# evidence for god? some one said so. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 21, 2013, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896 "2013-01-21T08:55:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 18
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/341 "2013-02-08T14:32:23Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Nonresponsive religious glurge. Disappointing, but expected. How was that non- responsive? You may not agree with it or even ‘like’ the response, but **lekatt** did answer your question as to how he experienced it. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/342 "2013-02-08T14:36:39Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I stood in the presence of the Creator and felt the unconditional love emanating from Him. It is not so unusual, millions have done so. His love awakened the love He placed within me and I was never the same again. We all have the Creator’s unconditional love within us. Some connect with it naturally while others find it only in moments of great distress. Like a soldier that falls on a grenade to save others. Like the thousands that came to the aid of Twin Towers just because they wanted too, Like teachers in the recent mass shootings protecting the children with their own bodies. It is within everyone, finding it or connecting with it changes your life forever. Ok, but lots of insane people say similar things. How do we know that you happen to be one of the “few” (or, more likely, none) that saw the light, as opposed to the many with malfunctioning brains? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/343 "2013-02-08T15:01:22Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I stood in the presence of the Creator and felt the unconditional love emanating from Him. It is not so unusual, millions have done so. His love awakened the love He placed within me and I was never the same again. We all have the Creator’s unconditional love within us. Some connect with it naturally while others find it only in moments of great distress. Like a soldier that falls on a grenade to save others. Like the thousands that came to the aid of Twin Towers just because they wanted too, Like teachers in the recent mass shootings protecting the children with their own bodies. It is within everyone, finding it or connecting with it changes your life forever. Is it possible to come to hold your beliefs without experiencing this, or does the experience always precede the belief? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/344 "2013-02-08T15:08:26Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Is it possible to come to hold your beliefs without experiencing this, or does the experience always precede the belief? Yes, of course, there are other ways. Meditation, doing affirmations, just relaxing into it. It is the process of lowering your attachment to the physical so the love can be discovered. I can suggest a book or two, ones that I didn’t write. But not here. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/345 "2013-02-08T15:16:17Z")
> [@simster](#): > > How was that non- responsive? You may not agree with it or even ‘like’ the response, but **lekatt** did answer your question as to how he experienced it. “I stood in the presence of the Creator” is not an explanation of anything-it’s a religious buzzphrase that when questioned for elaboration brings about even more vagueness and/or cries of harrassment. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/346 "2013-02-08T15:22:59Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > “I stood in the presence of the Creator” is not an explanation of anything-it’s a religious buzzphrase that when questioned for elaboration brings about even more vagueness and/or cries of harrassment. You asked - “what kind of experience” - you did not ask for an explanation of the experience. ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/347 "2013-02-08T15:23:07Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > Or Superman or Jean Grey. If they had comic books in biblical times things would be a lot different, surely Lazarus would be treated with the same contempt by fanboys as Aquaman. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/348 "2013-02-08T15:24:53Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Yes, of course, there are other ways. Meditation, doing affirmations, just relaxing into it. It is the process of lowering your attachment to the physical so the love can be discovered. I can suggest a book or two, ones that I didn’t write. But not here. Sure, why not: which books? Also, how do you know you’re on the right path? Does it just feel right, or are there more concrete indicators? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/349 "2013-02-08T15:26:51Z")
> [@simster](#): > > You asked - “what kind of experience” - you did not ask for an explanation of the experience. If I ask for further information, is it too much to expect actual content in that information? What he gave had no content and no meaning to anyone outside of himself. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/350 "2013-02-08T15:32:16Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > If I ask for further information, is it too much to expect actual content in that information? What he gave had no content and no meaning to anyone outside of himself. we’re hijacking at this point - but you did not ask for any of that - you asked for his experience - and then you called his answer bullshit - I am calling you on that only - you could have been clearer in your question or even posted a followup question asking for an explanation or any other detail - but as it stands, you asked for his ‘experience’ and got the answer you asked for. My part in this hijack is over. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/351 "2013-02-08T15:39:06Z")
> [@simster](#): > > we’re hijacking at this point - but you did not ask for any of that - you asked for his experience - and then you called his answer bullshit - I am calling you on that only - you could have been clearer in your question or even posted a followup question asking for an explanation or any other detail - but as it stands, you asked for his ‘experience’ and got the answer you asked for. > > My part in this hijack is over. Maybe you’re right, and I’ve let years of encounters with **lekatt** cloud my judgement. **lekatt** , when you say “I stood in the presence of the Creator”, what exactly do you mean, what specific knowledge was imparted to you, and how was it imparted? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/352 "2013-02-08T16:01:20Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Sure, why not: which books? > > Also, how do you know you’re on the right path? Does it just feel right, or are there more concrete indicators? The indicators are solid, I spent over three years testing and re-testing the concepts and events I experienced, there is no doubt in my mind. I would expect no less from you or anyone. There are no secrets only undiscovered wonders. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/353 "2013-02-08T16:05:52Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The indicators are solid, I spent over three years testing and re-testing the concepts and events I experienced, there is no doubt in my mind. I would expect no less from you or anyone. There are no secrets only undiscovered wonders. How do you test the concepts? Which books? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/354 "2013-02-08T16:08:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Maybe you’re right, and I’ve let years of encounters with **lekatt** cloud my judgement. > > **lekatt** , when you say “I stood in the presence of the Creator”, what exactly do you mean, what specific knowledge was imparted to you, and how was it imparted? I was surrounded by a brilliant light, the light was love and compassion, it was also knowledge of all things. It entered my being and imparted its love and knowledge as energy merges with energy. I knew I was in the presence of God but did not see Him. When the experience was over much of the knowledge could not be remembered, but the love was forever. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/355 "2013-02-08T16:15:33Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I was surrounded by a brilliant light, the light was love and compassion, it was also knowledge of all things. It entered my being and imparted its love and knowledge as energy merges with energy. I knew I was in the presence of God but did not see Him. When the experience was over much of the knowledge could not be remembered, but the love was forever. So God tried to give you some info, but he failed to make it stick. But you claimed earlier that some sort of information was given to you that you now held. What information _did_ you retain, and how was that specific imformation given to you? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/356 "2013-02-08T16:21:05Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > How do you test the concepts? > > Which books? By comparing them with the history of my life and then projecting them into the future. Example: When I was young I wanted to join the printers union but was told there were over 150 on the waiting list. I wanted to join very bad and held the thoughts in my mind daily. Two months later I received a call from a shop owner to come and try out for him. I was hired into the union a month later without serving an apprenticeship. I then begin to hold thoughts of what I wanted to accomplish in the future and they came true. The law of attraction. There were others, too many to post here. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/357 "2013-02-08T16:26:23Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > By comparing them with the history of my life and then projecting them into the future. Example: When I was young I wanted to join the printers union but was told there were over 150 on the waiting list. I wanted to join very bad and held the thoughts in my mind daily. Two months later I received a call from a shop owner to come and try out for him. I was hired into the union a month later without serving an apprenticeship. I then begin to hold thoughts of what I wanted to accomplish in the future and they came true. The law of attraction. There were others, too many to post here. Ok, thanks for answering my questions. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/358 "2013-02-08T16:32:07Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Ok, thanks for answering my **questions.** (bolding mine)Question. He didn’t answer the “Which books” question. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/359 "2013-02-08T16:41:35Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > (bolding mine)Question. He didn’t answer the “Which books” question. He did, he PM’ed me. ---
**Author:** ![Razncain](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9d8465/32.png) [@Razncain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Razncain)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2013, 4:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/360 "2013-02-08T16:45:26Z")
80% of those that put on the [God Helmet](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y02UlkYjSi0) whether believer or not, will experience such hallucinations and delusions that are simply in your head. But I know lekatt, yours was really special and prefer not to call it that. Okay. Shermer’s [out of body experiment](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nCVzz96zKA0) with the God Helmet. For those that experience more than just a light, and have the OBE, there are researchers that have made simple tests to see if such people that experience these out of body experiences quite frequently really are having an in or out of body experience. It can be as simple as placing a number on a top shelf for one to read. If this was really happening, surely they would be able to read off the number. Under the proper protocol, why doesn’t anybody ever get it right, lekatt? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896.md?page=17) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896.md?page=19)