# EVE Online: Need Goons v. BoB update **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [May 28, 2009, 8:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962 "2009-05-28T20:23:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/41 "2009-06-18T22:19:26Z")
> [@aruvqan](#): > > mswas … Teras, come on you know me, we have been in the same corps for how long now? since we both started last year? > > I like logistics, mining can be very relaxing as can long flights with cargo. Missions can be fun as a side amusement. > > There are a lot of people that happen to like logistics, it is what keeps _your_ supply line full of ammo, drones, and player made toys that make things go boom. No, I definitely understand your point of view, I just disagree with it. I mean after all, AI is leaving the wormhole because it’s more profitable to be in hi-sec. As it is it’s considered a serious game imbalance how much more profitable hi-sec is than more dangerous stuff. If there were absolutely 0 risk it would be insanely imbalanced. > [@](#): > > As to it being dog eat dog, then why did CCP make an entire security rating system for safe systems and dangerous systems? So that Carebears would have a place to be. Personally I love the way they have handled it, no place that is 100% safe, but places that are relatively safe enough that people who want to be carebears can. I like the system as it is in that regard. > [@](#): > > Look, people are people, no matter if they are roman or Gallente. They want certain things. Those who are type A adrenalin junkies go to war, explore frontiers or go down sec. People who just want to live become farmers, tradesmen or miners/industrial/marketing/research and stay hi sec. _supposedly_ CCP catered to this by having low sec and hi sec. Unfortunately they started the wardec, which sucks ass. Any jerkwad with 50 illion ISK can harass me where I should be safe. In general, it is jackasses wardeccing people who are industrial noncombattants so they can harass us, get kills for their killboard and get loot to sell. Yes, that’s true, but really that’s the only risk factor for a hi-sec carebear. All businesses should have some risk to it. > [@](#): > > Great, how brave and strong you are killing a bestower that has NO guns, drones, armor, shields worth mentioning and is not able to fight back with any alacrity … when all i am doing is hauling a load of trit to market so someone else can buy it and build you a new harbinger … Well I don’t target noob ships, haulers or miners when I go lo-sec roaming, but that’s just me personally. It depends though, if I found someone hauling in a wormhole I might gank them for their T3 mats. It all depends. That’s what I love about Eve, there is no sense of certainty anywhere, and that’s what keeps the game fresh and exciting even after playing it for a year. But…being an industrial corp you are highly unlikely to ever be wardecced as you are aware. It’s too tedious to seek out a 30 man corp’s mining ops, that’s why people like to wardecc small alliances, because it’s easier to find people from a 3-600 person alliance. So the new path for AI is probably perfect for you all. You’ll make your isk and relax and will not be ganked very often. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/42 "2009-06-18T22:33:55Z")
Oh man, I have mixed feelings about this. On the one hand YAY BOB IS DEAD!!! On the other if the war is over, Goons, Razor and Kenny will be roaming hi and lo-sec causing havoc. I think we are in for the barbarian times after the fall of Rome. ---
**Author:** ![Todderbob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@Todderbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Todderbob)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2009, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/43 "2009-06-18T23:03:50Z")
I tried to convince them to start another war of attrition. They said no. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/44 "2009-06-19T00:32:46Z")
> [@Todderbob](#): > > I tried to convince them to start another war of attrition. > > They said no. ☹ yeah I can see why you’d want to relax for a bit after doing all that. It’s too bad y’all are seasoned POS spammers because I’d say maybe you could be kept busy solidifying your sovereignty, but I guess that’ll take you guys all of like three days. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/45 "2009-06-19T02:26:22Z")
> [@mswas](#): > > On the other if the war is over, Goons, Razor and Kenny will be roaming hi and lo-sec causing havoc. Maybe. I would say that a plated Rapier or two and a RR PulsePoc fleet would be fun to go bashing through lowsec with. But, I have to admit, I like dictors. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 7:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/46 "2009-06-19T07:55:59Z")
Although, to be fair, I should add that I also like not-dictors. ---
**Author:** ![wolfman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a8b319/32.png) [@wolfman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfman)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2009, 9:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/47 "2009-06-19T09:03:11Z")
Hmm, I really havn’t checked my account in about a year. I Think spring for a month to see what it looks like on my new much better video card 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 5:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/48 "2009-06-20T17:05:53Z")
So the rumor is that the anti-BoB coalition is now at each other’s throats. How much truth is there to this? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/49 "2009-06-20T21:03:16Z")
Bwah? I haven’t logged in in a few days, but that sounds utterly absurd. ---
**Author:** ![mswas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e99b99/32.png) [@mswas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mswas)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/50 "2009-06-20T21:17:26Z")
Yea I thought so as well. I don’t see any reason for them to be fighting there has got to be lots of pie to go around for now. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/51 "2009-06-20T21:24:13Z")
We did have a “Thunderdome” elimination frigate tournament in NOL a few days ago with a Mothership as the prize to whoever won (I never did find out). But the folks who were there chose to be, it wasn’t an actual battle. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2009, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/52 "2009-06-20T23:17:41Z")
Ah, checking in on the Razor forums I do see that a Pandemic battleship hopped into the middle of the frigate swarm and turned on his smarties. Doesn’t seems surprising to me, being that it was PL. No real fighting though, since everybody who went there went to get blown up anyways. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2009, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/53 "2009-08-04T19:41:33Z")
By the way, as this ties into the aftermath I figured I’d mention it. While PL and the NC aren’t (currently) set red, we’ve been not-blue for a little while now, and ya know… NBSI. We’ve each been ganking each other’s sub caps for a while now, but last night saw a six hour cap-fight (with a significant support fleet fight, as well, that I FC’d for the first three hours) over a dyspro moon in Amarr lowsec. [Long story short](http://www.eve-razor.com/killboard/?a=kill_related&kll_id=185427), about 40 dead (mostly PL, I think) dreads to a dozen of ours, and 54 battleships to 8 of ours that we lost and we dropped their large faction tower and held the field, so the dyspro moon is now in our hands. Pretty good fight, all things considered, although the lag was really brutal at first and there were a few noobs in my fleet who didn’t know how to deal with it. Once we got that sorted we were doing much better. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2009, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/54 "2009-08-05T16:29:32Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > [Long story short](http://www.eve-razor.com/killboard/?a=kill_related&kll_id=185427), about 40 dead (mostly PL, I think) dreads to a dozen of ours, and 54 battleships to 8 of ours that we lost and we dropped their large faction tower and held the field, so the dyspro moon is now in our hands. Why such lopsided fights? Is it all FCing? I thought at those scales (so many ships) it becomes instapop city and becomes a factor of who targets a little faster than the other guy. Just asking…curious. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2009, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962/55 "2009-08-05T18:06:48Z")
The fight itself actually wasn’t all that lopsided for the first… 3-4 hours I guess? Their support fleet was about 1/3 again the size of ours while our cap fleet was a bit bigger. The numbers on the final killboard list are a bit deceptive, because both sides were continuing to bring in reinforcements for pretty much the entire six hour fight. I know that the NC had several cyno chains set up to get new cap ships down (and, I suppose, bridge in new support). I checked on the battle around the fifth hour and asked how it was going and got a response of “I’ve just killed the same guy for the third time, that’s how it’s going.” It also seemed, for where I sat, that the enemy fleets were perhaps not communicating properly, as they had two separate support fleets who seemed to merge into one once the battle got going. Whether or not they got into one fleet and/or TS I simply don’t know, but I do know that 100% of our support fleet was in my fleet and that we were on the same TS as our cap fleet so that I could talk to our cap FC’s and coordinate. One of the reasons we killed so many of them, at least while I was FC’ing (I don’t have an accurate picture of exactly what happened once I left) was that we coordinated specific targets with our cap fleet, getting our fast tackle onto cap ships and then shifting our dreads’ fire onto the pointed bastards while our support fleet continued to pick off enemy BS’s. And, well, popping depends. We petitioned CCP to reinforce the node since we knew it would be a major fight over a dyspro moon, but CCP didn’t do it properly. Lag was really, really horrible. The cap FC’s kept asking me how we were doing during the first hour or so, and I kept having to tell them that I had no idea, but we seemed to be working our way through the enemy BS fleet well enough. The cap fleet was in much the same situation. Module lag was very bad and folks who didn’t know enough to take their guns off of auto-repeat and start manually cycling them were ending up with stuck guns. But even with that, their support fleet seemed to be concentrating on our caps, and perhaps not even primarying them. But with the lag and the number of carriers we had on the field, their fire really wasn’t all that effective against our dreads and those that we lost were largely those that were tackled after warping out to planets, those who got separated from the pack, or what have you. And that allowed us to whittle down their BS’s with very little return fire. I’m not sure exactly how things would’ve gone if we weren’t lagged out for most of the fight, but yes, in a fleet fight with the numbers we saw we’d pretty much be alphaing many targets, or popping them in a few volleys at most. Both of our fleets were dealing with a number of noobs though, so that would’ve made a difference. Another fact which makes me think that they were lacking coordination is that the PL support fleet was routinely aligned out and had their anti-support ships hassling our tacklers, while the non-PL BS’s tended to be sitting at zero velocity (I primaried them a lot) and didn’t have any concentrated force dealing with our tacklers. I still haven’t seen a battle report for the last 3 hours of the battle, only what I saw FC’ing the support fleet for the first 3 1/2 hours, but I’ll update this later if possible. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/eve-online-need-goons-v-bob-update/497962.md?page=2)