# Even been a legal code in history that punished criminals AND their families for the perps crimes? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 22, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907 "2012-06-22T02:14:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/1 "2012-06-22T02:14:32Z")
Has there even been a criminal code or legal practice that would not only punish the criminal, but also punish the family of the criminal for the perpetrators crimes? ---
**Author:** ![Horatio\_Hellpop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Horatio\_Hellpop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatio_Hellpop)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/2 "2012-06-22T02:17:37Z")
North Korea punishes the families of people who defect to the South. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/3 "2012-06-22T03:12:53Z")
I believe that North Korea is the only country that currently has this as a general practice, though I don’t know exactly where it is codified in their law. ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/4 "2012-06-22T03:13:12Z")
Yes. At English common law, someone found guilty of treason lost not only their property but the right to pass property through inheritance by “corruption of blood.” Corruption of blood by attainder of treason is forbidden by the U.S. Constitution. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/5 "2012-06-22T03:13:46Z")
I believe that under English common law, the Crown would seize the property of a suicide, in effect punishing his surviving family. ETA: Oops. Because it was common law, by definition that was not part of a legal code, as requested by the OP. ---
**Author:** ![MichaelEmouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/michaelemouse/32/101_2.png) [@MichaelEmouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MichaelEmouse)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/6 "2012-06-22T03:17:22Z")
Can we get biblical in answering the question? ---
**Author:** ![Kinthalis](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kinthalis/32/16084_2.png) [@Kinthalis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kinthalis)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/7 "2012-06-22T03:29:08Z")
Didn’t the code of Hammurabi say that if a house builder built a faulty structure and it killed the owners son, the builders son too would be killed? ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/8 "2012-06-22T03:32:14Z")
I think Isreal punishes families of suicide bombers. Not criminally, IIRC ---
**Author:** ![Nawth\_Chucka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c57346/32.png) [@Nawth\_Chucka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nawth_Chucka)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/9 "2012-06-22T03:33:49Z")
In Michigan, the parents of some truant teens were shackled for days to them as their joint punishment about 15 years ago. Sort of a, “Bet you know where your kid is now” sort of thing. ---
**Author:** ![China\_Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/779978/32.png) [@China\_Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/China_Guy)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/10 "2012-06-22T03:43:42Z")
Confucian code in China held the entire clan accountable for an infraction by a single member. Not sure how “codified” it was though. ---
**Author:** ![Oldeb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ea666f/32.png) [@Oldeb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oldeb)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/11 "2012-06-22T03:59:24Z")
> [@Nawth\_Chucka](#): > > In Michigan, the parents of some truant teens were shackled for days to them as their joint punishment about 15 years ago. Sort of a, “Bet you know where your kid is now” sort of thing. France debated similar, but harsher, legislation a couple of years ago with criminal charges for the parents of repeat juvenile offenders. Nothing really came of it though as there are a whole bunch of problems with the idea. ---
**Author:** ![Dano83860](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a4c791/32.png) [@Dano83860](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dano83860)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/12 "2012-06-22T05:04:24Z")
No one expects the Spanish inquisition. ---
**Author:** ![Darth\_Panda](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ee7513/32.png) [@Darth\_Panda](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Panda)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/13 "2012-06-22T05:26:00Z")
> [@Dano83860](#): > > No one expects the Spanish inquisition. No one inquired about Spanish expectations. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 5:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/14 "2012-06-22T05:32:17Z")
Pretty much the essence of collective punishment. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/15 "2012-06-22T05:45:50Z")
Stalin issued NKVD Order Number 00486 in 1936, which ordered the arrest and imprisonment of family members of people who had already been sentenced for other crimes. The Nazis enacted _Sippenhaft_ (family punishment) laws in 1944. These laws said family members could be punished for treason committed by a relative. (Treason being defined as attempting to overthrow Hitler or the Nazis.) ---
**Author:** ![Mops](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mops/32/16494_2.png) [@Mops](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mops)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/16 "2012-06-22T10:35:13Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > … > > The Nazis enacted _Sippenhaft_ (family punishment) laws in 1944. These laws said family members could be punished for treason committed by a relative. (Treason being defined as attempting to overthrow Hitler or the Nazis.) True about the measure but AFAIK it was not _legislated_ at the time - at that late stage the Nazis did not bother with legislation but instituted such measures by executive decree. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/17 "2012-06-22T10:40:38Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > I believe that under English common law, the Crown would seize the property of a suicide, in effect punishing his surviving family. > > ETA: Oops. Because it was common law, by definition that was not part of a legal code, as requested by the OP. The OP said “legal practice”, doesn’t common law count as legal practice? While banishments would usually force only one person, their families had to choose. Under those legal systems where a woman was considered unable to enter contracts, make decisions for herself or her children, etc., a banishment for the husband meant choosing between going with him or having someone assigned by the court decide where you could live, go to parent-teacher meetings with you, etc. - so yeah, unless the marriage was already very heavily on the rocks or the wife was in an unusually strong position, the whole family would go. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/18 "2012-06-22T10:59:14Z")
A woman I used to know was fined when her son repeatedly skipped school. ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/19 "2012-06-22T11:37:45Z")
Israel punished the families of Palestinians accused of terrorism by destroying their homes. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2012, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907/20 "2012-06-22T11:51:54Z")
> [@Desert\_Nomad](#): > > Israel punished the families of Palestinians accused of terrorism by destroying their homes. Thats war/occupied territory not domestic legal code. The US did something similar in Vietnam, Iraq and also is doing something similar in Afghanistan. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-been-a-legal-code-in-history-that-punished-criminals-and-their-families-for-the-perps-crimes/625907.md?page=2)