# evidence for god? some one said so. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 21, 2013, 8:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896 "2013-01-21T08:55:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 22
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2013, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/421 "2013-02-10T15:36:48Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The experience I had came unannounced without any expectations. It is an experience shared by 10 to 12 million Americans who also had no expectations. You vastly underestimate the number of people that have had experiences similar to yours. In fact, the number of people that have had dreams ranks in the _billions_. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/422 "2013-02-11T13:25:24Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The experience I had came unannounced without any expectations. It is an experience shared by 10 to 12 million Americans who also had no expectations. Then dozens of scientists began to study and research the experiences finding them to be authentic examples of consciousness living after the death of the brain and body. Yes, there is solid proof of this, so much proof that scientists no longer berate the experience on the Internet. Anyone that wants to find the truth of the experience can do so by reading the research. I realize there will be those who will never believe the research and I am OK with that. > > The individuals who have the experience include neuro scientists, as well as people from every race and religion, no religion and atheists. There is no danger involved in reading the research and no danger in the afterlife. There is nothing to lose and everything to gain. But it is a matter of choice. I cannot imagine a real scientist that is afraid of new ideas and research. If they were indeed brain dead, then they would have no memory of what happened, and most of the science liturature I read (in the past) doesn’t say there is proof of an after life. I myself experienced a time where I had to be ressusitated, I had no memory of it happening, it was after I came to, the doctors said I should check with a heart doctor because of the need to be resussitated! ---
**Author:** ![Shiloh2013](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e79b87/32.png) [@Shiloh2013](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shiloh2013)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 1:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/423 "2013-02-11T13:35:36Z")
I’m sure this has been better articulated, but I think if you could comprehend god with rationality, then the god you would be comprehending would not really be god, because god is that which cannot be comprehended with rationality. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 1:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/424 "2013-02-11T13:47:06Z")
> [@Shiloh2013](#): > > I’m sure this has been better articulated, but I think if you could comprehend god with rationality, then the god you would be comprehending would not really be god, because god is that which cannot be comprehended with rationality. The idea of god is irrational? I agree. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/425 "2013-02-11T15:27:22Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > The individuals who have the experience include neuro scientists, as well as people from every race and religion, no religion and atheists. There is no danger involved in reading the research and no danger in the afterlife. There is nothing to lose and everything to gain. But it is a matter of choice. I cannot imagine a real scientist that is afraid of new ideas and research. The ideas you espouse have no scientific basis. You make appeals to science without showing any understanding of the meaning of the word or the process. You treat science as your personal wishing well. You want science to justify your misguided beliefs and that is not how proper science works. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/426 "2013-02-11T18:38:21Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > The ideas you espouse have no scientific basis. You make appeals to science without showing any understanding of the meaning of the word or the process. You treat science as your personal wishing well. You want science to justify your misguided beliefs and that is not how proper science works. If science seeks truth then I am for science. If it only seeks to prove its own theories then I am not for science. We do not need another belief system we need the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/427 "2013-02-11T18:42:04Z")
> [@monavis](#): > > If they were indeed brain dead, then they would have no memory of what happened, and most of the science liturature I read (in the past) doesn’t say there is proof of an after life. > > I myself experienced a time where I had to be ressusitated, I had no memory of it happening, it was after I came to, the doctors said I should check with a heart doctor because of the need to be resussitated! Just because science said it does not make it truth. Pam Reynolds was brain dead for over thirty minutes and remember everything. Because the brain is not the storage place of memory of anything else. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/428 "2013-02-11T18:47:05Z")
> [@Shiloh2013](#): > > I’m sure this has been better articulated, but I think if you could comprehend god with rationality, then the god you would be comprehending would not really be god, because god is that which cannot be comprehended with rationality. How is one to know that God is not rational without knowing God. If you wish to learn the truth about the universe assumptions must be prohibited. Actually the spirit world is logical and rational more so than science. Please don’t make assumptions on anything. You either know through experience or not. Experience is the only teacher. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/429 "2013-02-11T18:49:58Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If science seeks truth then I am for science. If it only seeks to prove its own theories then I am not for science. You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. – Inigo Montoya ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/430 "2013-02-11T18:50:50Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Just because science said it does not make it truth. Pam Reynolds was brain dead for over thirty minutes and remember everything. Because the brain is not the storage place of memory of anything else. Pam Reynolds did not remember everything. [Summary of her case.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pam_Reynolds_case) Everything of a factual nature that she remembered occurred while she wasn’t brain dead. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/431 "2013-02-11T19:08:39Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If science seeks truth then I am for science. If it only seeks to prove its own theories then I am not for science. We do not need another belief system we need the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Again, in your own words, you demonstrate that you have no understanding of science or the scientific process. Nobody with an understanding of [science](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/science) would mistake it for anything resembling a belief system. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/432 "2013-02-11T19:15:30Z")
Do a search on “science” and “lekatt”, and be amazed. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/433 "2013-02-11T20:50:59Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. > > – Inigo Montoya Are you saying science does not seek truth? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/434 "2013-02-11T20:53:46Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Are you saying science does not seek truth? I am saying that you would not recognize science or truth if it bit you on the ass, and your previous posts on the subjects more than point that out. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/435 "2013-02-11T21:00:54Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Again, in your own words, you demonstrate that you have no understanding of science or the scientific process. > > Nobody with an understanding of [science](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/science) would mistake it for anything resembling a belief system. I guess I will never know what science is about. Over 80% of the world’s population believe in an afterlife yet science can find not one single bit of evidence. That is not true anymore because many scientists now do believe in an afterlife because of the evidence they have found. There is ongoing research at Duke, Colorado, Berkley, and many other universities. As well as those overseas. Why are some people so frightened of the truth, I have explained there is nothing to fear. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/436 "2013-02-11T21:05:16Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > I am saying that you would not recognize science or truth if it bit you on the ass, and your previous posts on the subjects more than point that out. Only to you my friend. Me thinks you doth protest too much, why fear when you can find peace. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/437 "2013-02-11T21:13:43Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Only to you my friend. > > Me thinks you doth protest too much, why fear when you can find peace. Methinks you forgot my promise to tell people that you didn’t have an NDE, because your supposed “near death” was undiagnosed by any doctor and happened at home, where you went to bed, had a bizarre waking dream, then went back to sleep. This puts grave doubt on your ability to pass judgemnent on any other claims about "NDE"s. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2013, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/438 "2013-02-11T21:23:47Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I guess I will never know what science is about. Over 80% of the world’s population believe in an afterlife yet science can find not one single bit of evidence. > > That is not true anymore because many scientists now do believe in an afterlife because of the evidence they have found. There is ongoing research at Duke, Colorado, Berkley, and many other universities. As well as those overseas. Why are some people so frightened of the truth, I have explained there is nothing to fear. If, at the end of the day, scientific research comes back with legitimate reliable evidence of an afterlife, I will stand corrected and admit I was wrong. If it comes back and says that afterlife is bunk, what will you do, **lekatt**? And stop using the idea of fear in this context. We both know that you piss your pants in fear of the latter being much more likely than the former. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/439 "2013-02-12T00:31:34Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > . . . the brain is not the storage place of memory of anything else. Then why do brain lesions, injuries from gunshots, alcohol abuse, concussions, and strokes often lead to memory loss? If memory was “backed up” in some invulnerable “soul” thingy, then memory would never be lost. Memory is lost (alas, I can confirm that myself) and thus the connection to the “soul” is a failed explanation. In science, when an idea is shown to be wrong, it is discarded. In theology, when an idea is shown to be wrong, special pleading is resorted to. Which is more logical? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 12:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896/440 "2013-02-12T00:39:36Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > If, at the end of the day, scientific research comes back with legitimate reliable evidence of an afterlife, I will stand corrected and admit I was wrong. > > If it comes back and says that afterlife is bunk, what will you do, **lekatt**? > > And stop using the idea of fear in this context. We both know that you piss your pants in fear of the latter being much more likely than the former. The evidence has been around now for at least 20 years, reliable and legitimate evidence. I have been there multiple times, first through my experience then through meditation and now it is a most every day event. As for fear. It is only fear that keeps one from reading the evidence from both sides with the same vigor. Fear that something found may prove them wrong. I gave you the researchers name and they have published in scientific journals their work. One of them testified before the United Nations. It is real you don’t see other scientists opposing it anymore, it is just a matter of time before it is common knowledge in scientific circles. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896.md?page=21) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evidence-for-god-some-one-said-so/647896.md?page=23)