# Exactly what is meant that the Jews are God's chosen people? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 1, 2003, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405 "2003-03-01T16:50:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/1 "2003-03-01T16:50:48Z")
A thread in GD made me realize that I never actually knew what it meant that the Jews were the chosen people. Within the contexts of modern Judaism, what do Jews today believe it means? Is there a consensus? Is it simply that God likes them better? Will get better rewards in the afterlife than the non-Jew? On a related topic, it was my understanding that some Christians, if not the majority, also believe the Jews to be the Chosen People. Is the Christian view of what this means any different from the Jewish view? I realize a lot of Christians believe a lot of different things, but perhaps someone can describe what the major sects believe. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/2 "2003-03-01T17:13:34Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by The Apostle Paul, an early Christian_ > > **Romans 3: 1,2** > > What advantage, then, is there in being a Jew, or what value is there in circumcision? Much in every way! First of all, they have been entrusted with the very words of God. One possible reason. Others sure to follow. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/3 "2003-03-01T17:18:12Z")
Ah, so it is believed they were chosen to deliver God’s message. And since the New Testament is also from Jews, no conflict with Christianity. Thanks **NoClueBoy**. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/4 "2003-03-01T17:36:30Z")
That’s what I got out of it, too. Since the writers of the NT were stil natural Jews, even though they changed religions, the favor seems to have extended into the first century. However, Paul and Peter both also taught that there is no difference to God at the end. Each stands for his own actions. Or something like that. I have no idea about modern Judaism or Church dogma on this matter. I just remembered the Romans cite. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/5 "2003-03-01T17:46:38Z")
Basically? Being a jew means, follow these rules. All of them. And the jewish people, as a whole, shall not perish from the earth. That’s really about all the ‘chosen people’ bit means. Chosen to test, chosen to torment, but chosen to survive. Don’t know if He likes us better. Don’t really think so, we simply made a compact with Him long ago, to not die. There’s really no heaven or hell involved. No better spot, no preferred parking. In fact, it means stricter rules to follow, than those who aren’t jewish. But, in the end, we shall not perish from the earth. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/6 "2003-03-01T17:49:07Z")
IMHO, based loosely on Scripture: At first the Children of Israel thought themselves to be “God’s pets” – the ones He particularly liked among all the peoples of the Earth. Then they found out the truth – they were to be His examples – the ones who were supposed to show the rest of the world what He wanted people to be, by living it out in their own lives. The second half of the Book of Isaiah spells this out. And now Christians are supposed to join them in being that kind of example. Sometimes they, and we, don’t do a particularly good job of it – or even a completely abominable job. But that’s the call, the proposition, the ideal to which we’re supposed to aspire. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/7 "2003-03-01T18:17:49Z")
> [@](#): > > **Peter** in Acts 10: 34-36 > > Then Peter began to speak: "I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism but accepts men from every nation who fear him and do what is right. You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, telling the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. > [@](#): > > **Paul** in Galatians 3: 26-29 > > You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise. These NT (Christian) verses seem to uphold the view of everyone having personal accountability, but Jews, then Christians had further responsibility of being examples of good faith and bearing God’s Word to the World. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/8 "2003-03-01T18:21:38Z")
I’m curious to hear the Morman take on this. Is it **Monty**? And what does Catholic Catechism teach? Fundamentalists, too. For that matter, how does Islam view this? ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/9 "2003-03-01T18:51:09Z")
> [@](#): > > And what does Catholic Catechism teach? [Catechism of the Catholic Church](http://www.scborromeo.org/ccc/para/839.htm) > [@](#): > > **839** “Those who have not yet received the Gospel are related to the People of God in various ways.” > The relationship of the Church with the Jewish People. When she delves into her own mystery, the Church, the People of God in the New Covenant, discovers her link with the Jewish People, “the first to hear the Word of God.” The Jewish faith, unlike other non-Christian religions, is already a response to God’s revelation in the Old Covenant. To the Jews “belong the sonship, the glory, the covenants, the giving of the law, the worship, and the promises; to them belong the patriarchs, and of their race, according to the flesh, is the Christ”, “for the gifts and the call of God are irrevocable.” (Not that the RCC has been particularly keen to remember this or act on it throughout history.) ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/10 "2003-03-01T18:55:17Z")
Wow! That is an eye opener. Thanks, **Tom** ---
**Author:** ![I\_Brian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c89c15/32.png) [@I\_Brian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Brian)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/11 "2003-03-01T21:02:59Z")
Any cultural group with a strong religious identity believed themselves the chosen of their own particular view of Divinity. It was a pretty common aspect of Asian mysticism. The Jews were the chosen of YHWH… The Egyptians were the chosen of Horus… The Persians were the chosen of Ahura-Mazda… etc. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/12 "2003-03-01T21:26:34Z")
Of course, the temples of Horus and Ahura-Mazda are destroyed or museums, while the synagogues of the Jews are still operating after 2,600 years (or 3,250 years, depending on who is doing the reckoning). Maybe there was something to it? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/13 "2003-03-01T21:36:51Z")
Well, to be completely fair, **Tom~** , (though I agree wholeheartedly with the purport of your post), I’d have to point out that not all the temples of Ahura-Mazda are destroyed or museums. [http://www.ad2000.org/profiles/parsee.htm](http://www.ad2000.org/profiles/parsee.htm) ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2003, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/14 "2003-03-01T23:21:34Z")
I can’t remember the exact spot, but somewhere in the Bible, God refers to the Israelites (and their descendents, the Jews) as His “firstborn.” It’s not that God likes them “better”, it’s that they were the first to understand the Message – that there is such a thing as morality – and so there is a special relationship. Like a parent, who has a special relationship with the firstborn child. More is expected of them, and the relationship is special because they were first. ---
**Author:** ![Will\_Repair](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a698b9/32.png) [@Will\_Repair](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Will_Repair)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/15 "2003-03-02T01:16:18Z")
> [@](#): > > **Those who believe (in the Qur’an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians,- any who believe in God and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord; on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve. > 2:62** [Most highly recommend reading it yourself.](http://www.compsoc.man.ac.uk/~moiz/quran/) ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/16 "2003-03-02T06:07:50Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by NoClueBoy \* > I’m curious to hear the Morman take on this. I know exactly one Morman. “Morman” is someone’s surname. It is not the colloquial name for the LDS church. I presume you mean Mormon. 😉 {Sorry, it’s just one of my pet peeves to see “Mormon” spelled “Morman.”} > [@](#): > > Is it **Monty**? And what does Catholic Catechism teach? Fundamentalists, too. FWIR, some Fundamentalist outfits teach that the Jews abrogated their covenant with the Lord by not accepting Jesus as the Messiah. As far as the Mormon teaching goes, the Jews were the Chosen People because they entered into a covenant with God. That covenant was “to be a peculiar people,” by which is meant that they were to comport themselves by the teachings of a particular moral system. The reason we call them Gentiles is that we believe that anyone who’s not a member of the LDS church is not a member of Zion–meaning they haven’t accepted the restored Gospel. For those of us who have accepted the restored Gospel, we consider ourselves to have been adopted into Zion. “Chosen People” doesn’t mean “Better than you.” For a good read on this, read _Thursday the Rabbi Walked Out_ {at least I think that’s the Rabbi Small mystery where the Rabbi is teaching an introductory course in Judaism at Windemere Christian College}. ---
**Author:** ![Polycarp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/82dd89/32.png) [@Polycarp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Polycarp)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 6:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/17 "2003-03-02T06:20:20Z")
**Monty** : Todd Morman is an emphatically “out” gay journalist of some local repute in this area and IIRC a (fairly inactive) member of the local MCC congregation, which has a concert-level gospel choir – in token of which some of us have christened that group the “Morman Tabernacle Choir!” 😉 FWIW, **No Clue Boy** , in LDS belief, Mormon was the name of the last-but-one prophet of the Nephites, the one who collected their sacred writings, which was therefore named after him. (His son Moroni was the last of the lot, and put the final touches on the book.) One or the other of them appeared to Joseph Smith as a “Resurrected Personage” (erroneously but useful for getting the idea across conceived of as “angel”) to guide him to the plates on which the Book of Mormon was engraved. (That’s from reading up on LDS beliefs about 30 years ago – one of our resident LDS folks can correct the inevitable errors.) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/18 "2003-03-02T06:21:47Z")
I think i like **Polycarp’s** take on the Jews as an example (and they’ve been a great one). Also, **Tomndebb** , Zoroastrianism is still a living religion, albeit a small one. ---
**Author:** ![Splanky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b2d939/32.png) [@Splanky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Splanky)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 7:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/19 "2003-03-02T07:21:53Z")
There is a midrashim (the Midrash is a collection of explanations of the bible written by humans) on this I believe. It has something to do with how god wanted a chosen people, so he went around to a bunch of civilizations- the Sumerians, the Egyptians, etc. and they all turned him down. He finally went to the Hebrews and they said yes. And the rest is history. (Of course, that is a terrible adaptation. Maybe someone who didn’t vaguely overhear this midrashim while not paying attention at Hebrew school could explain it better.) The truth is this actually sparked up a debate thousands of years ago- enough for someone to put it in the Jewish Midrash, at least. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [March 2, 2003, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405/20 "2003-03-02T14:05:16Z")
Sorry for the totally unintended slight of the LDS, **Monty**. I just always heard them as Mormons, so I used that term. And I can’t even spell my own name right, half the time… I find your explanation of “The Chosen” quite interesting. **Poly** , thanks for the reminder. I, too, am separated from reading the Book of Mormon by a couple of decades. **Splanky** , any web sites with that? I’m doing a search as we speak, but if you have a place, I would appreciate it. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exactly-what-is-meant-that-the-jews-are-gods-chosen-people/158405.md?page=2)