# Even if you're Obama fan, don't you wonder WTH he's thinking sometimes? (Social Security checks) **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 13, 2011, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824 "2011-07-13T03:12:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/41 "2011-07-14T00:52:44Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > Thanks – that was exactly my point. Your point was that you deliberately misunderstood what he was saying to seem more inflammatory than it actually was? ---
**Author:** ![waterj2](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/858c86/32.png) [@waterj2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/waterj2)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/42 "2011-07-14T01:16:07Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > Your point was that you deliberately misunderstood what he was saying to seem more inflammatory than it actually was? Once people learn that they can put their own right-wing spin on things, Fox News will be out of a job. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/43 "2011-07-14T01:17:06Z")
Well, I hear Rupert Murdoch might be looking for a replacement soon, we have plenty of good candidates right here in our humble abode. ---
**Author:** ![Bloodless\_Turnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@Bloodless\_Turnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bloodless_Turnip)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/44 "2011-07-14T01:38:32Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > How much money is in the Social Security Trust Fund is not relevant to the ability of the government to pay bills if/when the treasury runs dry. > > Like **Jas09** explained before you posted, the debt in the trust fund has to be converted into cash. To turn the debt into cash, there has to be money in the General Fund of the United States in order to redeem the debt. If there is no cash in the General Fund, the debt can’t be converted into cash. > > You can’t say Obama is lying if you do not know the current balance of the General Fund. Let’s review what Obama said: “I cannot guarantee that those checks go out on August 3 if we haven’t resolved this issue. There may simply not be the money in the coffers to do it.” Unless you know that there is sufficient sufficient money in the General Fund to support the checks, and unless you can show that Obama knows that there is sufficient money to do so, your accusation that he is lying is incorrect. Wrong. Those numbers are from Obama’s administration web sites. Now if those numbers are incorrect, then it’s Obama’s administration that is lying. The money is there. He’s lying. Look at the NUMBERS again. [http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np](http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np) Look at the Trustee report AGAIN. [http://www.ssa.gov/oact/trsum/index.html](http://www.ssa.gov/oact/trsum/index.html) Do the math. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/45 "2011-07-14T02:06:02Z")
> [@ladyfoxfyre](#): > > Your point was that you deliberately misunderstood what he was saying to seem more inflammatory than it actually was? Is that what I said in my OP? Seems you’re the one who’s deliberately misunderstanding. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/46 "2011-07-14T02:24:09Z")
I read the OP as saying that it was politically inept for Obama to say something which could be so easily spun against him. That’s certainly debatable, but it’s not inflammatory. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/47 "2011-07-14T02:33:35Z")
> [@MOIDALIZE](#): > > Robert Rubin told Newt Gingrich in 1996 that SS checks weren’t going out unless the debt ceiling was raised. I don’t recall Bill Clinton getting much blowback from that, though the Republicans certainly did. This just shows why Bill Clinton was such a good politician and Obama is such a lousy one. Clinton had an underling convey the message directly to his opponent, letting Rubin play bad cop and himself keep the role of good cop. What he didn’t to was stomp angrily away from negotiations and personally proclaim to the media the bad things that would happen if his opponents didn’t yield, as Obama has done. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/48 "2011-07-14T02:36:12Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > What he didn’t to was stomp angrily away from negotiations Stomped away from whatnow? They’re still negotiating, and he doesn’t sound the least bit angry. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/49 "2011-07-14T02:39:41Z")
I’m only peripherally following the ins and outs of the negotiations, but hasn’t Obama been rebuffed several times? Each time after which he goes out to his podium and natters on about eating peas or some such. And he certainly isn’t smiling. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/50 "2011-07-14T02:39:51Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > . What he didn’t to was stomp angrily away from negotiations and personally proclaim to the media the bad things that would happen if his opponents didn’t yield, as Obama has done. This just demonstrates further your intentional mischaracterization of the events. Obama has not “stomped away angrily” from the negotiations. There was a bipartisan committee formed which Eric Cantor “stomped away from” last week when they realized they’d backed themselves into a corner. The Dems have offered $4 trillion in cuts to reach a deal, and the GOP has not offered anything in the way of increased revenues to help deal with the deficit. Obama’s offered two deals, the $2tril and the $4tril deal. The GOP is leaving the table repeatedly saying they will not accept any tax loopholes be closed, or any raising of taxes on any group whatsoever. Neither is he telling the media that bad things would happen if the GOP didn’t yield, he was asked point blank if he PERSONALLY as PRESIDENT could guarantee the checks would go out and the answer is LEGALLY NO. He doesn’t have the authority to raise the debt limit himself and ensure the checks will go out, so his answer was “I can’t guarantee that if a deal is not reached by August 3rd”. Which isn’t stomping his feet and demanding they give in. If the GOP actually gave a shit about reducing the deficit they’d realize it’s not possible through cuts alone, it has to inclue increased revenue as well. ---
**Author:** ![ladyfoxfyre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ad7895/32.png) [@ladyfoxfyre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladyfoxfyre)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/51 "2011-07-14T02:44:46Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > I’m only peripherally following the ins and outs of the negotiations, but hasn’t Obama been rebuffed several times? Each time after which he goes out to his podium and natters on about eating peas or some such. And he certainly isn’t smiling. Maybe when you start following things more than peripherally you can give us examples of these things you claim are happening. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/52 "2011-07-14T02:45:10Z")
And technically Dan Quayle really did have more experience than JFK in the Senate, and technically Bush Jr.'s ostensible mission was indeed accomplished in Iraq, and technically Jimmy Carter didn’t actually say he was attacked by a swimming bunny rabbit. You and Obama both still don’t seem to get this is politics, not debate team. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/53 "2011-07-14T02:45:19Z")
> [@Bloodless\_Turnip](#): > > Wrong. Those numbers are from Obama’s administration web sites. Now if those numbers are incorrect, then it’s Obama’s administration that is lying. > > The money is there. He’s lying. Look at the NUMBERS again. > > [http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np](http://www.treasurydirect.gov/NP/BPDLogin?application=np) > > Look at the Trustee report AGAIN. > > [http://www.ssa.gov/oact/trsum/index.html](http://www.ssa.gov/oact/trsum/index.html) > > Do the math. Just one question: do you think intragovernmental holdings are cash? ---
**Author:** ![MOIDALIZE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@MOIDALIZE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MOIDALIZE)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/54 "2011-07-14T02:46:26Z")
> [@Koxinga](#): > > What he didn’t to was stomp angrily away from negotiations and personally proclaim to the media the bad things that would happen if his opponents didn’t yield, as Obama has done. That’s Eric Cantor’s interpretation, because the prime requirement for being a wingnut Republican is an inexplicable belief in your own victimhood. What actually happened is that Obama tried to wrap up the meeting and Cantor interjected another of his completely unhelpful “compromises” by suggesting a temporary debt ceiling raise, so that we can go through all this crap again next month. Obama basically told him to get bent. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/55 "2011-07-14T02:46:36Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I thought you were one of those folks who think there is some trust fund built up to pay SS. Why don’t they just tap that fund? > In what sense are the Republicans in power? They control the House, but I thought a party did not control the Senate unless they have a filibuster-proof margin. The GOP does not have such a margin; they aren’t even in the majority, and Obama is a Democrat and holds the Presidency. > > Regards, > Shodan Yo, the quality of your posting has gone down lately. I know you are not this dumb. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/56 "2011-07-14T02:48:46Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Just one question: do you think intragovernmental holdings are cash? It’s like ignorance decided to take the fight to us, taking longer than we thought indeed. ---
**Author:** ![rocking\_chair](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocking_chair/32/2918_2.png) [@rocking\_chair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rocking_chair)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/57 "2011-07-14T02:59:56Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > Stomped away from whatnow? They’re still negotiating, and he doesn’t sound the least bit angry. eric cantor came out of the white house and said that pres. obama told him: “eric, don’t call my bluff on this” " that he will take this to the american people" and that “no president, not even ronald reagan, would sit through such negotiations”. then shoved back his chair and abruptly walked out. the white house states that the meeting was coming to an end, that mr cantor interrupted the pres. at least 3x to push the short term debt ceiling increase. mr obama ended the meeting, (perhaps swatting mr cantor) said “i’ll see you tomorrow”, and left. it may take some time for a vulcan to get annoyed… like say… 3 years, you don’t want to be the one that gets swatted for annoying him. eric cantor since the republican house started seems to be pushing the leader out of the way, and trying to be the guy in charge. for what ever reason boehner is seeming to let him get away with it. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/58 "2011-07-14T03:02:31Z")
> [@rocking\_chair](#): > > for what ever reason boehner is seeming to let him get away with it. Like I said, good cop, bad cop; second string Cantor acts like the attack dog, priming Obama to turn to Boehner as the voice of reason. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/59 "2011-07-14T03:14:50Z")
> [@L. G. Butts](#): > > Yo, the quality of your posting has gone down lately. I know you are not this dumb. Please save this kind of comment for the Pit. ---
**Author:** ![Ca3799](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9f8e36/32.png) [@Ca3799](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ca3799)\ **Post date:** [July 14, 2011, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824/60 "2011-07-14T03:44:33Z")
A quote from Obama during today’s frustrating debt ceiling negotiations: “This may bring my presidency down, but I will not yield on this.” This supports my position upthread that this is not a party man, but a country man. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/even-if-youre-obama-fan-dont-you-wonder-wth-hes-thinking-sometimes-social-security-checks/588824.md?page=4)