# Everest: Just Don't Do It **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 22, 2016, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397 "2016-05-22T21:31:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 31
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/601 "2023-06-03T16:07:26Z")
As a followup to that post, it occurred to me that a better accomplishment woulkd be the first person to summit a mountain no one had summited before. So I looked it up; the tallent unclimbed mountain is probably Gangkar Puensum, which is in the Himalayas, of course. (“Probably” because not every mountain is all that reliably measured.) It’s substantially shorter than the real monsters and the peak is below the Death Zone, but it’s actually illegal to attempt it, so no one does. Amusingly, the first line of the Wikipedia article about it reads: " An **unclimbed mountain** is a [mountain peak](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Summit) that has yet to be [climbed](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mountaineering) to the top." You don’t say! Thanks for the clarification! ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/602 "2023-06-03T16:15:39Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > better accomplishment woulkd be the first person to summit a mountain no one had summited before Depends on the mountain (and the route), no? And does it have to have been unclimbed? If you told me you summitted K2 via Wiessner’s 1939 route, I would be suitably impressed. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/603 "2023-06-03T16:18:52Z")
> [@Section\_Maker\_Jupe](#): > > The article from cowboy state daily has a video from twitter of the line snaking to the top. One step, wait…one step…wait. Got any oxygen I can borrow? (May 30 2023) In the video clip, the two ropes with one empty reminds me of the situation where two lanes on a highway are merging half a mile ahead for roadworks, and everyone has merged way too early into one lane. Then one guy says: fuck this, I’m going to use the empty lane up until the merge point, as recommended on the signs for optimal traffic flow. But then everyone who merged way too early goes into fits of righteous anger that someone is getting ahead of them. Nobody on the full rope is going to leave a gap for that guy to merge up ahead. My preferred strategy is to wait for somebody else to go and be the second or third one using the empty lane up to the merge point as you are supposed to. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/604 "2023-06-03T16:23:18Z")
People in that line don’t look like they’re “conquering” shit. It’s become not much more than a queue for a ride at Disneyland, with the added urgency of running out of oxygen and becoming a cairn. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/605 "2023-06-03T16:26:31Z")
> [@snowthx](#): > > becoming a cairn All the outfits are very colorful, but nobody is wearing green boots. I suspect that the market for green boots may have dried up. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/606 "2023-06-03T16:28:20Z")
Hesitate to even post this question, but honestly really truly how difficult is it? The biggest hurdle seems to be oxygen. The video above looks like 2-3 steps, stop to rest, continue. I’m not saying it isn’t hard, but I’m curious to have it compared to other more readily graspable endeavors. ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/607 "2023-06-03T16:34:17Z")
Have you ever climbed a peak at lower elevation? Try summiting any 10,000 ft peak in the lower 48 - some of them have very steep slopes without ice or need of oxygen bottles. It’s pretty tough, I am sure. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/608 "2023-06-03T16:34:26Z")
It’s obviously steep and exposed in places, but all reports say there is really no significant technical climbing at all when the fixed ropes are in place. The biggest challenge is whether your cardiovascular system can cope. You need to be very fit, but there’s a significant innate component to whether your body copes well with high altitude that is independent of acclimatization or fitness training. You see a similar thing on a smaller scale in the far more modest places I’ve been like the Sierra Nevada - some people just don’t do well with high elevation even if they are very fit. ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/609 "2023-06-03T16:37:39Z")
I said that I’m sure it’s difficult. However, the two limiting factors to success being 1) money to attempt in the first place and 2) carrying enough oxygen, I feel that must somewhat skew the perception vs. actual difficulty. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 4:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/610 "2023-06-03T16:58:02Z")
It can also get a bit windy, a bit chilly and a bit snowy, Sicks\_Ate. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/611 "2023-06-03T17:06:02Z")
> [@Al128](#): > > Jokes aside … door-to-door it probably takes 2+ months to do this … that’s not an easy task for the avg. Joe-the-workdrone to do (beyond the mere financials of the endeavour) Yes but if it’s a difficult challenge someone wants they can always row across the Pacific Ocean in a canoe. A good water filter and a fishing pole and off you go. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/612 "2023-06-03T17:12:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > A good water filter Yup, no way I drinking seawater with bits of seaweed floating in it. ---
**Author:** ![carrps](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carrps/32/2957_2.png) [@carrps](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carrps)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/613 "2023-06-03T17:17:46Z")
I summited Mt. Whitney. There’s an actual hiking trail and all, but the altitude got to me. It was probably the fittest I’d ever been, but I barfed my way to the summit after crossing over to the Western face. Just walking at altitude can be a struggle. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/614 "2023-06-03T17:29:12Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Five percent of the people who have tried to climb it have died doing it The ratio of people who died vs those who _tried_ to summit is much lower. The 5% number is those who died vs those who _did_ summit. The number who tried to summit and failed (but didn’t die) is much higher. ---
**Author:** ![gkster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gkster/32/14107_2.png) [@gkster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gkster)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/615 "2023-06-03T17:59:36Z")
I made a similar point in post 584 above. And it’s interesting to see that the average age of those summiting has risen. Thanks for the data @Riemann and @Dorjan . I wonder if those stats include Sherpas? ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/616 "2023-06-03T18:57:00Z")
Where I live, that’s called “zipper merging.” ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/617 "2023-06-03T18:57:44Z")
> [@Section\_Maker\_Jupe](#): > > The article from cowboy state daily has a video from twitter of the line snaking to the top Can someone help situate that video? There’s obviously **a** base camp at the bottom of the line; how far is the summit from there? Also, besides oxygen, what else are they typically packing on their backs? I was under the impression that this is a final push to the summit and that at this point they would only be wearing what they need, except for oxygen. I also wonder if scenes like this make it appear safer and more banal (if that makes sense), like a line-up for a ski lift or something. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/618 "2023-06-03T19:39:02Z")
> [@gkster](#): > > I wonder if those stats include Sherpas? I separated out Nepali nationality (almost all Sherpa) from all other nationalities. **NEPAL** | decade | summits | mean age | deaths | mean age | | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | | 1973-82 | 21 | 26.5 | 9 | 28.2 | | 1983-92 | 90 | 30.1 | 15 | 32.9 | | 1993-02 | 479 | 30.8 | 12 | 29.5 | | 2003-12 | 2273 | 31.7 | 13 | 38.9\* | | 2013-22 | 2782 | 33.4 | 39 | 35.6 | (\*35.4 excluding an 81-year-old) **ALL OTHER NATIONALITIES** | decade | summits | mean age | deaths | mean age | | --- | --- | --- | --- | --- | | 1973-82 | 83 | 32.3 | 14 | 34.6 | | 1983-92 | 257 | 33.7 | 35 | 34.5 | | 1993-02 | 690 | 37.1 | 44 | 39.1 | | 2003-12 | 2315 | 38.3 | 45 | 43.4 | | 2013-22 | 2144 | 39.8 | 31 | 45.3 | The most notable thing is the sharp rise in deaths among Nepalis in the last decade, while the death rate among other nationalities (presumably mostly paying clients) has fallen. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/619 "2023-06-03T19:39:04Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The number who tried to summit and failed (but didn’t die) is much higher. Yeah, my rebuttal to the actual figure of about 1% was back in post #86. A personal rebuttal, but heartfelt 😉. There is literally nothing I would knowingly attempt with a 1% fatality rate (I do have to account here for unknowing stupidity). That’s some down right courting of Natural Selection. I’m afraid my private reaction to someone discussing their conquest of Everest at a party would probably be mild disdain of their vainglory. I would charitably keep my bad opinion to myself and hey, most folks who summit Everest are probably awesome people overall. But for me that’s at least one negative check mark on the old life resume. ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 3, 2023, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397/620 "2023-06-03T19:53:58Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > There is literally nothing I would knowingly attempt with a 1% fatality rate For me, it would depend entirely on the value of the achievement, both subjectively to me and historically. I certainly wouldn’t climb Everest _now_ with a 1% probability of death, but if it were 1950 and I had the skills, I’d risk a 20% probability of death to be the _first_. In the era before the world was fully explored - going off to discover and explore an entire new _continent_ with a 50% chance of not coming back? Sure, why not. Better than staying home and dying from a tooth abscess. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397.md?page=30) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everest-just-dont-do-it/755397.md?page=32)