# Evil bastards...oops, little darlings arrested for starting fire in Albuquerque
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [June 28, 2003, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892 "2003-06-28T00:45:27Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@SweetLucy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SweetLucy)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/1 "2003-06-28T00:45:27Z")
I sure hope these spawn of Satan get tried as adults and put into a cell full of big sweaty guys named “Bubba.”
[http://www.abqtrib.com/archives/news03/062703\_news\_homsusp.shtml](http://www.abqtrib.com/archives/news03/062703_news_homsusp.shtml)
3 teens arrested in 1st bosque fire
Police: Fireworks were used in arson
By Meredith Wade
Tribune Reporter
Police arrested three Albuquerque youths early this morning and charged them with arson in connection with the first fire to torch the Rio Grande bosque this week.
Police arrested Ricky Navarette, 16; Fernando Anaya, 13; and Steven Sedillo, 13, and booked them into the Bernalillo County Juvenile Detention Center, Albuquerque Police Chief Gilbert Gallegos said.
No arrests have been made in the second bosque fire.
The three youths are charged with arson, criminal damage to property worth more than $1,000 and conspiracy to commit arson in the first fire, Albuquerque police spokeswoman Sgt. Beth Paiz said. Arson is a felony.
The fire started Tuesday and burned 350 acres, according to the latest estimates.
Gallegos said the youths are not suspects in the second bosque fire, which started Wednesday night and burned about 175 acres, according to new estimates.
Officials, including Mayor Martin Chavez and Gov. Bill Richardson, have said the second fire was almost certainly set deliberately.
However, police spokesman Lt. Jeff Arbogast this morning said the possibility that the second fire was a continuation of the first had not been ruled out.
Police got search warrants for the boys’ homes based on tips called to Crimestoppers and information from “interested people” Gallegos said. He declined to comment on whether the boys’ families had turned them in.
“They obviously were not protected by their families, because we have them in custody,” he said.
Gallegos said the investigation showed the fire Tuesday was caused by fireworks and set intentionally, but its scope was not intentional.
“I’m not sure if they’ll be tried as adults. That’s at the discretion of the court,” he said.
The fire set Tuesday still smoldered this morning, and officials estimated it was 90 percent contained. Original estimates of 700 acres burned were revised to 350 acres Thursday. One house under construction in the Oxbow subdivision was destroyed.
The second fire was smoldering and 70 percent contained. Latest estimates set the damage at about 175 acres. There were only minor injuries and property damage related to that fire, but, Gallegos said, it is still dangerous.
“As is evident, flare-ups can come at any time,” he said.
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### Author:  [@Mr.Blue\_Sky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Blue_Sky)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/2 "2003-06-28T00:50:53Z")
Some jail time and several thousand hours of community service.
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### Author:  [@Blonde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blonde)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/3 "2003-06-28T00:53:07Z")
Just a teenage prank, right? Holy shit. I’ve been watching the story, and thank you for posting the information, **SweetLucy**. What a horrible example of the idiocy of youth - I, for one, hope they’re tried as adults.
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### Author:  [@JillGat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JillGat)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/4 "2003-06-28T01:04:48Z")
The day before this fire started, a friend emailed me saying she would be in my hometown of Albuquerque soon and asking where a nice place would be for her to go for a walk. My immediate recommendation was the bike trail through the bosque, north from Central Ave.
Rather than just letting those little assholes rot in jail, I think they ought to put them to work raking up burned forest and planting baby cottonwood trees.
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### Author:  [@InternetLegend](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/InternetLegend)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 4:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/5 "2003-06-28T04:55:50Z")
You know, especially given their ages, I don’t really want them to be punished horribly, beyond whatever it takes to teach them just what the hell the consequences of their actions are. I don’t want them killed or locked up for the rest of their lives or (certainly) sexually assaulted by anyone. I just want to smack them. And I want everyone else in this town who feels the same way to be able to smack them too. Maybe twice each. For the record, my own 13-year-old doesn’t feel their youth is any excuse at all.
In the meantime, fireworks sales have been way, way up in the past few days because _people wanted to stock up before they were banned_. It’s nice to see that the people of my city don’t lose their heads and forget their priorities in the midst of disaster.
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### Author:  [@SnoopyFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnoopyFan)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 5:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/6 "2003-06-28T05:57:01Z")
Am I the only one wondering wtf a bosque is?
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### Author:  [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 7:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/7 "2003-06-28T07:24:39Z")
_sigh_
These kids are a good argument for abortion.
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### Author:  [@11811](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/11811)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/8 "2003-06-28T10:30:15Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by SnoopyFan \*
> \*\*Am I the only one wondering wtf a bosque is? \*\*
Spanish for forest
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### Author:  [@SnoopyFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SnoopyFan)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2003, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/9 "2003-06-28T22:28:42Z")
Gracias 🙂
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### Author:  [@JerseyDiamond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyDiamond)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/10 "2003-06-29T03:42:58Z")
How is it arson? Doesn’t arson mean there was intent to start a fire? They tried to put it out. They should be charged with illegal use of fireworks, stupidity, whatever, but it isn’t arson.
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### Author:  [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/11 "2003-06-29T03:50:16Z")
Whenever I feel outraged by something like this, I just remind myself of some of the things my friends and I did when we were that age. Anything involving fire was particularly attractive. It’s just dumb luck that we never managed to burn down the village.
Trying them as adults would be wildly inappropriate. We treat juveniles differently _for a reason_. Kids do dopey things. They need to learn _not_ to do dopey things. They don’t necessarily do dopey things because they’re evil - usually, they do dopey things because they’re still kids. Letting them rot in jail probably isn’t the best way to go about it.
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### Author:  [@Blonde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Blonde)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/12 "2003-06-29T04:00:03Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by JerseyDiamond \*
> \*\*How is it arson? Doesn’t arson mean there was intent to start a fire? They tried to put it out. They should be charged with illegal use of fireworks, stupidity, whatever, but it isn’t arson. \*\*
Consider the damage done, though! Stupidity and immaturity does not constitute a defense. And I wouldn’t wish a life sentence on the kids. But, damn…350 acres?
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### Author:  [@JerseyDiamond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JerseyDiamond)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/13 "2003-06-29T05:07:42Z")
350 acres isn’t really all that much for a fire. Look at the fire in Arizona that is already in the thousands of acres.
This one is only big news because it was near a bunch of rich people’s homes.
And the amount of damage done doesn’t change what happened. It was an accidental fire, caused by stupidity. It isn’t arson.
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### Author:  [@Spooky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spooky)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/14 "2003-06-29T06:27:46Z")
I would hate to see teenaged boys rot in prison for what is likely a very stupid, thoughtless accident on their part.
I disagree that this was “only big news because it was near a bunch of rich people’s homes.” The Rio Grande bosque is a treasure to all New Mexicans, a beautiful, shady refuge for all of us to share. People from all over town walk and bike along the lovely trails. I used to rent an apartment near Rio Grande Blvd. and Griegos, and the acequia trails were so special to me. Just a couple of weeks ago I took a drive down to ABQ and walked along trails, enjoying the fluffy “cotton” drifting from the alamos (cottonwoods). It breaks my heart to know that many of those stately, hundred year old trees are gone, as well as the important wildlife who also made the bosque their home.
The bosque is a fragile, vital part of our high desert ecosystem. We all need to protect it. I will be there to help plant new trees.
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### Author:  [@Early\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Early_Out)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/15 "2003-06-29T13:00:34Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by Blonde \*
> **Stupidity and immaturity does not constitute a defense.**
True, but immaturity does place you in the juvenile justice system, which is there for a very good reason. You simply can’t apply adult standards of responsibility to kids. They’re treated differently _because they’re different._
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### Author:  [@Kalimero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalimero)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/16 "2003-06-29T14:16:50Z")
Yeah, treat them as adults. They’ll get to know some _real_ felons while in jail. Imagine what a thirteen year old can learn from thieves and rapists. Great idea! :rolleyes:
> [@](#):
>
> Rather than just letting those little assholes rot in jail, I think they ought to put them to work raking up burned forest and planting baby cottonwood trees.
Now that sounds reasonable. Let them feel the consequences of their stupidity. But don’t jail them, for god’s sake!
BTW:
When I was about 11 years old, a friend of mine and me set two car tires on fire. In a dry swimming pool right next to my friend’s house. I shudder when thinking about what might have have happened. Still, I don’t think going to jail because of this would have made me a better person.
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### Author:  [@Kalimero](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalimero)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 2:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/17 "2003-06-29T14:33:44Z")
[Hijack]
Could anyone explain under which circumstances the courts are allowed to charge juveniles as adults?
I’ve only read about this practice in cases of juveniles committing murder or similar heinous crimes. I’m from Europe, so I’m not familiar with US penal codes.
Is this legally possible for every crime?
[Hijack]
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### Author:  [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/18 "2003-06-29T15:05:12Z")
Thirteen year olds don’t get incarcerated in with the adult prison. They’re put into the juvenile detention after they’re convicted and after they reach a certain age THEN they get moved into the adult prison.
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### Author:  [@Klaatu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Klaatu)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 7:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/19 "2003-06-29T19:46:13Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by JerseyDiamond \*
> \*\*350 acres isn’t really all that much for a fire. Look at the fire in Arizona that is already in the thousands of acres.
>
> This one is only big news because it was near a bunch of rich people’s homes.
>
> And the amount of damage done doesn’t change what happened. It was an accidental fire, caused by stupidity. It isn’t arson. \*\*
Maybe you live here in ABQ, but from your first two statements I doubt it. Any bosque fire is big news because the bosque (wooded land along the riverbank) runs through the middle of the fucking city.
It wasn’t just “a bunch of rich people’s homes” that were threatened. The fire literally moved _miles_ upstream in a few hours. The first fire jumped across the river, and if it had gotten into any of the neighborhoods, it may well have been catastrophic.
Not to mention the firefighters, who had to deal with the high winds while trying to cover both sides of the river.
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### Author:  [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2003, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evil-bastards-oops-little-darlings-arrested-for-starting-fire-in-albuquerque/184892/20 "2003-06-29T21:37:22Z")
I forgot to mention that illegal use of fireworks isn’t an accident either. It’s a crime.
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