# Ever heard of a police checkpoint "survey" like this? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 30, 2010, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031 "2010-08-30T18:55:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/21 "2010-09-01T17:13:24Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > > [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > > > The lawyer says that the police can’t stop every vehicle. The police say in their report that they stopped every vehicle. I wonder if this guy practices in that county? > > The law in Virginia does not forbid stopping every vehicle. (See Crouch v. Commonwealth, 494 SE 2d 144, 26 Va. App. 214 (1997) for a description of a valid checkpoint that stopped every vehicle). > > But it does requires that the checkpoint’s rules be determined in advance. That is, the checkpoint operators can’t check every vehicle when traffic is light, and then start to check only every fourth vehicle when it gets heavy. Any substantial discretion left to the checkpoint’s operators, rather than determined in advance, voids the checkpoint’s validity. > > > [@Hall v. Commonwealth](#): > > > > To ensure that an individual’s expectation of privacy is not subjected to arbitrary invasion solely at the unfettered discretion of police officers in the field, seizures at roadblocks must be carried out pursuant to plans embodying explicit, neutral limitations on the conduct of the individual officer. Thanks, **Bricker**. How can that lawyer make that claim, then? Doesn’t that put him afoul of some bar ethics rule or something? Just curious and trying to resolve the dichotomy; I have no dog in any fight here. ---
**Author:** ![Woeg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/df705f/32.png) [@Woeg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Woeg)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/22 "2010-09-01T18:12:42Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > > [@Woeg](#): > > > > My brother is a lieutenant for the Norfolk PD - I’ll forward him the OP and have him give me the straight dope on it! 🙂 > > Now that’s progress. I’m guessing there is a grain of truth in this third-hand story but it’s probably not as bad as it seems. I forwarded it to my sister-in-law as well, as she is a detective for the Norfolk PD (different division). She and my bro talked about it at lunch, and here is what she said: > [@](#): > > First of all…was this conducted by police officers??? It sounds totally bogus to us! No police officer is going to take your blood on the street! I sense the blowing of smoke from said co-worker’s direction… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 6:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/23 "2010-09-01T18:44:41Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > Thanks, **Bricker**. How can that lawyer make that claim, then? Doesn’t that put him afoul of some bar ethics rule or something? Just curious and trying to resolve the dichotomy; I have no dog in any fight here. Well, he says: > [@](#): > > Instead, authorities employ a mathematical formula to determine which vehicles will be stopped (such as every 4th vehicle, and so on). He’s not wrong. He says “such as” every 4th vehicle as an example of the kind of thing they might do. But another mathematical forumal would be “every single vehicle.” The key is not whether all cars are checked or not, but that the rule is determined ahead of time and cannot be altered by the officers at the checkpoint. “Every fourth car” is a fine rule. “Every single car” is a fine rule, too. “Hey, traffic’s light; let’s start checking every car even though we started out to check every fourth car,” is not. I grant you he could be clearer, but he’s not said anything so outrageously wrong as to subject him to any sort of sanctions. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/24 "2010-09-01T18:59:51Z")
> [@Woeg](#): > > > [@](#): > > > > First of all…was this conducted by police officers??? It sounds totally bogus to us! No police officer is going to take your blood on the street! > > I sense the blowing of smoke from said co-worker’s direction… 😉 What? Traffic cops aren’t trained to find a vein and take a sample while ensuring compliance with proper phlebotomy and infection control practices? ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/25 "2010-09-01T19:15:45Z")
> [@Yarster](#): > > I Did they have a qualified plebotomist just randomly sitting at the side of the road waiting to do this? Fuuuuck. I’ve been saying ‘flebotomist’ for ages. It’s one of those words I use often, too, just because I liked how it rolled off my lips and it seemed a cool word to know. I feel so stupid. ---
**Author:** ![mnemosyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c4cdca/32.png) [@mnemosyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mnemosyne)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/26 "2010-09-01T19:33:36Z")
😕 [Phlebotomist](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phlebotomist). ---
**Author:** ![gwendee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/35a633/32.png) [@gwendee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gwendee)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/27 "2010-09-01T20:14:43Z")
> [@Acid\_Lamp](#): > > Thirded! I’d happily answer the questions, but never allow DNA to be taken. Me, too! Nobody’s swabbing my cheek without a court order. I’m pretty easy going about most things, but not about biological samples. To more directly answer the OP, no, I have never heard of such a thing. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/28 "2010-09-01T21:09:49Z")
> [@mnemosyne](#): > > 😕 > > [Phlebotomist](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phlebotomist). Ok. When Yarster posted the word spelled ‘plebotomist’, I panicked and thought I had been pronouncing it wrong all my life. Now I see it was simply a typo, and I haven’t been pronouncing it wrong at all. Whew. I’m sure I’ve been spelling it wrong, though. ---
**Author:** ![user\_hostile](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/user_hostile/32/474_2.png) [@user\_hostile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/user_hostile)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/29 "2010-09-01T21:54:05Z")
I would have refused. The cop made it clear that it was voluntary–in other words, there was no probable cause. Presuming she was sober or not, all she had to say was: “I am not consenting to a search, officer” Which would be followed by the following question: “Am I being detained officer, or am I free to go?” And that would have been the end of it. What happen here was the cops took advantage of her ignorance of her 4th (search) and 5th amendment (self-incrimination) rights. That DNA swap can come back to haunt her should it ever she pop up in a database; mistakes [happen](http://www.seattlepi.com/local/183018_crimelabboxesweb22.html) even with DNA. Remember: “EVERYTHING CAN AND WILL BE USED AGAINST YOU IN A COURT OF LAW.” ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/30 "2010-09-01T21:54:53Z")
The closest thing I’ve heard of is women being pulled over and made to perform oral sex on (corrupt) officers under fear of arrest. ---
**Author:** ![Valgard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/7feea3/32.png) [@Valgard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valgard)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2010, 10:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/31 "2010-09-01T22:24:08Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > The closest thing I’ve heard of is women being pulled over and made to perform oral sex on (corrupt) officers under fear of arrest. “Swabbing your cheeks”, indeed. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2010, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/32 "2010-09-02T11:37:04Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > The closest thing I’ve heard of is women being pulled over and made to perform oral sex on (corrupt) officers under fear of arrest. AKA Supporting the policeman’s ball(s).😉 ---
**Author:** ![VunderBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/839c29/32.png) [@VunderBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VunderBob)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2010, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/33 "2010-09-02T12:20:46Z")
> [@Woeg](#): > > > [@control-z](#): > > > > Now that’s progress. I’m guessing there is a grain of truth in this third-hand story but it’s probably not as bad as it seems. > > I forwarded it to my sister-in-law as well, as she is a detective for the Norfolk PD (different division). She and my bro talked about it at lunch, and here is what she said: > > > [@](#): > > > > First of all…was this conducted by police officers??? It sounds totally bogus to us! No police officer is going to take your blood on the street! > > I sense the blowing of smoke from said co-worker’s direction… 😉 I have to call bullshit on the situation. I’m an EMT, and I have taken blood samples at traffic stops for drunk driving evidence. Caveats before the explanation: my jurisdiction is North Carolina, not VA, although I am in the general area as the reported incident. 1. Blood samples have to get to a hospital or lab within the hour of draw or they are unusable. 2. There is a mound of paperwork involved to establish a chain of evidence for blood sample; I presume the same is true for cheek swabs. 3. I cannot draw blood on anyone the cop directs me to. The person in question has to be already in custody. ---
**Author:** ![VunderBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/839c29/32.png) [@VunderBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VunderBob)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2010, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/34 "2010-09-02T13:08:53Z")
Checkpoints are common in the area, on both sides of the state line. [This one is happening today,](http://hamptonroads.com/2010/09/chesapeake-police-stopping-drivers-today-us-17?cid=ltst) and no doubt will get people fleeing the Outer Banks ahead of the hurricane. ---
**Author:** ![shiftless](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9c0ed/32.png) [@shiftless](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shiftless)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2010, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/35 "2010-09-02T13:26:51Z")
This pings my BS meter too… although. The Hampton Roads/Norfolk area is a huge military area with dozens of bases. Military police could probably conduct a more through “survey” than the city police. ---
**Author:** ![Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9d8465/32.png) [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Swallowed_My_Cellphone)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2010, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031/36 "2010-09-02T14:16:20Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Ok. When Yarster posted the word spelled ‘plebotomist’, I panicked and thought I had been pronouncing it wrong all my life. Now I see it was simply a typo, and I haven’t been pronouncing it wrong at all. 😕 :smack: I’ve been spelling it right but pronouncing it wrong. I’ve pronounced it “pluh-botomist”, like the H was silent. Never noticed anyone else saying “fluh-”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ever-heard-of-a-police-checkpoint-survey-like-this/552031.md?page=1)