Mullinator** said about it is on the money. I think they also did some “pushing around” so that the top 10 wouldn’t be too stacked with boxing movies. Let’s be honest, many of the best sports movies are boxing movies, and this list has three of them, two in the top three. _When We Were Kings_ deserves to be in the top 10 as well. And come on, _White Men Can’t Jump_? What the hell is that doing on there? I’d put _Ladybugs_ on the list before _White Men Can’t Jump_. Sheesh… ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/5 "2002-09-03T19:25:05Z")
I cannot imagine what possessed them to put both _Bull Durham_ and _Jerry Maguire_ on a list of **sports** movies. They’re both fine movies. . . but I don’t really think sports has much to do with either one. It’s like calling Hamlet a play about a Gravedigger who meets a Prince. Anyhoo. . . 1. Hoosiers 2. Rocky 3. Field of Dreams 4. The Natural 5. Raging Bull 6. Caddyshack 7. Eight Men Out 8. 9. 10. Beyond the Mat ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/6 "2002-09-03T19:26:13Z")
I cannot imagine what possessed them to put both _Bull Durham_ and _Jerry Maguire_ on a list of **sports** movies. They’re both fine movies. . . but I don’t really think sports has much to do with either one. It’s like calling Hamlet a play about a Gravedigger who meets a Prince. Anyhoo. . . 1. Hoosiers 2. Rocky 3. Field of Dreams 4. The Natural 5. Brian’s Song 6. Caddyshack 7. Eight Men Out 8. Raging Bull 9. The Karate Kid 10. Beyond the Mat ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/7 "2002-09-03T19:51:04Z")
I cannot believe that **When We Were Kings** gets shunted to the bottom of that list. It’s one of the greatest _documentaries_ of all time, fer cryin’ out loud, and they think the f@#$ing Bad News Bears is worthy of being placed ahead of it? I have to stop reading these all-time lists. The only thing I learn from them is that “all-time” has increasingly come to mean, “in color, without subtitles, and within the past twenty years.” ---
**Author:** ![Munch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/munch/32/5281_2.png) [@Munch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Munch)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/8 "2002-09-03T19:56:27Z")
Being a Notre Dame fan, I was initially suprised to not see _Rudy_ on the list, but upon further reflection, can completely see why it’s not on the list. It’s way too derivative of other sports movies out there. Plus, it’s crap. However, I will raise a fuss for Knute Rockne - All American not making the list. It could have at least been thrown into the Honorable Mention list. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/9 "2002-09-03T22:27:56Z")
**Rudy** is a great movie! But how on earth does **The Bad New Bears** edge out Academy Award winning Best Picture **Chariots of Fire?** Why not throw in **The Mighty Ducks and Cool Runnings?** And it is one of my all time favorite films but **Field of Dreams** is not a sports movie. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/10 "2002-09-03T22:36:48Z")
How would you feel about **The Hustler** or **The Color of Money**? Both are great movies about pool playing. (hey thats on ESPN) Oh and I forgot about a film called **Phar Lap** , which is about a race horse. And it’s a great movie. ---
**Author:** ![Kaitlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/73ab20/32.png) [@Kaitlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaitlyn)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/11 "2002-09-03T22:59:32Z")
> [@](#): > > I cannot imagine what possessed them to put both Bull Durham and Jerry Maguire on a list of sports movies. They’re both fine movies. . . but I don’t really think sports has much to do with either one. It’s like calling Hamlet a play about a Gravedigger who meets a Prince. I see the sports elements as being an integral part of both of these movies. My top 20, in ABC order: Bang the Drum Slowly Breaking Away Bull Durham College Field of Dreams Girlfight Hoop Dreams Hoosiers Horse Feathers The Hustler The Karate Kid Kingpin A League of Their Own Pride of the Yankees Raging Bull Rocky The Set-Up Searching for Bobby Fischer Tin Cup Vision Quest ---
**Author:** ![MovieMogul](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f08c70/32.png) [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/12 "2002-09-03T22:59:36Z")
I have to agree on _Bull Durham_ at #1–leagues better than any other baseball film and better acted and written than any other sports movie that comes to mind. What I like about _BD_ is that it embraces the mechanics, the quirks, the day-in and -out of professional athletics. No cliches, no facile iconography, no trumped-up bullshit theatrics and obvious 4th-down-bottom-of-the-9th climaxes that every other (inferior) sports movie glibly resorts to. It loves the game and articulates all the wonderful things about it. It’s idiosyncratic, non-formulaic, and all-inclusive. It shows that atheletes are diverse without resorting to types, that games are more than macho pretension, and that a love of the game goes deeper than who won what. It’s a perfect little film and by virtue of its intelligence eclipses the one-dimensional hero worship of _The Natural_ and other films of its like. I also must echo SofaKing that _When We Were Kings_ is way too low. I didn’t exactly expect Riefenstahl’s _Olympia_ to place, though it did more for the iconography and fetizisation of the human athletic form than any film in history. No foreign-language movies, naturally, but at least this time I can’t think of any obvious omissions by keeping it english-language only. Oh, and I’d take _The Set-Up_ or _Body and Soul_ over the hambone _Rocky_ when it comes to truly great boxing movies. ---
**Author:** ![Kaitlyn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/73ab20/32.png) [@Kaitlyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kaitlyn)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/13 "2002-09-03T23:05:33Z")
> [@](#): > > And it is one of my all time favorite films but Field of Dreams is not a sports movie. Why not? Take out the parts of the movie that deal with baseball, and what you have left is a PTA meeting. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/14 "2002-09-03T23:32:38Z")
Field of Dreams is about a spirtual healing. Yes they build a baseball field. Yes they talk about the past legends of the game. But the baseball is the metaphor for life. It’s not about baseball but about life. ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/15 "2002-09-03T23:45:00Z")
Or maybe life is really about baseball. . . ---
**Author:** ![Tretiak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a88e57/32.png) [@Tretiak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tretiak)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2002, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/16 "2002-09-03T23:46:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Zebra \* > \*\*Field of Dreams is about a spirtual healing. Yes they build a baseball field. Yes they talk about the past legends of the game. But the baseball is the metaphor for life. It’s not about baseball but about life. \*\* Isn’t that precisely what makes a great sports movie? Anyway, I am here to stick up for **Slap Shot**. #1 on my list. ---
**Author:** ![jimmmy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/73ab20/32.png) [@jimmmy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimmmy)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 12:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/17 "2002-09-04T00:17:08Z")
I’d drop BNBEARS and something else & add Harlem Globetrotters (1951) and/or its recycled kin Go Man Go! (1954) and Fear Strikes Out I wouldn’t put these in the top 15 but when you are looking to add drop & seeing the Bears made it & how Caddyshack & Whitemen made it: Major League, All The Right Moves, Somebody Up there Likes Me, Paper Lion ---
**Author:** ![kevja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/aeb1de/32.png) [@kevja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevja)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/18 "2002-09-04T00:32:31Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sofa King \* > \*\*I cannot believe that **When We Were Kings** gets shunted to the bottom of that list. It’s one of the greatest _documentaries_ of all time, fer cryin’ out loud, and they think the f@#$ing Bad News Bears is worthy of being placed ahead of it? > > I have to stop reading these all-time lists. The only thing I learn from them is that “all-time” has increasingly come to mean, “in color, without subtitles, and within the past twenty years.” \*\* I’m with you 100%. It’s an outstanding film. I recommend it every chance I get. I too was very suprised it was ranked so low. I do believe it did win an Oscar for best documentary a few years back. And although it may not get the attention it should get right now, imho, it’s timeless, and will live on long past some of the other films on the list. ---
**Author:** ![kevja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/aeb1de/32.png) [@kevja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kevja)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 12:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/19 "2002-09-04T00:36:06Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Sofa King \* > \*\*I cannot believe that **When We Were Kings** gets shunted to the bottom of that list. It’s one of the greatest _documentaries_ of all time, fer cryin’ out loud, and they think the f@#$ing Bad News Bears is worthy of being placed ahead of it? > > I have to stop reading these all-time lists. The only thing I learn from them is that “all-time” has increasingly come to mean, “in color, without subtitles, and within the past twenty years.” \*\* I’m with you 100%. It’s an outstanding film, and I recommend it every chance I get. I too was very suprised it was ranked so low. I think it won an Oscar for best documentary a few years back. And although it may not get the attention it should get right now, imho, it’s timeless, and will live on long past some of the other films on the list. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [September 4, 2002, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826/20 "2002-09-04T02:59:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Milossarian \* > **2. Rocky**. … Rocky doesn’t win, but he does. As one of ESPN’s critics puts it, “that’s not only ground-breaking; that’s crucial.” Hardly ground-breaking; the really great sports movies have always played their endings against type. In **The Bad News Bears** the Bears lose the championship game; then they celebrate, spray beer on each other, tell the team that taunted them to stick their sanctimonious apology up their collective asses, and cue the “1812 Overture”. That’s a happy ending, and much better than anything in **Breaking Training**. **The Hustler** takes the opposite approach. It’s a tragedy; Fast Eddie beats Fats at the end, but it means nothing. Other movies achieve their brilliance by reducing the Big Game to irrelevance at the end. In **Slap Shot** , the Chiefs win the Big Game, but in a way that makes the score unimportant. In **Bull Durham** there is no Big Game. I can see the traces of Chick Flickery in it, but there’s so much good dialog it doesn’t matter. And the conference they have on the mound is absolutely brilliant. I’ve never understood what anyone sees in **Jerry Maguire**. As near as I can tell, the insolent, spoiled athlete finds redemption with his teammates by dancing in the endzone and bowing kisses at the camera. I felt like throwing up, not cheering. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/espns-greatest-sports-films-of-all-time-list-agree-disagree/126826.md?page=2)