# Eternity lasts Forever

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910>\
**Category:** Great Debates\
**Created:** [December 3, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910 "2005-12-03T16:17:32Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 18\
**Page:** 1

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![dandrews02](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ecccb3/32.png) [@dandrews02](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dandrews02)\
**Post date:** [December 3, 2005, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/1 "2005-12-03T16:17:32Z")

</div>

Religions (The Big Three) guarantee eternal life after death  
Heaven, Hell, Purgatory, whatever  
Some get virgins, some don’t

To become included in some eternal stream,  
whouldn’t one have needed to be there already?

I don’t see it as possible to jump in mid-stream  
as, by definition, there is no beginning, no middle, no end

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Khadaji](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Khadaji](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Khadaji)\
**Post date:** [December 3, 2005, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/2 "2005-12-03T18:20:51Z")

</div>

This may be a better suited to GD…

I’m not sure I understand what you are trying to say, can you elaborate?

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Hello\_Again](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/85e7bf/32.png) [@Hello\_Again](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hello_Again)\
**Post date:** [December 3, 2005, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/3 "2005-12-03T19:31:40Z")

</div>

Also, Judaism doesn’t “guarantee” life after death. Many Jews are “agnostic” on the afterlife, meaning they believe there’s no way to know what happens after you die. (This is by no means the only view though).

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\
**Post date:** [December 3, 2005, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/4 "2005-12-03T22:46:52Z")

</div>

I think what he’s saying is, as we have already lived for some time on earth, we can’t then go someplace else for eternity - some of that time we’ve already used up.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\
**Post date:** [December 3, 2005, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/5 "2005-12-03T23:00:39Z")

</div>

No, I think what he’s saying is that eternity has to go in both directions. If it has a beginning, it’s not an eternity. The Christian conception of eternal life is a “ray” (--------\>) rather than a “line” (\<--------\>).

I don’t know why it _can’t_ be a ray but I think that’s what the OP is saying.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Frank](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Frank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frank)\
**Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/6 "2005-12-04T02:54:47Z")

</div>

Religion, of sorts.

Moved from IMHO to GD.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\
**Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/7 "2005-12-04T03:53:19Z")

</div>

Generally, a difference is made between eternal and immortal. God is eternal (no beginning, no end), the human sould is “only” immortal (a beginning, no end).

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\
**Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/8 "2005-12-04T13:55:53Z")

</div>

The laws of thermodynamics are what made me an atheist.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\
**Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/9 "2005-12-04T19:36:53Z")

</div>

This topic was discussed at quite some length recently. Search for a thread titled “Essence”.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\
**Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 11:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/10 "2005-12-05T11:44:58Z")

</div>

> [@dan](#):
>
> To become included in some eternal stream,  
> whouldn’t one have needed to be there already?
> 
> I don’t see it as possible to jump in mid-stream  
> as, by definition, there is no beginning, no middle, no end

Well, there _are_ helpful symbols we can use. Consider the infinitely long line of integers:  
-4 … -3, -2, -1, 0, 1, 2, 3 … 4.  
One can define a function with asymptotes or discontinuities at, say, -1 and +80 or whatever. I don’t see much of a problem positing something like:

For -4\<x\<0, x=_non existence_.  
For 0\<x\<80, x=_physical life_  
For 80\<x\<4, x=_afterlife_.

Now, modern cosmology suggests that 13.7 Billion years is _all the time there is_ in that direction,  
_ie._ that for -4\<x\<-13.7Bn **/** x=-13.7Bn where x is the configuration of the universe,  
and I have no idea why one would distinguish the nature of the afterlife from that of the _beforelife_ since I consider it pretty obvious that “we” were and will be simply a disparate arrangement of atoms outside of the physical life bounds (_ie._ when we weren’t concieved or when we’re dead). But I don’t think it illogical to posit such discontinuities in general.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Cliffy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/59ef9b/32.png) [@Cliffy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cliffy)\
**Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/11 "2005-12-05T14:23:14Z")

</div>

It’s a simple definitional problem, nothing to get worked up about. “Eternal” is being used, perhaps carelessly, in two ways – that of an event which starts from a point and then continues forever; and of an event which exists outside of time and which those of us of temporal existence, were we to observe it, thing has no beginning and no end.

When people speak of god as being eternal, they’re using the first definition; when they speak of souls having eternal life, they’re using the second.

–Cliffy

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\
**Post date:** [December 5, 2005, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/12 "2005-12-05T14:30:04Z")

</div>

You are already in an eternal stream. Every molecule, every atom of your body has been recycled again and again since the beginning of time, and will continue to be recycled until the universe is cold. And it will exist forever after that.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\
**Post date:** [December 6, 2005, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/13 "2005-12-06T02:46:54Z")

</div>

**SentientMeat** You are not the atoms that your body is made of, you are the gust of wind that determines their course.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\
**Post date:** [December 6, 2005, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/14 "2005-12-06T15:18:14Z")

</div>

> [@mswas](#):
>
> **SentientMeat** You are not the atoms that your body is made of, you are the gust of wind that determines their course.

Can I be the wind beneath his wings?

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\
**Post date:** [December 7, 2005, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/15 "2005-12-07T15:33:02Z")

</div>

> [@mswas](#):
>
> **SentientMeat** You are not the atoms that your body is made of, you are the gust of wind that determines their course.

“I” am neither. “I” am the unique string of memories encoded in my neural structure. I am not the atoms _themselves_ but their _arrangement_. When I die, that arrangement becomes disparate and the memories are lost to entropy (_ie._ become indistinguishable from noise), just like throwing a hard drive on a bonfire.

> [@Bryan](#):
>
> Can I be the wind beneath his wings?

Lifting me up where the eagles cry on a mountain high? Sorry, I’m afraid I suffer from a completely rational fear of aviationally metaphoric ballads.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\
**Post date:** [December 7, 2005, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/16 "2005-12-07T21:33:37Z")

</div>

> [@SentientMeat](#):
>
> For -4\<x\<0, x=_non existence_.  
> For 0\<x\<80, x=_physical life_  
> For 80\<x\<4, x=_afterlife_.

At last!

Mathematical proof that there is no afterlife.

And, now that I quote it, I see that there’s some font wrapper around that 4, and it’s maybe supposed to be an ∞. Does this work on other browsers?

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![SentientMeat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/43a26b/32.png) [@SentientMeat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SentientMeat)\
**Post date:** [December 7, 2005, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/17 "2005-12-07T22:07:09Z")

</div>

Sorry, I just pasted from WordPerfect: yes it is a ∞.

---

<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![GreyMatters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a9a28c/32.png) [@GreyMatters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GreyMatters)\
**Post date:** [December 7, 2005, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eternity-lasts-forever/333910/18 "2005-12-07T22:23:35Z")

</div>

Eternity, infinity can be closed on one side of the Set and open to infinity on the other.

There can be A beginning with no end.

It depends on what type of Infinite Set you want to talk about.