# "Everybody draw Mohammed" on May 20 to support South Park **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 25, 2010, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307 "2010-04-25T16:39:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/41 "2010-04-25T19:18:51Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > The point I’m making is that “civilised”, non-extremist type people shouldn’t get offended if someone pokes fun at their team, and it’s extremely hypocritical for people to react to verbal and visual insults with threats of physical violence, Yes, it is. > [@](#): > > and the people who have these attitudes need to be smoked out and beaten around the head with a clue-stick. As long as it’s actually helpful. And phrased a wee bit better than that, i’d wager. ---
**Author:** ![Simplicio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c37758/32.png) [@Simplicio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Simplicio)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/42 "2010-04-25T19:25:45Z")
> [@Walmarticus](#): > > I realize we are on a very slippery slope, lubed with the blood of democracy and KY. First, Comedy Central censors a show (and is mocked as spineless for doing it). Next, to go is the bacon. Then, they’ll be stapling hijabs on our women. Before you know it, BAM- minaret to the face! Please don’t post “slippery slope” arguments, even farcical ones, without the word “Hitler” in them. On SDMB, all slippery slopes must end at Hitler’s house. > [@ivan](#): > > Muslims could help here by reporting the nutjobs amongst their community anonymously. I wonder how much help we’ve received from them so far? Err…we already know who sent the threat. ---
**Author:** ![gonzomax](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e8c25b/32.png) [@gonzomax](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gonzomax)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/43 "2010-04-25T19:30:01Z")
Comedy Central is pretty gutless anyway. You would think a network that wants to appeal to the young and hip would not censure so much. They bleep the language in"Idiocracy" for crying out loud. That is not a nasty movie at all. ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/44 "2010-04-25T19:34:06Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > Oddly enough I can’t find that comment in the Fox News article, it seems to be from a Globe and Mail opinion piece ([here](http://www.newsrunner.com/display-article/?eUrl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theglobeandmail.com%2Fnews%2Fopinions%2Fjihad-jitters-at-comedy-central%2Farticle1545262%2F%3Fcmpid%3Drss1%26utm_source%3Dfeedburner%26utm_medium%3Dfeed%26utm_campaign%3DFeed%253A%2BTheGlobeAndMail-International%2B%2528The%2BGlobe%2Band%2BMail%2B-%2BWorld%2BNews%2529&eSrc=The+Globe+and+Mail+-+Toronto+ON+-+Canada&eTitle=Jihad+jitters+at+Comedy+Central)) Sorry, I did not mean to say that the expression “lowest point. . . . .” occurs in the Fox news story, even though my OP can possibly be read that way. But if you look at my sentence (below) it does not quite say that the expression occurs in the Fox story. What I said was: _Comedy Central, in a move that has been called “the lowest point in the history of American TV”, has censored the popular cartoon satire show as explained here._ In other words, “as explained here” really refers only to “has censored”. At least that is what I meant. The expression is indeed from an article in the Saturday Globe and Mail. I have also heard it called “shameful” and “gutless” in other media. BTW, if the superlative “lowest” seems inappropriate to you, add the words “one of the lowest”. I am not going to argue about details. Sorry I was not clearer. Consider the nit picked. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/45 "2010-04-25T19:35:05Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Err…we already know who sent the threat. When I said “here”, I meant in general, not this particular case. I was just musing on how many calls the police might get claiming such and such a person is buying a lot of fertiliser, etc, from actual members of muslim communities, as opposed to people just making prank calls labelling x as a terrorist sympathiser. ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/46 "2010-04-25T19:38:01Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > **Valteron** , please don’t use this board to try to get people to join a campaign. It’s against the registration agreement. I’m not going to close the thread down because the episode and the campaign are both valid debate topics, but keep this in mind in the future. Not a problem. Please consider my comment changed to “What do you think of the May 20 campaign?” or something of the kind. ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/47 "2010-04-25T19:42:18Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Weird, my dictionary only gives a one-word definition for “analogy”. > > Analogy > Pronunciation: \ə-ˈna-lə-jē > Function: noun > Inflected Form(s): plural anal·o·gies > Date: 15th century > 1). Woosh You win the thread. ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/48 "2010-04-25T19:45:49Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > When I said “here”, I meant in general, not this particular case. I was just musing on how many calls the police might get claiming such and such a person is buying a lot of fertiliser, etc, from actual members of muslim communities, as opposed to people just making prank calls labelling x as a terrorist sympathiser. This comment reminds me of another fact. We are constantly being fed the simplistic idea that the Muslim world is made up of either 1) terrorists with a truck full of bombs or 2) law-abiding peaceful people you would love to meet. How possible is it that there is a middle ground of Muslims who agree with or to some degree sympathize with terrorists and those who use force? When this 20-year-old “kid” who made the threat against South Park succeeds in intimidating Comedy Central into censorship, is there a certain sector of Islam that thinks he did good? How large would this opinion group be, do you suppose? ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/49 "2010-04-25T19:51:04Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > The point of ridiculing their beliefs is to prod them into thinking for themselves… Is there any reason to this this would work? Do you know any group that was ridiculed into thinking for themselves? ---
**Author:** ![BrotherCadfael](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@BrotherCadfael](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrotherCadfael)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/50 "2010-04-25T20:05:38Z")
> [@thirdname](#): > > As I mentioned in another thread, the guy who writes the “revolution muslim” blog is a 20-year-old white guy who lives with his mother in Fairfax County, Virginia and converted fairly recently in order to marry a Muslim girl. Keep that in mind when you’re complaining about what muslims are doing, that this is an upper-middle class American kid that did this, not some foreign invader. [Is “Radical Muslim” the New Goth?](http://althouse.blogspot.com/2010/04/is-radical-muslim-new-goth.html) ---
**Author:** ![Rhythmdvl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@Rhythmdvl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rhythmdvl)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/51 "2010-04-25T20:06:54Z")
I haven’t read too much on it so I could be missing something, but I’m not sure Comedy Central was the censor—I took it as an intentional joke. I’m aware that the linked story has CC taking credit for the censorship, but that may be part of the joke. Two things stand out. First, Tom Cruise was censored when he stepped out of the machine. Was CC so paranoid that they covered him up too? That makes a couple later jokes (e.g., when the censor block disappears and everyone sees Tom with Seaman (snicker) on his back) seem out of place. Second, the “I learned something today” speeches were bleeped the entire way through. Unless they were saying Mohamed Mohamed Mohamed over and over again, that too falls apart if it was CC censoring the show after the fact. And if it _was_ CC censoring (i.e., if it was just Mohamed Mohamed Mohamed… then the “learned something” speeches were anomalous to the rest of the episode. I suppose it’s possible, and it’s also possible that the version I DVRd was different from the general airing, but something just doesn’t fit with CC doing all the censoring. I suspect the episode may have been lampooning the quick-to-froth-at-the-mouth folks at the OP’s link. On an unrelated note, there are periodic hues and cries, particularly on Fox, regarding defaming or insulting Christianity. Does anyone remember [_Sensation_](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sensation_%28exhibition%29) at the Brooklyn Museum? Or Serrano’s [Piss Christ](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piss_Christ)? Is anyone claiming that Comedy Central did the right thing by being respectful of religion, yet wrong by allowing Jesus et al to be depicted as they were? ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/52 "2010-04-25T20:12:04Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > The point I’m making is that “civilised”, non-extremist type people shouldn’t get offended if someone pokes fun at their team, and it’s extremely hypocritical for people to react to verbal and visual insults with threats of physical violence, so the people who have these attitudes need to be smoked out and beaten around the head with a clue-stick. > > Muslims could help here by reporting the nutjobs amongst their community anonymously. I wonder how much help we’ve received from them so far? They aren’t offended that we are poking fun at their team. They find it objectionable to depict the prophet Mohamed, PBUH, period. Remember how the 10 Commandments included: 3 You shall not make for yourself an idol, whether in the form of anything that is in heaven above, or that is on the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth." 7 You shall not make wrongful use of the name of the Lord your God, for the Lord will not acquit anyone who misuses his name. Islam has similar statements (coincidence?). Depicting the prophet Mohamed, PBUH, is seen as idol worship. Which is why they don’t adorn their mosques with giant statues of him, or cover the ceilings with his likeness, or make big big stain glass windows of him. Showing pictures of Jesus getting fucked by a pig isn’t a way of buddying up to them, “ha ha, look we can have fun with our messiah too.” It just shows that we have no respect for our religion or its alleged son of God. The equivalent protest would be for every woman in the US to bare their breasts and write FUCK on their chests, and then every newspaper in the country to put a picture of that on their front page. Unless censorship isn’t actually the issue. South Park has been heavily censored by Comedy Central AND the US government since 1997. Now you’re angry about something? If me ridiculing you won’t prod you to think for yourself, good luck getting a billion other people to change. ---
**Author:** ![Llama\_Llogophile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@Llama\_Llogophile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Llama_Llogophile)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/53 "2010-04-25T20:12:08Z")
Hmm, tough one. I’d be willing to sign on if it could be shown that a majority of the people participating would also do the following to demonstrate freedom of speech: - Burn an American flag - Support display of Andres Serrano’s “Piss Christ” - Wear a head scarf for a day in opposition to the French attempting to limit its use ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/54 "2010-04-25T20:18:24Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > Islam has similar statements (coincidence?). Depicting the prophet Mohamed, PBUH, is seen as idol worship. Which is why they don’t adorn their mosques with giant statues of him, or cover the ceilings with his likeness, or make big big stain glass windows of him. I think this came up in one of the Cafe Society threads, but not all Islamic denominations interpret this rule as a ban on depictions of Muhammad. Some interpret it as a ban on drawing any living thing, which is why Islamic calligraphy came into existence. But there is Islamic art featuring Muhammad. > [@](#): > > South Park has been heavily censored by Comedy Central AND the US government since 1997. How does the government censor South Park? FCC restrictions (pointless though they are) do not apply to cable. Whatever censorship Comedy Central makes on its own show is done by choice to make sure they don’t alienate advertisers or viewers. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/55 "2010-04-25T20:25:37Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > [Is “Radical Muslim” the New Goth?](http://althouse.blogspot.com/2010/04/is-radical-muslim-new-goth.html) What would we call the Muslim version of that store in the mall, where all the cool kids go to buy their burqas and hijabs, Zakāt Topic? ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/56 "2010-04-25T20:27:11Z")
You know what this reminds me up? First year university living in a dorm. During exams, our dorm had “23 hour quiet” meaning that 1 hour every evening people could relax and turn on their music. Result: Every idiot with a stereo set the alarm for 7pm, and the sleep timer for 59min, and the volume to 11. How about instead of expressing our freedom of speech by acting like assholes, we instead show are responsibility by respecting those of different beliefs. We don’t _need_ to depict the prophet Mohamed, PBUH. Similar to my statements regarding smoking, people don’t _need_ to smoke inside, but because they can’t show responsibility and respect for others, we end up anti-smoking legislation. All this protest is doing is showing that we, the collective we, are assholes not worthy of sympathy. If you want a Muslim to report a known terrorist cell, don’t shit on his front lawn. Based on the Starving Artist Straight Dope System of Debate Scoring ™, I also need to say that I find this anger and its subsequent protest nonsense. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/57 "2010-04-25T20:31:11Z")
There’s little point to this protest, but it’s hard to demonstrate the limits of free speech or do comedy without being an asshole to somebody. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/58 "2010-04-25T20:34:03Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I think this came up in one of the Cafe Society threads, but not all Islamic denominations interpret this rule as a ban on depictions of Muhammad. Some interpret it as a ban on drawing any living thing, which is why Islamic calligraphy came into existence. But there is Islamic art featuring Muhammad. Here’s a bunch of Muslim depictions of Muhammed: > **[Mohammed Image Archive - Islamic Depictions of Mohammed in Full](http://zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/islamic_mo_full/)** And Muslim depictions of Muhammed with his face hidden (some of these possibly originally included his face and were later altered) > **[Mohammed Image Archive - Islamic Depictions of Mohammed with Face Hidden](http://zombietime.com/mohammed_image_archive/islamic_mo_face_hidden/)** ---
**Author:** ![emacknight](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/3ec8ea/32.png) [@emacknight](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emacknight)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/59 "2010-04-25T20:38:10Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > There’s little point to this protest, but it’s hard to demonstrate the limits of free speech or do comedy without being an asshole to somebody. What if we made May 20th International Day of Not Being an Asshole. Right now it’s being advertised as exactly the opposite. A little over 1/6th of the population would rather you (not you specifically) didn’t depict images of the prophet Mohamed, PBUH. What if on May 20th we collectively respected their wishes. Obviously we’re not going to get US soldiers off Muslim land, or alter our support for Israel. But couldn’t we just behave like decent human beings on ONE day a year? ---
**Author:** ![Valteron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/f17d59/32.png) [@Valteron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Valteron)\ **Post date:** [April 25, 2010, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307/60 "2010-04-25T20:42:27Z")
> [@emacknight](#): > > You know what this reminds me up? First year university living in a dorm. During exams, our dorm had “23 hour quiet” meaning that 1 hour every evening people could relax and turn on their music. > > Result: Every idiot with a stereo set the alarm for 7pm, and the sleep timer for 59min, and the volume to 11. > > How about instead of expressing our freedom of speech by acting like assholes, we instead show are responsibility by respecting those of different beliefs. > > We don’t _need_ to depict the prophet Mohamed, PBUH. > > Similar to my statements regarding smoking, people don’t _need_ to smoke inside, but because they can’t show responsibility and respect for others, we end up anti-smoking legislation. > > All this protest is doing is showing that we, the collective we, are assholes not worthy of sympathy. If you want a Muslim to report a known terrorist cell, don’t shit on his front lawn. > > Based on the Starving Artist Straight Dope System of Debate Scoring ™, I also need to say that I find this anger and its subsequent protest nonsense. You have confused and mixed up so many issues here that it would take a year to pull it aall apart and make sense of it, but let me try on a couple of your ideas. \*“We don’t _need_ to depict the prophet Mohamed, PBUH.” \* No, of course not. But what I need and what I will literally give up over my dead body is the freedom to depict him, mock him, or praise him, or any other religious leader or religious idea. _“How about instead of expressing our freedom of speech by acting like assholes, we instead show are responsibility by respecting those of different beliefs.”_ If all of us show respect to Mohammed and Islam by never mocking them, what message will we have sent to the people who threaten to (or do) murder cartoonists or film makers like Theo van Gogh? Obviously, that under the threat of violence, we will throw our freedom of expression out the window. Nice going, man! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/everybody-draw-mohammed-on-may-20-to-support-south-park/537307.md?page=4)