# examples of ecphrasis **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 5, 2007, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641 "2007-07-05T20:33:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 6, 2007, 9:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/41 "2007-07-06T21:49:27Z")
[QUOTE=Kalhoun] Right. I got that (I helped boost it up the charts). I just never knew it was about Don McLean. I thought it was a nameless, faceless rock star. That’s the tidbit I was remarking about. [/QUOTE] I heard the story of the song’s genesis only once, when the Roberta Flack version was current. Aside from that one occasion I wouldn’t know either. ---
**Author:** ![Annie-Xmas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecc23a/32.png) [@Annie-Xmas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Annie-Xmas)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/42 "2007-07-07T12:27:02Z")
I cannot believe this thread got so long with no mention of Jefferson Airplane’s [White Rabbit](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rabbit_(song)) ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [July 7, 2007, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/43 "2007-07-07T12:44:42Z")
[QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] I cannot believe this thread got so long with no mention of Jefferson Airplane’s [White Rabbit](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rabbit_(song)) [/QUOTE] Clearly some people in this thread forgot to feed their heads this morning. ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/44 "2007-07-08T00:25:40Z")
[QUOTE=Annie-Xmas] I cannot believe this thread got so long with no mention of Jefferson Airplane’s [White Rabbit](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_Rabbit_(song)) [/QUOTE] That [FONT=Times New Roman]_is_ surprising. I hadn’t thought of it either.[/FONT] _White Rabbit_ \>\>\> Alice’s Adventures In Wonderland and Through the Looking Glass A good example because it defines/redefines a work of art. Only since [FONT=Times New Roman]\*White Rabbit \* is Lewis Carroll’s children’s literature indelibly associated with hallucinogenic effects.[/FONT] ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/45 "2007-07-08T01:08:50Z")
My personal favorite on the [FONT=Times New Roman]_White Album_, side 4 track 3 (vinyl), certainly the best song George Harrison ever wrote, might be an example of ecphrasis. I can endlessly contemplate _Savoy Truffle_, so, to me it is art. But can a box of chocolates be art? I can’t speak for the Good News brand George and Eric Clapton were having fun with, but I once (and only once) did experience a superlative box of chocolates. Perhaps there is an art in such things. I know I never see a box of chocolates, especially if each individual piece is labeled, without thinking of _Savoy Truffle_. Both sides of the equation are required to be art though, so this example is ‘iffy.’[/FONT] ---
**Author:** ![Darryl\_Lict](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7cd45c/32.png) [@Darryl\_Lict](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darryl_Lict)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/46 "2007-07-08T02:24:02Z")
More connections with Vincent! Vincent van Gogh’s 1887 oil painting of The Courtesan is inspired by a nineteenth-century woodblock print by Keisai Eisen depicting a high-ranking courtesan. ---
**Author:** ![Spoke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a88e57/32.png) [@Spoke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spoke)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/47 "2007-07-08T02:51:19Z")
There’s also [Gauguin’s painting of van Gogh Painting Sunflowers](http://www.artchive.com/artchive/g/gauguin/vangogh.jpg). Not sure if that qualifies or not. ---
**Author:** ![jackelope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@jackelope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jackelope)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 6:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/48 "2007-07-08T06:51:15Z")
[QUOTE=spoke-] There’s also [Gauguin’s painting of van Gogh Painting Sunflowers](http://www.artchive.com/artchive/g/gauguin/vangogh.jpg). Not sure if that qualifies or not. [/QUOTE] Interesting thought! There’s a painting by Dali that may be an even more tail-swallowing example. I don’t know the name (and extensive Googling is no help), but I saw it at the Dali Museum in St. Petersburg, Florida about 15 years ago. It’s a gigantic painting, maybe 20 feet high, a section of the gallery’s floor having been lowered to accommodate it and a few others of similar size. What has stuck with me about this one is that it wasn’t signed; instead, at the bottom left corner, Dali painted himself into the picture. He’s standing there down at the corner, holding a paintbrush and palette in front of an easel on which he’s painting the very picture we’re looking at. His head is turned, looking back at us. It’s a bizarre effect: This is not a painting of the occurrence that occupies most of the canvas, but rather a painting of Dali, painting this painting we’re looking at. I hope I’m describing it effectively; it is both a painting of the occurrence (which I think had something to do with Jesus’ ascension and DNA), _and_ a painting of Dali, painting this painting. It reminds me a bit of the movie _Adaptation._, in which we’re watching the movie at the same time that we’re watching the screenwriter write the movie, in which he is also a character. Or, to go even further back, of _Tristram Shandy_. I suspect that these aren’t really what the OP meant, but it’s an interesting sub-genre of ecphrasis: The work that posits itself as a work about itself, which sets up a weird kind of self-conscious duality in that we get a bit cross-eyed trying to view it from two different angles at once. When it’s done poorly ( **cough_DavidFosterWallace_cough** ) it’s intolerably cutesy, but when it’s good it can be brilliant. ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/49 "2007-07-08T11:35:54Z")
[QUOTE=jackelope] Interesting thought! There’s a painting by Dali that may be an even more tail-swallowing example. I don’t know the name (and extensive Googling is no help), but I saw it at the Dali Museum in St. Petersburg, Florida about 15 years ago. It’s a gigantic painting, maybe 20 feet high, a section of the gallery’s floor having been lowered to accommodate it and a few others of similar size. What has stuck with me about this one is that it wasn’t signed; instead, at the bottom left corner, Dali painted himself into the picture. He’s standing there down at the corner, holding a paintbrush and palette in front of an easel on which he’s painting the very picture we’re looking at. His head is turned, looking back at us. It’s a bizarre effect: This is not a painting of the occurrence that occupies most of the canvas, but rather a painting of Dali, painting this painting we’re looking at. I hope I’m describing it effectively; it is both a painting of the occurrence (which I think had something to do with Jesus’ ascension and DNA), _and_ a painting of Dali, painting this painting. It reminds me a bit of the movie _Adaptation._, in which we’re watching the movie at the same time that we’re watching the screenwriter write the movie, in which he is also a character. Or, to go even further back, of _Tristram Shandy_.You do describe it well. I suspect that these aren’t really what the OP meant, but it’s an interesting sub-genre of ecphrasis: The work that posits itself as a work about itself, which sets up a weird kind of self-conscious duality in that we get a bit cross-eyed trying to view it from two different angles at once. When it’s done poorly ( **cough_DavidFosterWallace_cough** ) it’s intolerably cutesy, but when it’s good it can be brilliant. [/QUOTE] You do describe it well, and categorize it. It could, very well, be a sub-genre. Some of the other examples in this thread are also quasi-ecphrasis. ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/50 "2007-07-08T11:49:51Z")
[QUOTE=Mark Ryle] My personal favorite on the [FONT=Times New Roman]_White Album_, side 4 track 3 (vinyl), certainly the best song George Harrison ever wrote, might be an example of ecphrasis.[/FONT] [/QUOTE] As might _Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds_, John Lennon’s homage to his son Julian’s drawing of his friend Lucy (in the sky with diamonds). ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/51 "2007-07-08T12:13:38Z")
[QUOTE=Chez Guevara] As might _Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds_, John Lennon’s homage to his son Julian’s drawing of his friend Lucy (in the sky with diamonds). [/QUOTE] I combed through that album, in my mind, thinking it might be fertile ground, after ‘Annie-Xmas’ (Post 23) mentioned [FONT=Times New Roman]_Mr. Kite_, but missed _Lucy In the Sky_. But it’s true, Julian’s drawing is forever associated with a Lennon-McCartney song, and from Sergeant Pepper, no less, whether or not John was being completely forthcoming about LSD the drug. By the way, is there a term for a reverse acronym, like “Lucy in the sky with diamonds”?[/FONT] ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 12:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/52 "2007-07-08T12:27:57Z")
[QUOTE=jackelope] … There’s a painting by Dali that may be an even more tail-swallowing example … [/QUOTE] ‘jackelope,’ in my Reply to your very interesting Post 48, I did not intend to quote in its entirety, just salient points. It must have seemed you were seeing double this morning when you logged on. I [FONT=Times New Roman]_wish_ I had editing privileges.[/FONT] ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/53 "2007-07-08T14:43:31Z")
[QUOTE=Mark Ryle] By the way, is there a term for a reverse acronym, like “Lucy in the sky with diamonds”?[/FONT] [/QUOTE] [This is pretty close.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backronym)🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 8, 2007, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/54 "2007-07-08T21:57:18Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] [This is pretty close.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Backronym)🙂 [/QUOTE] Wow! Thanks, ‘OneCentStamp.’ It’s a bacronym. There’s a lot on that page to digest, and it’s all new to me. Thanks again for the info. ---
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2007, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/55 "2007-07-09T01:06:49Z")
Paul Hindemith’s opera **Mathis Der Maler** is about the life of painter Matthias Grunewald, and was particularly inspired by the famous **Issenheim Altarpiece**. ---
**Author:** ![garygnu](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/garygnu/32/2924_2.png) [@garygnu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/garygnu)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2007, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/56 "2007-07-09T02:35:14Z")
_Searching for Carrie Fischer_ Which is inexplicably missing on IMDb ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [July 9, 2007, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/57 "2007-07-09T17:54:40Z")
[QUOTE=OneCentStamp] **Mark Ryle** , what is up with your bizarre font choices? I feel as if I’m reading a ransom note. 😛 [/QUOTE] I’m reforming as of today, ‘OneCentStamp.’ Over the weekend I viewed this thread on my father’s computer. In my posts, the Times New Roman italics were very outsized, enormously so, compared to the Verdana. I identified the problem as: My father has ‘Text Size’ on his browser increased for easier reading. But the Times New Roman italics increase enormously while Verdana increases just a little. When I reduce his Text Size my posts look alright. On my home, work, and library computers everything always looked fine – I never dreamed there was any problem. I now see it was madness to mix fonts. I’m mortified my posts look like ransom notes. It always amazes me how many ways there are to screw up with Text Editors, from Word to Outlook to Message Boards. I’m conforming to the Board’s default starting now – I’m amazed they put up with me this long. Thanks again for your invaluable input. ---
**Author:** ![mr.jp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/48db29/32.png) [@mr.jp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mr.jp)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2007, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/58 "2007-07-10T13:11:21Z")
Beach Boys - Don’t Worry Baby was an answer to Ronettes - Be My Baby ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2007, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/59 "2007-07-10T13:36:38Z")
[QUOTE=Chez Guevara] As might _Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds_, John Lennon’s homage to his son Julian’s drawing of his friend Lucy (in the sky with diamonds). [/QUOTE] I know it may not count, but interesting nonetheless - the hominid fossil “Lucy” was named after the song: [Lucy (hominid) - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucy_%28Australopithecus%29) > [@](#): > > That first evening they celebrated at the camp, staying up all night, and at some stage during the evening the fossil AL 288-1 was nicknamed Lucy, after the Beatles song “Lucy in the Sky with Diamonds”, which was being played loudly and repeatedly on a tape recorder in the camp. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2007, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641/60 "2007-07-10T13:45:09Z")
\*The Girl with Pearl Earing \* by Tracy Chevalier is an historical fiction novel inspired by Vermeer’s work by the same name. In the book, we learn the (fictionalized) motivations that prompted that particular work to be painted. I cannot think of the painting without thinking of the book. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/examples-of-ecphrasis/410641.md?page=4)