# Euthanizing Reptiles in the Freezer **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [April 18, 2007, 8:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596 "2007-04-18T08:08:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Caridwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c89c15/32.png) [@Caridwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caridwen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/21 "2007-04-18T20:58:23Z")
[QUOTE=Guinastasia] Don’t you think he’d be better off dealing with the death now, rather than finding out later that you tried to replace him? [/QUOTE] Why would it be? ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/22 "2007-04-18T21:05:41Z")
[QUOTE=Caridwen] Why would it be? [/QUOTE] Because (in my experience and observation) a) kiddies need to learn about death sometime, and b) the later you leave it, the harder it is for them to deal with. That’s part of the utility of having pets. ---
**Author:** ![Caridwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c89c15/32.png) [@Caridwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Caridwen)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/23 "2007-04-18T21:22:39Z")
I have to tell you, when my son was 4-5 I replaced pets like fish. I don’t know at that age if they really do understand the concept or why it would be important. Especially if it’s something your going to replace. He watched cartoons and someone was run over and flattened like a pancake and got up again. I don’t think it’s a big deal or that important at that age. He’s going to law school now and I think he learned somewhere along the line that people and animals do die. ---
**Author:** ![KlondikeGeoff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3e96dc/32.png) [@KlondikeGeoff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KlondikeGeoff)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/24 "2007-04-18T21:42:21Z")
[QUOTE=Washoe] Uh, thanks—I was hoping that you would come along. When they say “an experienced individual,” does that specifically mean “a DVM”? [/QUOTE] I knew a couple of biologists who did it with just a quick snap of their hands (on lab animals, of course, not people, to the best of my knowledge). I also knew a dog breeder who did it to newborn pups who had severe malformations or were otherwise at risk. I saw her do it twice and it only took a millisecond. I assume there are others likewise experienced in that bizarre skill. ---
**Author:** ![Leviosaurus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/439d5e/32.png) [@Leviosaurus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leviosaurus)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/25 "2007-04-18T21:53:44Z")
[QUOTE=chorpler] in general, a method of terminating life that’s painless won’t be neat, and a method that’s neat won’t be painless. [/QUOTE] Wouldn’t putting them in a chamber filled with Carbon Dioxide do the trick just fine? Seems like it would be easy enough to build one with an inexpensive cooler and some dry ice. ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/26 "2007-04-18T22:13:42Z")
On page 20 of the .pdf that **vetbridge** linked to, that technique is mentioned as being acceptable from a moral standpoint. Perhaps a homemade contraption consisting of a CO2 tank, flexible hosing, and a sealed enclosure would be a better option though. It mentions however, that this technique is unsuitable for species which can convert to anaerobic metabolism. I’m thinking a guillotine would be the best solution for a DIYer, although this wouldn’t go over very well with the teenaged girls who typically work at pet stores. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/27 "2007-04-18T22:13:52Z")
[QUOTE=Washoe] Uh, thanks—I was hoping that you would come along. When they say “an experienced individual,” does that specifically mean “a DVM”? [/QUOTE] Nope. In a laboratory setting usually technicians do the cervicocephalic luxation. When a client brings an anorectic snake in for forced feeding that is how I kill the mouse/rat/whatever. The ironic thing is when my very next client presents a mouse/rat for treatment. Oh, and **I** am a VMD, _not_ _shudder_ a DVM! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/28 "2007-04-18T22:15:57Z")
[QUOTE=Washoe] I’m thinking a guillotine would be the best solution for a DIYer, although this wouldn’t go over very well with the teenaged girls who typically work at pet stores. [/QUOTE] Yep. Commercial guillotines are available. [http://www.med-associates.com/placePref/placePref.htm](http://www.med-associates.com/placePref/placePref.htm) ---
**Author:** ![Darryl\_Lict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@Darryl\_Lict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darryl_Lict)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/29 "2007-04-18T22:20:17Z")
[QUOTE=ralph124c] what i want to know: is boiling lobsters humane? that is how i prepare them, before dipping in butter and consuming-any comments? [/QUOTE] [Kylie Kwong](http://www.abc.net.au/kyliekwong/recipes/s952210.htm), the sadist, tosses the lobster in the freezer before boiling: [QUOTE=Kylie Kwong] Place lobster in freezer for 1 hour, where it will ‘go to sleep’, then lower into a large stockpot of boiling salted water and cook for 5 minutes. [/QUOTE] I mentioned in an earlier thread that when I bought about 6 rock crab, they were scrambling about for 5 minutes when I was trying to boil them. It was pretty horrific. ---
**Author:** ![lowbrass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dc4da7/32.png) [@lowbrass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lowbrass)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/30 "2007-04-18T22:25:23Z")
[QUOTE=chorpler] I’m sure (well, more or less sure) that decapitation or cervical dislocation is relatively painless for the animal, but it just seems horrific to mention it there. “Is freezing lizards a painless method of euthanasia?” “No. Chop off the head instead.” C’mon! The juxtaposition is funny. It reminds me of something somebody said in a previous thread on a similar topic (paraphrased): in general, a method of terminating life that’s painless won’t be neat, and a method that’s neat won’t be painless. [/QUOTE] Actually, I don’t find it funny either. The issue isn’t how neat it is, but rather how much the animal will suffer. If it weren’t blindingly obvious that a quick death means less suffering than a slow death, the juxtaposition of the two might be amusing, but that’s not the case. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/31 "2007-04-18T22:29:47Z")
[QUOTE=Washoe] Perhaps a homemade contraption consisting of a CO2 tank, flexible hosing, and a sealed enclosure would be a better option though. [/QUOTE] CO2 is much safer than CO. I had a client years ago whose dog was terminal. I discussed euthanasia, which the client declined due to the cost. He thought he could do it at home cheaper. He put the dog into a carrier, put the carrier into a big garbage bag, then \*\*ran his car in his closed garage \*\* with the exhaust entering the bagged carrier. He realized he was blacking out in time to crawl to a door and get outside. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/32 "2007-04-18T22:31:20Z")
[QUOTE=Leviosaurus] Wouldn’t putting them in a chamber filled with Carbon Dioxide do the trick just fine? Seems like it would be easy enough to build one with an inexpensive cooler and some dry ice. [/QUOTE] Carbon dioxide? I’d think that would be agonizing. I mean, I’ve inhaled carbon dioxide vapor from dry ice, and not only does it sting your mouth, nose, throat, and eyes, it immediately gives you the “HOLY CRAP I NEED TO BREATHE RIGHT NOW!!!” feeling that you get when you’ve been holding your breath for a long time. Which makes sense, since the breathing reflex, and the associated suffering it causes if you can’t breathe, is caused by a buildup of CO2. Anyway … it’s excruciatingly uncomfortable just to breathe in CO2. I think breathing in enough of it to kill you would be awful. Maybe other species don’t have that same suffocation response, though… But you’re right on the concept – I think there was an agreement on this being a pain-free AND neat method of execution in another thread from a month or two ago. Just use some other gas besides CO2, like nitrogen or helium or carbon monoxide, that allows the euthanisee (or whatever the term would be) to breathe normally. That way, there’s no buildup of carbon dioxide, so no suffocation discomfort, but the lack of oxygen causes quick unconsciousness and eventually death. And for what it’s worth, I’ve experienced that myself when I was a kid, and so has my brother. I was inhaling helium from a balloon to make my voice sound funny, and I figured “Hey, if a single breath makes my voice squeaky for a little bit, the whole balloon will make my voice squeaky for a long time!” So I just kept inhaling from the balloon and exhaling through my nose. I passed out in short order, but I was never in any discomfort – in fact, the whole thing was rather pleasant. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/33 "2007-04-18T22:34:27Z")
[QUOTE=lowbrass] Actually, I don’t find it funny either. The issue isn’t how neat it is, but rather how much the animal will suffer. If it weren’t blindingly obvious that a quick death means less suffering than a slow death, the juxtaposition of the two might be amusing, but that’s not the case. [/QUOTE] Yeah, I know. I just find it funny because the whole question about freezer euthanasia is asked because the people who want to do that are obviously uncomfortable with a more direct method – they want to be able to do something nice and neat and painless, hence the whole “it will die painlessly in the freezer, right?” thing. But instead, it says “No … you have to \ to result in a pain-free death.” ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/34 "2007-04-18T22:35:28Z")
while the fish is dreaming and pining for the fjords… perhaps you could get a nice house plant that would do well in your house. while repotting it into a lovely new home you could have a fish burial, and name the plant after the deceased. kidlet could help care for plant and new fish, circle of life and all that. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/35 "2007-04-18T22:38:06Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] CO2 is much safer than CO. I had a client years ago whose dog was terminal. I discussed euthanasia, which the client declined due to the cost. He thought he could do it at home cheaper. He put the dog into a carrier, put the carrier into a big garbage bag, then \*\*ran his car in his closed garage \*\* with the exhaust entering the bagged carrier. He realized he was blacking out in time to crawl to a door and get outside. [/QUOTE] Once again, I don’t understand how CO2 asphyxia could be acceptable as a method of euthanasia. Do other animals not respond to the buildup of CO2 like we do, with the rapidly increasing discomfort/pain and terror? ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/36 "2007-04-18T23:23:34Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] Yep. Commercial guillotines are available. [http://www.med-associates.com/placePref/placePref.htm](http://www.med-associates.com/placePref/placePref.htm) [/QUOTE] I don’t understand. These devices appear to apparatuses used in operant conditioning and approach/avoidance experiments. They do not appear to be designed to end an animal’s life. ---
**Author:** ![Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e47c2d/32.png) [@Biffy\_the\_Elephant\_Shrew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biffy_the_Elephant_Shrew)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2007, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/37 "2007-04-18T23:32:24Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] Oh, and **I** am a VMD, _not_ _shudder_ a DVM! 😉 [/QUOTE] Is that what you put on your form at the DMV? ---
**Author:** ![Washoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ecae2f/32.png) [@Washoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Washoe)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2007, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/38 "2007-04-19T01:56:44Z")
[QUOTE=vetbridge] Here is what the American Veterinary Medical Association’s 2000 Panel on Euthanasia says regarding freezing reptiles: [http://www.avma.org/issues/animal\_welfare/euthanasia.pdf](http://www.avma.org/issues/animal_welfare/euthanasia.pdf) (PDF file) Decapitation or cervical dislocation are considered humane methods of euthanasia when performed by an experienced individual. [/QUOTE] We’re taking one of our dogs to that store tonight for a rabies clinic. I’ll take a printout of that page with me, thanks. ---
**Author:** ![vetbridge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b5e925/32.png) [@vetbridge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vetbridge)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2007, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/39 "2007-04-19T14:20:44Z")
[QUOTE=Washoe] I don’t understand. These devices appear to apparatuses used in operant conditioning and approach/avoidance experiments. They do not appear to be designed to end an animal’s life. [/QUOTE] Ooops. I screwed up there. The door is a guillotine style door, not a guillotine device. I have been in labs with commercial guillotines, however. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![MizGrand](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/cdc98d/32.png) [@MizGrand](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MizGrand)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2007, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596/40 "2007-04-19T14:47:25Z")
Interesting remarks. We had a hamster die, and I did explain death to my son in that instance. But with the fish, it just seems easier to simply buy a new one. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/euthanizing-reptiles-in-the-freezer/400596.md?page=1)