# EVEN IF THERE \*IS\* A HEAVEN, why would anyone want to go there? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 17, 2002, 8:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720 "2002-03-17T08:05:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dreamer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6bbea6/32.png) [@dreamer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dreamer)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/21 "2002-03-18T00:24:32Z")
Just for the record - I will be going to Heaven someday :D. With Streets of Gold and a mansion built just for me, how could I not want to go there? Besides the fact that God will be there and ruling the place (and people will actually respect and love him for it), I think there will be things we could not even dream of doing there. IMO with our \* heavenly perfect bodies \* I think we will be able to accomplish anything we want to do, anything we want to learn, and fulfill any dreams we didn’t get the chance to on earth. I even believe we will be able to travel in the speed of light to other planets, if we so choose. Heaven is a place of peace and joy and we will be living there for eternity, I can’t imagine it would ever be boring. Hope to see you all there 🙂 . ---
**Author:** ![Mangetout](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mangetout/32/19_2.png) [@Mangetout](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mangetout)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/22 "2002-03-18T00:33:12Z")
I think this almost belongs in GD, except that I’m sure we did this one not very long ago. It would be a pretty sad and weak God that could only create an eternal resting place like a dentist’s waiting room, most people’s (well, theists anyway) concept of God isn’t like that. ---
**Author:** ![Albert\_Rose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9de053/32.png) [@Albert\_Rose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Albert_Rose)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/23 "2002-03-18T00:37:07Z")
Those silly, amusing little Christians. I wish they were enlightened, like me. I think I’ll insult them now. ---
**Author:** ![JonScribe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3be4f8/32.png) [@JonScribe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JonScribe)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/24 "2002-03-18T01:33:08Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dreamer \* > \*\*Just for the record - I will be going to Heaven someday :D. With Streets of Gold and a mansion built just for me, how could I not want to go there? Besides the fact that God will be there and ruling the place (and people will actually respect and love him for it), I think there will be things we could not even dream of doing there. IMO with our \* heavenly perfect bodies \* I think we will be able to accomplish anything we want to do, anything we want to learn, and fulfill any dreams we didn’t get the chance to on earth. I even believe we will be able to travel in the speed of light to other planets, if we so choose. Heaven is a place of peace and joy and we will be living there for eternity, I can’t imagine it would ever be boring. Hope to see you all there 🙂 . \*\* :Shuddering: Umm, wait a sec, Geezer, I think I’ll join you. ---
**Author:** ![matt\_mcl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ab992/32.png) [@matt\_mcl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/matt_mcl)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/25 "2002-03-18T01:41:14Z")
Whose love is given overwell May look on Helen’s face in Hell; But they whose love is thin and wise May view John Knox in Paradise. -Dorothy Parker, “Partial Comfort” ---
**Author:** ![Shagnasty](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9dc877/32.png) [@Shagnasty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagnasty)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/26 "2002-03-18T02:25:42Z")
For the atheists out there, don’t be so smug. There IS something out there greater than ourselves that we do not understand. It may not fall within the realms of conventional religion but the universe is a strange thing. I don’t know where the universe came from and neither do you. Physicists can describe how parts of our known universe work but can never explain why it is that way or how it originated. To simply declare a belief in atheism simply as a rejection in established religions indicates a weak mind and lack of imagination. There are billions (trillions?) of stars in galaxy alone. There are billions (trillions?) of galaxies in our universe. The question mark on the numbers underscores the fact that no one knows. The fact that our universe exists at all should provide plenty of fodder for awe to last a lifetime. ---
**Author:** ![JonScribe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/3be4f8/32.png) [@JonScribe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JonScribe)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/27 "2002-03-18T03:09:06Z")
That means I gotta believe in a Heaven with wings, harps and golden streets? ---
**Author:** ![Largo62](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Largo62](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Largo62)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/28 "2002-03-18T03:55:12Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Shagnasty \* > \*\*For the atheists out there, don’t be so smug. There IS something out there greater than ourselves that we do not understand. \*\* Which atheists, out where? I’ve just scanned the entire thread, and I haven’t found anyone, including me, who is an avowed atheist in this thread. I am an agnostic, which means I don’t necessarily believe, but I don’t know whether or not there is a god and don’t claim to. Are you one with Mrs. O’Hair in the belief that there are no agnostics, only gutless atheists? Or do you think that anyone who doesn’t see the universe your way is an atheist? Please, there are many people “out there” whose opinions may differ from yours. But you needn’t hang a lable on them that they haven’t expressed themselves. Don’t _ **you** _ be so smug. ---
**Author:** ![JDeMobray](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/85e7bf/32.png) [@JDeMobray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JDeMobray)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/29 "2002-03-18T04:59:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Shagnasty \* > **Physicists can describe how parts of our known universe work but can never explain why it is that way or how it originated.** Geez, we’re working on it. Give us at least a couple thousand years allright? How’s that Second Coming coming along, now that I’ve brought it up? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Profane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47774/32.png) [@Profane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Profane)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/30 "2002-03-18T05:07:51Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Shagnasty \* > \*\*For the atheists out there, don’t be so smug. There IS something out there greater than ourselves that we do not understand. \*\* Cite? I mean, come _on_. I’m supposed to believe that just because you capitalise two letters? ---
**Author:** ![dreamer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6bbea6/32.png) [@dreamer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dreamer)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/31 "2002-03-18T05:35:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by LunaSea \* > \*\* > > Cite? > > I mean, come _on_. I’m supposed to believe that just because you capitalise two letters? \*\* So if I capitalise three letters, can you give me a site that says there is NOT anything out there that can’t be explained and/or proved? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/32 "2002-03-18T05:37:50Z")
Heaven will be full of cats. But you won’t have to clean the litter box. ---
**Author:** ![Profane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47774/32.png) [@Profane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Profane)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 5:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/33 "2002-03-18T05:50:25Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dreamer \* > \*\* > So if I capitalise three letters, can you give me a site that says there is NOT anything out there that can’t be explained and/or proved? \*\* I never said there IS nothing. I _ **believe** _ there is nothing. See the difference? ---
**Author:** ![dreamer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/6bbea6/32.png) [@dreamer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dreamer)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/34 "2002-03-18T05:57:35Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by LunaSea \* > \*\* > I never said there IS nothing. I _ **believe** _ there is nothing. See the difference? \*\* You may believe there is nothing…but I **know** there is something. That’s a huge difference 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DPWhite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d26b3c/32.png) [@DPWhite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPWhite)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/35 "2002-03-18T06:00:42Z")
The Five Stairsteps, Ooh Child is a pretty nice description of heaven.🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Profane](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e47774/32.png) [@Profane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Profane)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/36 "2002-03-18T06:08:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by dreamer \* > \*\* > You may believe there is nothing…but I **know** there is something. That’s a huge difference 😃 \*\* Well, I’m CERTAIN there is nothing. That’s a GIGANTIC difference. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/37 "2002-03-18T08:59:01Z")
In heaven there will be beer and halucinogens (free, of course!)… I only hope we get to keep our scars! I earned mine, and I wanna keep 'em!🆒 ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/38 "2002-03-18T11:15:37Z")
No speed limits, curvy mountain roads, an endless supply of cars and motorbikes, all my friends, and an Irish bar with unlimited Guinness and a clientele consisting out of (among others) Winston Churchill, Oscar Wilde, Ghengis Khan, Mahatma Ghandi, Bartholomeus Dìaz, and Jesus Christ. After a day of riding, we’ll all sit down and have Guinness and discuss politics, culture, and religion. Whaddayamean not all of those people will make it to Heaven? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![kabbes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e99b99/32.png) [@kabbes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kabbes)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/39 "2002-03-18T11:51:38Z")
For the record, **agnostic** means the belief that the nature of God is _unknowable_. It is not a term that should really strictly be used to describe someone who just is undecided. The word agnostic comes from a-gnostic, literally one who does not have the conviction that matter is evil and that emancipation comes through gnosis. The word atheist comes from a-theist - litereally one who is without a belief in God. If you are “undecided” then strictly speaking you are an _atheist_, since you do not have a belief in God. This is generally referred to as “soft” or “weak” atheism to distinguish it from an actual firm belief in the **absence** of God (which would be “hard” or “strong” atheism). It is a pretty common mistake for soft atheists to label themselves agnostic, since the word “atheist” is often erroneously used just for strong atheists and the soft atheists wish to distance themselves from this position. Nevertheless as can be seen from the strict definitions, agnosticism and theism are two different axes on the scale of belief. Mixing them up is a dilution of the power of language to describe belief systems. OK. Carry on. pan ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2002, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720/40 "2002-03-18T13:18:22Z")
> [@](#): > > Yeah, he did. Captain Stormfield Visits Heaven. I’ve never read it. Has anyone here? Not only have I read it (and re-read it, numerous times), but there’s a wonderful _animated_ version of it in the much neglected masterpiece **The Adventures of Mark Twain** , by claymationist Will Vinton. Go get theee a copy, and rejoice. The damned thing has been consigned to the _Children’s_ section of a lot of video stores, where it doesn’t really belong. It also does The Celebrated Jumping Frog of Calaveras County, The Mysterious Stranger, The Diaries of Adam and Eve, and random other Twain pieces, all with considerable wit and verve. I’ve read and love all the works you mention, but I’m a little confused. My edition of **Letters from the Earth** (edited by Bernad de Voto) _has_ “Captain Stormfield’s Visit to Heaven” in it. Regarding the OP, one of my high school english teachers always visualized the idea of everyone perceiving God through all eternity as a sort of perpetual halftiome show, with everyone in stadium seats staring at God on the 50-yard line. It’s an image I can’t get out of my head. In their defence, the folks who coined the original image almost certainly saw it differently. Being united with their Creator gave them a sense of completeness, fulfillment, access to all knowledge and the answers they sought. It was probably like a perpetual physical and intellectual Orgasm, although they certainly wouldn’t have used that term. One in which you were continually finding new knowledge and sensation, so it didn’t grow stale through eternity. Ultimately, though, any human mental image would be a poor image and highly inaccurate, just as our mental perception of a fourth dimension is. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-there-is-a-heaven-why-would-anyone-want-to-go-there/98720.md?page=3)