# Ex Post Facto boycotts. **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 9, 2006, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017 "2006-09-09T01:12:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/1 "2006-09-09T01:12:54Z")
“It’s Hangin’ Day in Wolf City, Wyoming…” I love _Cat Ballou_. I think it is one of the best Westerns ever made. But I dislike Jane Fonda with the white-hot heat of a thousand suns. Ever since her trip to Hanoi, I have boycotted any of her movies or products. Morally, should I also have to stop watching _Cat Ballou_ and _Barbarella_? Mel Gibson will never see another penny from me, but does that mean I have to ditch my _Mad Max_ DVDs? Can you be morally consistant if you just stop buying a product after you discover something heinous about the producer, but keep the product you acquired before the heinous action? What say my Fellow Dopers? ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/2 "2006-09-09T02:43:33Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] “It’s Hangin’ Day in Wolf City, Wyoming…” I love _Cat Ballou_. I think it is one of the best Westerns ever made. But I dislike Jane Fonda with the white-hot heat of a thousand suns. Ever since her trip to Hanoi, I have boycotted any of her movies or products. Morally, should I also have to stop watching _Cat Ballou_ and _Barbarella_? Mel Gibson will never see another penny from me, but does that mean I have to ditch my _Mad Max_ DVDs? Can you be morally consistant if you just stop buying a product after you discover something heinous about the producer, but keep the product you acquired before the heinous action? What say my Fellow Dopers? [/QUOTE] Huh? What in the hell does owning a product related to a person, or persons, who may have opposing views than yours have to do with your own moral obligations? If I own a Jimi Hendrix CD am I endorsing heroine use? I like “The Wizard of Oz” but am not a fan of barbiturates. What’s your point? ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/3 "2006-09-09T02:54:34Z")
What if you really like an artist personally, but his or her work sucks? Do you force yourself to watch/listen to it? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/4 "2006-09-09T03:03:42Z")
[QUOTE=Leaffan] If I own a Jimi Hendrix CD am I endorsing heroine use? [/QUOTE] What if you own an album of Wonder Woman-in-bondage art? Anyway, I won’t _pay_ to see a Jane Fonda film, not that I’ve had much opportunity to do so lately, I’ll probably catch a few minutes of _Agnes of God_ if it’s televised, though, because I like Anne Bancroft and Meg Tilly and it’s partly set in Montreal. ---
**Author:** ![AskNott](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asknott/32/5790_2.png) [@AskNott](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AskNott)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/5 "2006-09-09T05:49:43Z")
I don’t know about you, but sometimes I am capable of separating the artist’s work from the artist as a person. When I was in the 8th or 9th grade, at the end of the school year, our music teacher had a day when we could bring in records of our favorite musicians. Somebody brought in a Ray Charles record. Mrs. Van Ness wasted about 15 minutes telling us not to support an artist who had been convicted of heroin possession. If I had known then what I know now, I would have told her that Ray Charles will be remembered long after we are gone for his music, not for being a junkie. I thoroughly disagree with John Wayne’s politics, but that doesn’t stop me from seeing some of his classic movies. ---
**Author:** ![hawthorne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@hawthorne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hawthorne)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/6 "2006-09-09T13:38:12Z")
Fonda went to Hanoi what, 24 years ago? If you’re just getting around to considering whether to keep watching _Cat Ballou_ maybe you should consider your moral stance at a less detailed level. At this rate you seem unlikely to have time to reach a consistent position. But I guess it’s about boycotting or shunning. About whether you want to use incentives to influence (in a rather small way) people’s behaviour or whether you want to cleanse yourself of a bad influence. There’s no point in boycotting films already made by Gibson; you cannot affect anyone’s behaviour. They already have made films with him (and maybe like you, lacked information about him). If you own a DVD of _Mad Max_ you can keep watching it. On the other hand if it’s about you wanting nothing to do with him, get rid of your DVDs - hell, sell them. So it’s a question of whether this about wanting Mel Gibson to see fewer pennies or no more of _your_ pennies. ---
**Author:** ![DanBlather](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/f4b2a3/32.png) [@DanBlather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DanBlather)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/7 "2006-09-09T21:49:05Z")
Apparently Jane Fonda scared the shit out of the North Vietnamese. They have not invaded the US since she went over there. In fact, once the US withdrew I don’t think the North Vietnamese harmed any US citizens in any way. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/8 "2006-09-09T21:51:57Z")
If you found out that one of the assembly line workers who made your car was, say, a convicted rapist… would you stop driving your car? ---
**Author:** ![Cluricaun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/bb73d2/32.png) [@Cluricaun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cluricaun)\ **Post date:** [September 9, 2006, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/9 "2006-09-09T22:07:03Z")
[QUOTE=hawthorne] Fonda went to Hanoi what, 24 years ago? [/QUOTE] Despite what’s shown in the Rambo films, the US wasn’t involved in a war with Viet Nam in 1982. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/10 "2006-09-10T03:12:29Z")
To get back to the OP, I’d say that if you decide you don’t wish to buy a person’s products because you disagree with their morals, you are not obligated to get rid of all their old products. A boycott is supposed to influence future behavior; the past is done. But you don’t get a pass on buying older products now - you can’t buy a copy of _Barefoot in the Park_ in 2006 even though it was made five years before Fonda’s Hanoi trip, because the purchase itself is after the act. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/11 "2006-09-10T03:33:11Z")
That’s what I was hoping. C’mon, Cat. It’s time to get Lee Marvin off that damn drunk horse. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [September 10, 2006, 4:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ex-post-facto-boycotts/372017/12 "2006-09-10T04:12:39Z")
**Silenus** , you may hate Jane Fonda the person and still continue to enjoy Jane Fonda the **Sex Kitten**. Really it is Okay. No guilt required. Barbarella is one of the landmark films in Sex Kitten history. Enjoy it with no guilt. Think of it this way, she might even be embarrassed she made it.\* No matter how much I despise Mel Gibson now, it will not make me enjoy Brave Heart or Mad Max any less. I will never buy PoC or anything new from him. But I still enjoy his movies that I always enjoyed. Jim - Okay, probably not, but think she is if it allows you to enjoy it guilt free.