# Evolutionary explanation for healthy foods being disgusting? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 1, 2012, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362 "2012-09-01T14:47:24Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 15\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2012, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/21 "2012-09-01T23:22:17Z")
> [@tomcar](#): > > All that yummy unhealthy food you are talking about is the cooked down essence of regular old unhealthy food. Broccoli & Rice is to Donuts, as Cocaine is to crack. > People take a whole grain and strip it of all its nutrients and produce a substance that instantly effects your blood sugar so you feel euphoric (or at least I do after a donut.) You blood sugar doesn’t increase when you smell those donuts, so I doubt that’s why we eat them. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/22 "2012-09-02T00:52:36Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Broccoli didn’t exist prior to about 2,500 years ago. What makes it taste good? Sauteed lightly in olive oil, with some salt and pepper. Raw, it’s someone palatable, but not so much. Break it into small florets, blanche in boiling water for 1 minute, chill and serve as a salad with ginger-soy dressing. Very good. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/23 "2012-09-02T01:07:43Z")
> [@WhyNot](#): > > I was, likewise, raised by a woman who viewed Adelle Davis as a Deity. NO white or brown sugar AT ALL (partly because of good ol’ Adelle, but also because Mom wanted to win a bet), only molasses or honey. I was breastfed exclusively for 12 months, and of course she made all baby food after that.She ground her own peanut butter, made her own yogurt, and I didn’t know granola also comes in a box until I was a teenager. We canned all our own tomatoes and peaches, froze blueberries we harvested ourselves, and I was without a doubt the only kid on the block who made handcranked pasta and egg noodles before I could skip. My mother ground her own wheat in a small mill my dad made her, for chrissakes. > > Somewhere around 4th grade, I learned I could trade my homeground peanut butter and honey on homebaked whole grain bread for Skippy and grape jelly on white AND a Twinkie. If I acted just a little bit reluctant, sometimes I could get 'em to throw a Capri-Sun into the deal. > > I f’in love MacDonalds. Sorry, Mom. You tried. > > (But I \*would \*torch a small village for one of those peanut butter and honey sandwiches on Mom’s bread today. Sadly, she stopped baking when she started working full time.) Yeah, I had a relative like that. Her children got no sweets, they had only raw sugar and tiny spoons for coffee, etc. When her kids were old enough, about 10, they would cycle down to the grocery store with their friend and blow their allowance on the cheapest sugar-water pop they could find, 2L at a time. Very much like another fellow, whose kids could only watch healthy, Christian approved TV. When they went to visit their friends, they could watch South Park, the SImpsons, R-rated movies, and such. At a certain point, children will find out about the real world. Recall an interview with a day care worker and some kids from the original Rcohdale college in Toronto 40 years later. The one fellow said “you introduced me to sugar”. The worker brought in some pumpkin muffins with thick icing on them, and the child who had never had sugar products loved them so much, his parents were mystified when he kept demanding pumpkin muffins, they made him their finest healthy pumpkin muffins and he hated them. What mystifies me is why starch, which is essentially like sugar, is so bland. How come we don’t gulp down starch like we would sugar? Yes, it can be good but raw flour is pretty bland. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/24 "2012-09-02T01:21:57Z")
> [@Standarduser](#): > > Yet - why do alot of healthy foods like brocoli and many other vegetables are not tasty, wile greasey, unnutritious foods are addicting and yummy? Why would evolution make our taste buds turn against us? > > Why would evolution want us to crave bad food? Like others have said, “healthy” food for our paleolitihic ancestors was the highest calorie density stuff they could get. In a sense, we have evolved to prefer “healthy” foods, but what happened is that in the last little bit (500 years or so) of history, we’ve come into such abundance that what was formerly a good thing is now just the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/25 "2012-09-02T01:32:34Z")
It’s not just the abundance, but the highly processed nature of the food we eat. It’s almost pre-digested. Even 500 years ago, if you were eating bread, you were eating whole grain bread-- not bread made from highly milled flour with all the fiber removed. ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/26 "2012-09-02T01:39:53Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > What mystifies me is why starch, which is essentially like sugar, is so bland. How come we don’t gulp down starch like we would sugar? Yes, it can be good but raw flour is pretty bland. It’s because starch and sugar are different molecules, even if one is based on the other, just as ethylene and polyethylene are very different substances, more so for cellulose, which is also polymerized glucose but is also indigestible. Actually, starch isn’t very digestible either [unless it is cooked](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Starch#Food). ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/27 "2012-09-02T01:55:38Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > It’s not just the abundance, but the highly processed nature of the food we eat. It’s almost pre-digested. Even 500 years ago, if you were eating bread, you were eating whole grain bread-- not bread made from highly milled flour with all the fiber removed. It’s not just that; ever look at how many ingredients go into a simple loaf of bread from the store ([example here](http://www.thesimpledollar.com/2007/11/04/homemade-bread-cheap-delicious-healthy-and-easier-than-you-think/))? I thought [all you needed](http://www.jamieoliver.com/recipes/bread-recipes/basic-bread-recipe) was flour, water, sugar, yeast and salt (you could even omit the sugar and yeast if you don’t mind flat bread; heck, flour and water alone might work in a pinch). Of course, then there’s artificial ingredients like trans fats (not counting HFCS because honey has a similar composition, although nobody ate that much in the past), which can still be found in some brands of bread (and uncountable other foods, some of which claim to be healthier because they have no saturated fat or cholesterol). Also, it’s interesting to note which food categories have [increased](http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-FSPyeovhQos/T994MDnyNaI/AAAAAAAAAJY/CbRT3EjSkIU/s1600/Calorie_trend_publish.png) in consumption in recent decades, with concurrent increases in obesity and diabetes - grains and added sugars and fats (the increase in added sugars isn’t actually that large compared to the other two). ---
**Author:** ![Shmendrik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ee7513/32.png) [@Shmendrik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shmendrik)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/28 "2012-09-02T01:59:41Z")
The premise of the question is wrong. Sugar and “greasy unnutritious foods” are actually extremely nutritious, in the sense that you’ll stay alive for much longer by eating them instead of grass or leaves. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/29 "2012-09-02T02:01:50Z")
Most of that other stuff is to compensate for the stuff we take out of the flour and to make it look pretty and last longer. ETA: Grass and leaves aren’t healthy, which is what the OP was getting at. ---
**Author:** ![AaronX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/7bcc69/32.png) [@AaronX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AaronX)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/30 "2012-09-02T02:13:11Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > What mystifies me is why starch, which is essentially like sugar, is so bland. How come we don’t gulp down starch like we would sugar? Yes, it can be good but raw flour is pretty bland. Starch is great when cooked properly, ie deep fried. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/31 "2012-09-02T02:32:29Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > The general thought is that we like sweet things not because sweet things are hard to get, but because fruit tends to be sweet when it’s ripe, bitter when it’s not. This somewhat misses the point. You just beg the question of why we would evolve to like sweetness. When things are ripe they provide the [maximum net energy benefit](http://www.weightlossladder.com/calories-in-a-banana-ripe-vs-unripe-901/). We have evolved to be motivated to like to eat things in that state. And sweet things are hard to get: ripe fruit goes off quickly, and every other animal has done the same sums and come to the same conclusion: they have all “figured out” (ie evolved) that it is best to try to grab ripe fruit when possible, so there is maximum competition. And as others have said, what our health doesn’t cope with very well (at least long term) is living in a way where we can get access to ripe fruit all the time, without expending any significant effort. Our brains have not evolved in a way that causes any restraint to kick in and say “too much easily available sugar all the damn time, stop fer Og’s sake!” because that was not a condition present during 99.99% of our evolutionary history. On the contrary, it was a condition that was so rarely present that the only imperative was to take maximum advantage of ripe fruit when available, without restraint. So that is what we are now doing. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/32 "2012-09-02T02:37:37Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > It’s not just the abundance, but the highly processed nature of the food we eat. It’s almost pre-digested. Even 500 years ago, if you were eating bread, you were eating whole grain bread-- not bread made from highly milled flour with all the fiber removed. The Roman elite ate white bread, and [whole grain bread was the food of the lower classes](http://www.grainfieldsaustralia.com/US/lactobacillus_research/bread_history.shtml): > [@](#): > > Grain milling became simplified in Rome in about 500 BC with the introduction of a rotary quern in which a circular stone wheel turns against a fixed stone wheel (this was the basis of milling up until the nineteenth century). The top stone was turned by animals or domestic slaves, later by waterwheels. This process enabled the Romans to mill four or five grades of flour, reserving the finest and whitest for the wealthy. Coarse wholemeal, which also contained other grains such as millet, was favoured by wrestlers and gladiators to build up their strength, so the Romans were aware of the nutritive value of wholemeal flour but chose to use refined white flour. ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/33 "2012-09-02T02:43:56Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Most of that other stuff is to compensate for the stuff we take out of the flour and to make it look pretty and last longer. > > ETA: Grass and leaves aren’t healthy, which is what the OP was getting at. I’m talking about all of the other stuff, many of which are chemical names, and why do you need multiple types of flour added (some at less than 2%). Even if it isn’t necessarily unhealthy, it would seem that it would be cheaper and more efficient to use as few ingredients as possible. ---
**Author:** ![Max\_the\_Immortal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/6de8d8/32.png) [@Max\_the\_Immortal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Max_the_Immortal)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/34 "2012-09-02T02:46:44Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > So, running lean as we did, when we did find rich food sources, itwas a bonanza, and it made sense to eat all we could possibly hold – and not just once, but for days if possible. Get fat if you can! Because you’ll need that fat during lean times. This is the crux of the matter. We may be accustomed to a permanent non-scarcity of food, but this is extremely rare. If you consider all animals that have ever lived, we’re in a very small privileged group. Same goes for if you consider all humans that have ever lived, or even (to a lesser extent) all humans that are alive today. The instinct to gorge oneself on empty calories while the getting’s good is almost always a beneficial one; we’re just the very small exception. (On preview I see that **Princhester** has said more or less the same thing, but I think that the solution to this problem with be a matter of medical technology rather than evolution). …And for the record, I like broccoli quite a bit. It doesn’t matter if it’s stir-fried, steamed, or raw. The same goes for a lot of other veggies. Granted, I like them better when they’re beside a pork chop or somesuch, but they’re good on their own, too. > [@md2000](#): > > What mystifies me is why starch, which is essentially like sugar, is so bland. How come we don’t gulp down starch like we would sugar? Yes, it can be good but raw flour is pretty bland. What mystifies me is that I enjoy more or less plain starch (with just salt an maybe a little oil or butter) despite its near-total lack of flavor. White rice, plain noodles, and mashed potatoes are all palatable to me. ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2012, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362/35 "2012-09-02T04:37:00Z")
> [@Max\_the\_Immortal](#): > > What mystifies me is that I enjoy more or less plain starch (with just salt an maybe a little oil or butter) despite its near-total lack of flavor. White rice, plain noodles, and mashed potatoes are all palatable to me. Those foods aren’t just starch though; they have a lot of other stuff that contributes to flavor, which is why (to me at least) they all taste different. Similarly, protein probably doesn’t have much taste (or even a foul taste if a quick Google search is any indication); even glutamate, which is responsible for the umami taste, [isn’t very tasteful by itself](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monosodium_glutamate#Usage). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/evolutionary-explanation-for-healthy-foods-being-disgusting/633362.md?page=1)