# Evidence for a larger home-protection gun... **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 28, 2006, 7:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224 "2006-03-28T07:29:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![CynicalGabe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/3e96dc/32.png) [@CynicalGabe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CynicalGabe)\ **Post date:** [March 28, 2006, 10:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/21 "2006-03-28T22:02:04Z")
> [@Shagnasty](#): > > Well, my father was a gun dealer growing up and I certainly know the sound well. It would scare the piss out of me so, if you are trying to scare me out of your house, it would probably work. Are you a burgler? šŸ™‚ Allin good fun, guys. ---
**Author:** ![Tomcat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Tomcat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tomcat)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 9:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/22 "2006-03-29T09:48:18Z")
> [@Mr. Moto](#): > > For home defense I currently have a .45 caliber handgun. I do own a 12-guage shotgun, but it isnā€™t a suitable home defense weapon because it is inaccessable (kept in a keyed lock safe) and is double barrel. What are the power differences between .45s and .410s? I know they are [interchangeable](http://www.taurususa.com/products/product-details.cfm?model=4410TrackerB&category=Revolver) for some guns. That was why I was surprisedā€¦I thought that at short distances they would be sorta comparable, even with tiny shot. Would a slug from a .410 have the same power as the .45? Or is there less powder or ??? I know the differences between shotguns, I just messed up typing. Iā€™ve owned a 12 gauge double and a 20 gauge single, and have shot a .410 many times while hunting rabbit on the Western Slope of Colorado. I once shot a 10 gauge, and almost shot a 4 gauge (it was offered, but I declined - I got the feeling that the ammo was precious, and I didnā€™t really care to have my shoulder blown off)! I hunt regularly, but I donā€™t really delve too deeply in all of the factors involving guns and bulletsā€¦Iā€™m lazy, my FIL just hands me his $3500 Merkel and says ā€œFront trigger for deer and boar, back trigger for fox and rabbitā€ and I go a-huntinā€™. (OK, Iā€™m not that bad, but I really donā€™t get into guns as much as I get into cooking the results from hunting). Iā€™d like to get a concealed carry that would double as the home protection gun, so I am thinking of a .38 SPL revolver, or a Glock 27 (.40). Or that neat pistol 12 gauge that **Airman Doors** told us about in another thread. šŸ˜ƒ -Tcat ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 10:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/23 "2006-03-29T10:44:53Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > Thanks. I was confused because some reports ([example](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/11340558/)) said ā€œ\*\*.\*\*28 gaugeā€ - I take it that dot shouldnā€™t be there. Thatā€™s right. ā€œ_n_ gaugeā€ means that if you made a round lead ball to fit the bore, you would get _n_ balls to the pound - so a 28-gauge would pass a .57oz ball, but a 12-gauge a 1.33oz, a 16-gauge exactly 1oz, etc. But a .410 does have a bore that is .410" wide. More or less. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/24 "2006-03-29T15:09:03Z")
> [@Tomcat](#): > > What are the power differences between .45s and .410s? Here is some information on the .410 Cartridge .410 birdshot Actual Caliber 0.41 Muzzle Velocity 1225 Muzzle Energy in footpounds 707 Cartridge .410 rifled slug Actual Caliber 0.41 Bullet Weight in Grains 300 Muzzle Velocity 1830 Muzzle Energy in footpounds 631 These figures would be based on firing the cartridges from a full length barrel, not from one of those goofy .410 pistols. A buddy of mine has one and it doesnā€™t exceed slingshot velocities by much. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/25 "2006-03-29T16:25:34Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Hereā€™s something I picked up by talking with several friends who are convicted criminals and did some time: Most crooks know exactly dick about guns. They wouldnā€™t recognize the sound of a shotgun being pumped as something they should fear. > > In the case of the guy in the OP, since getting shot didnā€™t do much to scare him off, Iā€™m guessing the sound of a shotgun being racked would have had pretty unimpressive results. > ā€¦and for the umpteenth time, I wish this turd of disinformation would quit getting passed off as truth and good advice. Trying to scare off an invader with the sound of a shotgun slide is not just bad tactics. Itā€™s stupid. Perhapsā€¦but I would disagree with the assumption that racking a shotgun wouldnā€™t scare someone. That sound has been on countless TV shows, movies, even cartoons. That sounds means ā€œYouā€™re about to have a loaded gun pointed at you.ā€ ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/26 "2006-03-29T16:49:25Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > Perhapsā€¦but I would disagree with the assumption that racking a shotgun wouldnā€™t scare someone. That sound has been on countless TV shows, movies, even cartoons. That sounds means ā€œYouā€™re about to have a loaded gun pointed at you.ā€ Have you ever heard one for real? Foley artists use whatever sound they think is most dramatically effective, not necessarily the one that is most realistic. They seem to use the same clickety-clack noise for every gun, whether it is being cocked, loaded, or even just brought up to the firing position. IAC, it remains a tactically unsound move for several reasons. 1. It means that you are holding a weapon that is chamber empty in a situation where the time spent racking the slide may cost you your life. Orā€¦ 2. It means that you are ejecting a perfectly good shell from a weapon that is notably slow to reload. 3. It is easy to ā€œshort strokeā€ the slide under stress. This may result in no shell being fed into the chamber (i.e. youā€™ll get a click instead of a bang should you need to fire) or a misfed shell resulting in a jam that isnā€™t going to be easy to clear. 4. If you have the advantage of surprise to start with, you just lost it by making loud click-clack noises. If you must let your opponent know where you are and that you are armed, itā€™s a far better idea to simply yell ā€œI know youā€™re here and I have a gun!ā€ if the situation is serious enough for guns to be brought into play, it is serious enough for someone to be shot. Using a gun to try to ā€œjust scare himā€ puts you onto some very thin ice tactically and legally. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [March 29, 2006, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/27 "2006-03-29T17:03:29Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Have you ever heard one for real? Foley artists use whatever sound they think is most dramatically effective, not necessarily the one that is most realistic. They seem to use the same clickety-clack noise for every gun, whether it is being cocked, loaded, or even just brought up to the firing position. > > IAC, it remains a tactically unsound move for several reasons. > > 1. It means that you are holding a weapon that is chamber empty in a situation where the time spent racking the slide may cost you your life. Orā€¦ > 2. It means that you are ejecting a perfectly good shell from a weapon that is notably slow to reload. > 3. It is easy to ā€œshort strokeā€ the slide under stress. This may result in no shell being fed into the chamber (i.e. youā€™ll get a click instead of a bang should you need to fire) or a misfed shell resulting in a jam that isnā€™t going to be easy to clear. > 4. If you have the advantage of surprise to start with, you just lost it by making loud click-clack noises. > > If you must let your opponent know where you are and that you are armed, itā€™s a far better idea to simply yell ā€œI know youā€™re here and I have a gun!ā€ if the situation is serious enough for guns to be brought into play, it is serious enough for someone to be shot. Using a gun to try to ā€œjust scare himā€ puts you onto some very thin ice tactically and legally. They do use the same generic racking/cocking sound effect for many guns in TV/movies, and that should have educated the bad guys what it means. Iā€™m not going to have a ready-to-fire weapon sitting around, so points #1 and #2 are moot for me, it will get racked. I will concede your point 3. Point #4 goes back to having a ready-to-fire weapon, which I donā€™t feel comfortable with. So yeah, the bad guy is probably going to hear it, and hopefully take the clue to get the hell out. I think you have every legal right to ā€œjust scare someoneā€ when theyā€™re an intruder in your home. Your yelling idea is probably good though, as long as you can sound like you mean it. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/28 "2006-03-31T03:24:01Z")
> [@Tomcat](#): > > Iā€™d like to get a concealed carry that would double as the home protection gun, so I am thinking of a .38 SPL revolver, or a Glock 27 (.40). Or that neat pistol 12 gauge that **Airman Doors** told us about in another thread. šŸ˜ƒ Oh, you mean [this](http://www.serbu.com/shorty.htm)? Also, you will be hard-pressed to find a better all-around defense weapon than a GLOCK 27. I would know, I have one. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/29 "2006-03-31T03:35:52Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > Oh, you mean [this](http://www.serbu.com/shorty.htm)? > > Also, you will be hard-pressed to find a better all-around defense weapon than a GLOCK 27. I would know, I have one. Just out of curiosity there me olā€™ zoomie, how many times have you used that Glock such that you arrived at your above stated conclusion? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/30 "2006-03-31T03:46:31Z")
OK, let me qualify that, because I didnā€™t think that having used it for its stated purpose was a requirement to have an opinion. :rolleyes: The weapon is very compact, very concealable, very controllable, and fires a powerful round accurately in the range that your average gunfight would happen. As it is not much bigger than your hand it is not as awkward in close quarters as a shotgun and can be concealed quite easily with most any kind of clothing. Add hollowpoints to the mix and you have quite a little handcannon siutable for home defense and concealed carry. So, how many times have you used your weapon, **Scumpup**? I assume you have a few times given the extraordinary condescension you used in your last post. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/31 "2006-03-31T03:55:10Z")
> [@Airman Doors](#): > > OK, let me qualify that, because I didnā€™t think that having used it for its stated purpose was a requirement to have an opinion. :rolleyes: > > The weapon is very compact, very concealable, very controllable, and fires a powerful round accurately in the range that your average gunfight would happen. As it is not much bigger than your hand it is not as awkward in close quarters as a shotgun and can be concealed quite easily with most any kind of clothing. Add hollowpoints to the mix and you have quite a little handcannon siutable for home defense and concealed carry. > > So, how many times have you used your weapon, **Scumpup**? I assume you have a few times given the extraordinary condescension you used in your last post. Me? I never shot anybody; though I have drawn a weapon a few times. See, thatā€™s why I refrain from expounding on the virtues of any particular caliber or model. The Ruger Mk I was as effective as the S&W 4566 as the Makarov as the Beretta 21. Your average mook doesnā€™t want to be shot with anything. In the real world, one gun is largely as effective as another because of that. I donā€™t believe in brandishing guns with the intent to just scare someone, but personal experience indicates shitbags are afraid when you point guns at them. So you like that Glock because of how it handles for you. why not just say that? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 31, 2006, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224/32 "2006-03-31T03:59:47Z")
I did. It was obviously an opinion, ironically enough in a forum called ā€œIn My Humble Opinionā€. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-a-larger-home-protection-gun/350224.md?page=1)