# Ever get the urge to deface or destroy religious propoganda in a public place? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 11, 2009, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055 "2009-03-11T10:10:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/101 "2009-03-12T08:44:23Z")
Equating the Bible with white-supremacist propaganda leaflets is like equating _On The Origin of Species_ with _Mein Kampf_ because Hitler advanced evolutionist arguments in support of the right of the Aryan supermen to eradicate Slavs, Jews and the handicapped. The fact that a malicious and evil bigot misapplies the contents of the book to further his evil does not make the book itself evil. Presumably if you supported an organisation that placed pamphlets mildly and reasonably explaining evolution in hotel rooms, you’d have no problem with people deliberately seeking them out and trashing them unread because they were being used to lead people away from God? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 9:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/102 "2009-03-12T09:58:38Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Equating the Bible with white-supremacist propaganda leaflets is like equating _On The Origin of Species_ with _Mein Kampf_ because Hitler advanced evolutionist arguments in support of the right of the Aryan supermen to eradicate Slavs, Jews and the handicapped. The fact that a malicious and evil bigot misapplies the contents of the book to further his evil does not make the book itself evil. The flaw in that argument is the assumption that the bigots are the ones misapplying it. But from my viewpoint, it’s more like bigots using _Mein Kampf_ to support their bigotry - the Bible IS a crazy, evil document, promoting a crazy, evil ideology. The ones who pervert it are the ones who try to do good in it’s name. You no doubt disagree; but do remember that not everyone agrees with you that the Bible is remotely a good, or even neutral book. ---
**Author:** ![ianzin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ed655f/32.png) [@ianzin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ianzin)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/103 "2009-03-12T10:33:13Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Equating the Bible with white-supremacist propaganda leaflets is like equating _On The Origin of Species_ with _Mein Kampf_ because Hitler advanced evolutionist arguments in support of the right of the Aryan supermen to eradicate Slavs, Jews and the handicapped. No, I don’t think it is, for several reasons. First of all, my argument does not _rely_ on how a given work might be mis-represented or mis-applied. The nature of the work itself is also relevant to the point under discussion. There is nothing in _On The Origin Of Species_ that incites or condones violence, slaughter, bloodshed, hatred, bigotry, prejudice and division. The bible explicitly does all of these things, in both the old and the new testament. Secondly, I think your point contains a hidden premise, namely that those who cite the bible when preaching bigotry and hatred are mis-representing its contents. This is not necessarily true. It is possible to quote the bible perfectly accurately and fairly, without taking anything out of context or playing other rhetorical games, and see messages of hate, division and slaughter. If you think the same can be said of _Origin of Species_, please provide one or two relevant quotations. > [@](#): > > The fact that a malicious and evil bigot misapplies the contents of the book to further his evil does not make the book itself evil. I agree with you. I have not contended otherwise. > [@](#): > > Presumably if you supported an organisation that placed pamphlets mildly and reasonably explaining evolution in hotel rooms, you’d have no problem with people deliberately seeking them out and trashing them unread because they were being used to lead people away from God? If I leave free literature in a hotel rooom, I think someone hiring that room can do with that literature as they please: read it, bin it or use it to steady a wobbly table. I have no contract with them. I choose to leave the literature behind. What happens to it after that is not my call. Incidentally, and aside from the main point under discussion, I do not follow why a text about evolution could be said to lead someone away from a god or gods. I believe I’m right in saying that _Origin of Species_ was written by someone who believed in a god. ---
**Author:** ![ianzin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ed655f/32.png) [@ianzin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ianzin)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 10:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/104 "2009-03-12T10:35:16Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > I don’t have a huge problem with what ianzin does with the bibles in his hotel room. I just think it would be more effective if he held his breath and stomped his feet. This made my laugh! **Looch** , I have the horrible suspicion that you may be absolutely right! ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 11:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/105 "2009-03-12T11:54:13Z")
Made me laugh too, **ianzin** , all sympathies on the discussion one way or another aside. Good’un, **Loach**. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/106 "2009-03-12T13:33:45Z")
removed by author ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/107 "2009-03-12T14:05:11Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Presumably if you supported an organisation that placed pamphlets mildly and reasonably explaining evolution in hotel rooms, you’d have no problem with people deliberately seeking them out and trashing them unread because they were being used to lead people away from God? Where did he say he deliberately seeks them out and trashes them? I doubt he books hotel rooms just so he can find those pesky Bibles. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/108 "2009-03-12T14:42:05Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > Equating the Bible with white-supremacist propaganda leaflets is like equating _On The Origin of Species_ with _Mein Kampf_ because Hitler advanced evolutionist arguments in support of the right of the Aryan supermen to eradicate Slavs, Jews and the handicapped. The fact that a malicious and evil bigot misapplies the contents of the book to further his evil does not make the book itself evil. The flaw in this analogy is that it’s no misinterpretation or distortion that parts of the Bible really do advocate some pretty vile things. It advocates for genocide, slavery, racism, sexism, brutal theocracy, religious intolerance and murder for trivial offenses. When bigots seize on those things, they are not misapplying them, they are reading those ancient, archaic sentiments correctly. It’s really those who re-interpret and fanwank the Bible to bring it into conformity with modern sensibilities who are doing the distorting. > [@](#): > > Presumably if you supported an organisation that placed pamphlets mildly and reasonably explaining evolution in hotel rooms, you’d have no problem with people deliberately seeking them out and trashing them unread because they were being used to lead people away from God? Spam is spam. If people want to throw away pamphlets left in their hotel rooms, that’s their prerogative. Why would the content make any difference? ---
**Author:** ![ianzin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/ed655f/32.png) [@ianzin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ianzin)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/109 "2009-03-12T15:01:20Z")
I really like **Diogenes’s** analogy to spam, which had never occurred to me before but which I think is very apt. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/110 "2009-03-12T15:30:09Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > No. A hotel room is a temporary domicile. It’s a private space, not a public one. > > Incorrect. If they leave it my hotel room, they have abandoned it to the guest. It is not hotel property, it is not Gideon property, it’s _abandoned_ property, which makes it the proeprty of whoever rents the room. One more time _They are intended as gifts for the guests_. So, intentions matter, do they? You seem to want to argue that both ways. Then surely the “intention” in this case is that the guest use the bible for the “intended” purpose. Why is that so hard for you to understand? > [@](#): > > Irrelevant to the question. On the contrary. Very relevant to the question. If you have a problem with a space you are renting - then don’t rent it. > [@](#): > > Sure it does. Do you really think you have no right to destroy a pizza menu that gets left in your hotel room? Are you kidding me? Of course you have a “right”. This isn’t a question about _legal rights_, it is an issue about _acting like a childish jerk_. You have the “right” to do lots of things that get you classified as a jerk if you do them - for example, you have the legal “right” not to leave a tip even when waitservice is good. > [@](#): > > The pizza store analogy is nonsense. You aren’t going into _their_ space, they’re coming into _yours_ and leaving garbage. Do you really think you have to treat all advertising litter left in your hotel room as holy and sacred? Who is talking about “holy and sacred”? Oh right - that would be _you_. Point is not to treasure this stuff, but to refrain from pointlessly destroying it. There is a difference. Pointlessly destroying the free stuff left for your use in a hotel room is jerkish, whether it is a pizza ad, a gideon bible, or the shower cap. > [@](#): > > Where are you getting a “pile” from. The analogy is to no more or less than what the pizza joint has voluntarily left in your hotel room. Makes no difference, other than that destroying a _pile_ simply magnifies the trifling. The obvious point of using “pile” is that it shows where your logic leads - trowing out a single menu isn’t a big deal, throwing out a stack clearly is; and according to your position, the one is as “okay” as the other. > [@](#): > > Who gives a shit? Nobody is forcing them to leave their ads in hotel rooms. If people throw them away instead of ordering the pizza, that doesn’t make them victims, and they are free to stop leaving ads in that hotel. Once you voluntarily abandon property, you lose all right to say what the finder can do with it. Once again you mix up legal _rights_ with the freedom to act like a jerk. A waiter does a job knowing that the customer may not leave a tip and has no legal right to a tip. Nonetheless, not leaving a tip when one would be appropriate is jerkish. Similarly, destroying stuff left for your use violates no law (that I know of), but is childish and jerkish. > [@](#): > > Boo fucking hoo. Nobody’s forcing them to waste their resources that way. They’re free to stop any time they want. No, THEY are wasting resources by manufacturing garbage to put in my hotel room. By your logic, you are victimizing internet spammers by filtering spam, because it takes money to create and distribute spam. [/quote] Now, something _you_ do is _them_ doing it? Like they _made_ you pointlessly destroy stuff by putting it in your way? The “spam” analogy is absurd - that’s no different from them _mailing_ you a bible; of course in that case throwing it out isn’t jerkish. > [@](#): > > Well, you can’t seem to identify any victim at all, can you? Well, yes as a matter of fact. > [@](#): > > It’s not vandalism if it’s your own property. Bibles abandoned in my hotel room are my property. The spammers who left it there have surrendered any right to tell me what to do with it. They have chosen to abandon it. It’s not my problem that they spent money on it. Once again, legal property rights have noting to do with it. > [@](#): > > Is it ok to throw away a pizza menu left in your hotel room, yes or no? If the answer is yes, then explain the difference between trashing a free pizza menu and trashing a free Bible. > > There is no “stack of menus” here. There is only what has been voluntarily abandned in your private rented space. > > If someone decides it would be neighborly to leave you an issue of _Honcho_ magazine in your room, do you feel you have the right to throw it away, or do you feel you have a responsibility to treasure and preserve it for the next guest. Again, there is no “responsibility” to do anything; there is a “responsibility” to _refrain_ from pointlessly destroying stuff, even “free” stuff that is “yours” because someone left it for your use - if you want to use it. To use another analogy, if the hotel allowed a company to host a promotional buffet that comes free to all guests, by your logic all the food in the buffet is “yours” because you can eat it if you want; in theory, you could eat all of it. So you have a “right” to tip it into the garbage, assuming that the chef is right there to make more for any other guests? Well, no; common sense dictates that it is only “yours” _to the extent you actually want to use it_. It isn’t “yours” to deliberately destroy, whatever the situation may be under the property laws of your jurisdiction. Your position is no different from that of a PETA member who discovers that the hotel he’s staying at is allowing a company to promote its new line of sauces by hosting a free ribs & bacon buffet, and decides that, because ‘meat = murder’, it is his “right” to go there, take plate after plate of ribs & bacon, and drop them in the garbage. He may well have a perfect _legal_ right to do just that. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/111 "2009-03-12T16:25:19Z")
> [@Malthus](#): > > So, intentions matter, do they? You seem to want to argue that both ways. > > Then surely the “intention” in this case is that the guest use the bible for the “intended” purpose. Why is that so hard for you to understand? No, intentions _don’t_ matter. Once they abandon the property, their intentions in doing so become irrelevant. > [@](#): > > If you have a problem with a space you are renting - then don’t rent it. There really is no option when it comes to hotels, though is there? They all have Gideon Bibles. If I rent a space, it’s mine while I’m renting it. If you don’t want me throwing away your spam, don’t put it in my space. > [@](#): > > Of course you have a “right”. This isn’t a question about _legal rights_, it is an issue about _acting like a childish jerk_ Is someone who throws away a take-out menu being a “childish jerk?” Who is being victimized by me throwing away my own unsolicited spam? > [@](#): > > You have the “right” to do lots of things that get you classified as a jerk if you do them - for example, you have the legal “right” not to leave a tip even when waitservice is good. I’m still waiting for someone to identify any actual _victim_ of this alleged “jerkdom.” > [@](#): > > Who is talking about “holy and sacred”? You. You seem to have some weird notion that people don’t have any right to dispose of unsolicited litter and spam left in their private rented spaces. > [@](#): > > Point is not to treasure this stuff, but to refrain from pointlessly destroying it. There is a difference What exactly IS the difference? > [@](#): > > Pointlessly destroying the free stuff left for your use in a hotel room is jerkish, whether it is a pizza ad, a gideon bible, or the shower cap. Wow. You really do think it’s jerkish to trash a pizza ad? I don’t even know how to respond to that. > [@](#): > > Makes no difference, other than that destroying a _pile_ simply magnifies the trifling. > > The obvious point of using “pile” is that it shows where your logic leads - trowing out a single menu isn’t a big deal, throwing out a stack clearly is; and according to your position, the one is as “okay” as the other. Were talking about what gets abandoned, unsolicited, in other people’s private spaces. If someone abandons a pile of pizza ads on your front porch, are you going to cherish and treasure them forever, or are you going to throw them away? Do you save all your junk mail? > [@](#): > > Once again you mix up legal _rights_ with the freedom to act like a jerk. You need to identify a victim of this alleged jerkdom. > [@](#): > > A waiter does a job knowing that the customer may not leave a tip and has no legal right to a tip. Nonetheless, not leaving a tip when one would be appropriate is jerkish. This is a bullshit analogy. People who spam hotel rooms have done me no service and are entitled to no expectation as to what will happen to their spam. > [@](#): > > Similarly, destroying stuff left for your use violates no law (that I know of), but is childish and jerkish. To WHO? > [@](#): > > Now, something _you_ do is _them_ doing it? Like they _made_ you pointlessly destroy stuff by putting it in your way? If you’re stupid enough to abandon property, you have no right to whine about what happens to it. Do you throw away junk mail? > [@](#): > > The “spam” analogy is absurd - that’s no different from them _mailing_ you a bible; of course in that case throwing it out isn’t jerkish. The only difference is the method of delivery. It’s still unsolicted advertising delivered to someone else’s private space. > [@](#): > > Once again, legal property rights have noting to do with i It has everything to do with it. You’re trying to tell people what to do with their own legal property. > [@](#): > > Again, there is no “responsibility” to do anything; there is a “responsibility” to _refrain_ from pointlessly destroying stuff, even “free” stuff that is “yours” because someone left it for your use - if you want to use it. No there isn’t. There is no such responsibility whatsoever. Doesn’t exist. > [@](#): > > To use another analogy, if the hotel allowed a company to host a promotional buffet that comes free to all guests, by your logic all the food in the buffet is “yours” because you can eat it if you want; in theory, you could eat all of it. So you have a “right” to tip it into the garbage, assuming that the chef is right there to make more for any other guests? No, the anaolgy would be if they left it in my _room_. I would be free to eat or not eat whatever was left in my _room_, especially if I didn’t _ask_ for it. > [@](#): > > Well, no; common sense dictates that it is only “yours” _to the extent you actually want to use it_. It isn’t “yours” to deliberately destroy, whatever the situation may be under the property laws of your jurisdiction. You just like to make up rules, don’t you? Nope, if it’s mine it’s mine. There are no conditions. Those who abandon crap in my room have no right to set conditions on what I can do with it. > [@](#): > > Your position is no different from that of a PETA member who discovers that the hotel he’s staying at is allowing a company to promote its new line of sauces by hosting a free ribs & bacon buffet, and decides that, because ‘meat = murder’, it is his “right” to go there, take plate after plate of ribs & bacon, and drop them in the garbage. The false anaologies just keep on coming with you. Once again, the only proper anaolgy would be to what people leave in your _room_. No one is talking about getting Bibles from a shelf in the lobby and throwing them in the trash. If a hotel agrees to let a rib joint leave a plate of complimentary ribs in each rooms, are you telling me that a vegetarian guest would have no right to throw them away? ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/112 "2009-03-12T16:32:30Z")
The local Roman Catholic Church has a little garden with a stone for all the “murdered unborn victims of abortion.” I once made a pink heart with “for all the victims of “pro-life” violence” on it and left it on the stone. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/113 "2009-03-12T16:38:34Z")
Did they have a stone for the murdered _born_ victims of abortion? Are 42nd-trimester abortions common in Jersey? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/114 "2009-03-12T16:59:21Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Where did he say he deliberately seeks them out and trashes them? I doubt he books hotel rooms just so he can find those pesky Bibles. No, but rummaging around in the drawers until he finds that pesky Gideon Bible and can throw it in the trash comes under the same heading. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/115 "2009-03-12T17:04:52Z")
You don’t have to rummage very far, it’s right in the top drawer, and hey, if someone doesn’t want an unsolicited item abandoned in their private space, no one has a right to tell them they have to treasure and protect it. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/116 "2009-03-12T17:18:38Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > The flaw in that argument is the assumption that the bigots are the ones misapplying it. But from my viewpoint, it’s more like bigots using _Mein Kampf_ to support their bigotry - the Bible IS a crazy, evil document, promoting a crazy, evil ideology. The ones who pervert it are the ones who try to do good in it’s name. > > You no doubt disagree; but do remember that not everyone agrees with you that the Bible is remotely a good, or even neutral book. And perhaps you should remember that not even all atheists believe the Bible to be a work of evil. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/117 "2009-03-12T17:23:58Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > You don’t have to rummage very far, it’s right in the top drawer, and hey, if someone doesn’t want an unsolicited item abandoned in their private space, no one has a right to tell them they have to treasure and protect it. And when I come and leave a Bible in your home without your leave, you can do what you will with it. But when it’s been left, reasonably discreetly, in a \*rented \*space in case someone might like to make use of it, then you don’t have to “treasure and protect it” :rolleyes:, you only have to leave it alone. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Weird\_One](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@The\_Weird\_One](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Weird_One)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/118 "2009-03-12T17:26:55Z")
Last fall, as the U.S. presidential election was coming to a head, my boss and I were running some errands and stopped for lunch. On a table near the door was a display the restaurant had set up, and somebody had left a Chick tract there as well. I’d heard a story on the radio earlier that day about how some Christian Fundamentalists believed and were spreading the idea that Obama was the literal anti-Christ, and I was pissed off at their hateful idiocy. When I saw the Chick tract, I flew into a momentary rage, grabbed it and threw it violently in the trash, much to my boss’ surprise. ---
**Author:** ![Redwing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/dfb087/32.png) [@Redwing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Redwing)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/119 "2009-03-12T17:28:42Z")
While I don’t think destroying the Bibles is terribly mature, I don’t think it qualifies as anything more than immature. The Gideons I’ve met would make the comment that the person throwing it out, or defacing was at least considering the book to have some meaning, and that’s a place to start. Interestingly, I own something like 9 Bibles, and I’ve never bought one. I think 2 or 3 of them are from the Gideons (not from hotel rooms though). I do recall getting use out of one of the hotel room Bibles once, though. I don’t think the Gideons would’ve been happy about it, as I used it to look up verses to make a point against some Christian in an on-line argument. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2009, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055/120 "2009-03-12T17:33:55Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > And when I come and leave a Bible in your home without your leave, you can do what you will with it. But when it’s been left, reasonably discreetly, in a \*rented \*space in case someone might like to make use of it, then you don’t have to “treasure and protect it” :rolleyes:, you only have to leave it alone. There is no difference between leaving it in my house and leaving it in my rented hotel room. My space is my space. What you abandon in it belongs to me. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-get-the-urge-to-deface-or-destroy-religious-propoganda-in-a-public-place/489055.md?page=7)