# Exceptions to "actors who always play themselves" **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** actor-characters\ **Created:** [January 3, 2025, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524 "2025-01-03T15:54:43Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/114 "2025-01-05T00:57:30Z")
Rocky also defeated _Bound for Glory_ (a biopic of Woody Guthrie), _Network_, and _All the President’s Men_ for best picture. And three of the acting Oscars went to _Network_. But as I said, it was enormously popular. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/115 "2025-01-05T02:21:42Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > If you say that in a room full of film scholars ans movie critics you better duck. I doubt it. They’re not all snobs. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/116 "2025-01-05T02:41:11Z")
The 70s was an incredible time for movies: The Godfather I & II; One Flew Over the Cuckoo’s Nest, Network, Taxi Driver, Raging Bull, Chinatown, Clockwork Orange, Star Wars, Dog Day Afternoon, The Conversation and on and on. It was the last gasp before big studios just turned out dreck. Most film scholars will tell you that the 1970s were the greatest decade of film. The legend typically revolves around the mavericks of “New Hollywood,” directors who used their unprecedented power and skill to helm some of the most iconic films of the last half-century, such as _The Godfather, Jaws, Star Wars, Taxi Driver, The Deer Hunter_ , and _Apocalypse Now._ [https://smithsonianassociates.org/ticketing/programs/greatest-decade-of-film-beyond-new-hollywood-directors-of-1970s](https://smithsonianassociates.org/ticketing/programs/greatest-decade-of-film-beyond-new-hollywood-directors-of-1970s) ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/117 "2025-01-05T03:41:37Z")
I have seen Zardoz. I was either too high or not high enough when I saw it. It might be my favourite thing about Connery. Producers offered Connery percent of box office to play Gandalf in LotR. Connery said no, because he didn’t ‘get’ the story. He missed out on $400 million because he didn’t understand the story. Then realize that he actually made Zardoz… ---
**Author:** ![dorvann](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/df705f/32.png) [@dorvann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dorvann)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/118 "2025-01-05T05:28:23Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > he didn’t understand the story. I believe that is same reason Connery gave for turning down playing The Architect in The Matrix. ---
**Author:** ![Strenger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecae2f/32.png) [@Strenger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strenger)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/119 "2025-01-05T05:37:37Z")
Exception granted, per OP. Yes, of course, one recalls normally the “You want me to hold the chicken?” scene from _5EP_, but as in this movie and several others, Mr. Nicholson delivers moving performances. https:// [www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7y8tLgvpCY](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7y8tLgvpCY) ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/120 "2025-01-05T08:35:45Z")
I agree with this. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/121 "2025-01-05T12:21:50Z")
Kevin Costner loves to portray the 1960s, but usually does so as an idealist, law abiding good guy. In _A Perfect World_, he’s still in his preferred era, but he plays a bad guy who kidnaps a kid. While the movie shows his good side, and he ends up a sympathetic character, it’s quite incongruent to see Costner committing crimes. > **[A Perfect World](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Perfect_World)** > > A Perfect World is a 1993 American thriller crime drama film directed by Clint Eastwood. It stars Kevin Costner as an escaped convict who takes a young boy (T. J. Lowther) hostage and attempts to escape on the road with the child. Eastwood co-stars as a Texas Ranger in pursuit of the convict. > Though the film was not a box-office success in North America and grossed only $31 million for its November 1993 release, it managed to gross $104 million overseas for a total of $135 million worldwide. T... ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/122 "2025-01-05T16:33:40Z")
> [@dorvann](#): > > I believe that is same reason Connery gave for turning down playing The Architect in The Matrix. He turned down Morpheus at first, then also turned down the Architect. I would not thought he was physically able enough to be Morpheus, who fights a lot, but maybe the script looked different then. I mean, I don’t think Fishburne could do the role today without working out for a few months in prep. Anyway, I have a feeling the Gandalf story is exaggerated. I don’t think they would have gone with him over Ian McKellan, but probably wanted to screen test or at least talk to him about it. Has anyone found a definitive source that says clearly that Peter Jackson offered Gandalf to him? I know Christopher Lee asked for Gandalf and even made a video of himself as Gandalf, reading some lines from the book, in order to petition/audition for it. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/123 "2025-01-05T16:34:13Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > > [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > > > Out of curiosity: has Christopher Walken ever done a movie where he doesn’t pause at times you and I wouldn’t, in between emphasizing words you and I wouldn’t? I know impressionists exaggerate what he does, but — does he ever _not_ do it? > > I can’t think of one role early in his career where he was like that. The Walken persona didn’t happen until later. How about [this one,](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Qp3NWzLzaek) where the point is that he’s so danged unnerving with his pauses-and-emphasis schtick that he makes Woody Allen seem like a regular guy? ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/124 "2025-01-05T20:27:57Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Wepner lost, but he went the distance, and even knocked Ali down. Stallone was then inspired to write the screenplay. While it’s true that Wepner inspired Stallone to write “Rocky,” he didn’t go the distance. Ali knocked him out in the 15th round. Ali insisted that it shouldn’t have been ruled a knockdown, that he fell because Wepner stepped on his foot and pushed him. Film and photos support his claim. And now back to your regular programming. . . ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/125 "2025-01-05T20:34:39Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > **Gene Hackman** seems to have similar roles in the films he’s in. His bit part in Young Frankenstein, though, is a total departure from his usual role. I didn’t even realize it was him until I read the Wiki page on the film. I don’t think of Hackman as an actor who usually plays himself. He’s a character actor who’s had a lot of lead roles. He was quite different in _The French Connection_, _The Conversation_, and _Hoosiers_. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/126 "2025-01-05T20:46:48Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > I don’t think of Hackman as an actor who usually plays himself. He’s a character actor who’s had a lot of lead roles. He was quite different in _The French Connection_, _The Conversation_, and _Hoosiers_ I love hearing him talk about Hoosiers. He made it for the money, just a job. He had no idea it would be so memorable and loved for years to come. He’s great in it, but it’s hard to tell what things are like when you are making them. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/127 "2025-01-05T21:29:01Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > … > [/reclusive author who hates doing this] ACTING!!! (You have to admit, ‘unsociable intellectual’ was definitely outside his usual wheelhouse.) > [@TriPolar](#): > > > [@Loach](#): > > > > If you say that in a room full of film scholars ans movie critics you better duck. > > I doubt it. They’re not all snobs. It’s not so much about being a snob, as about noticing how massively the film industry changed after _Star Wars_. Today we see “indie” movies on streaming services, but back then they–and also fairly big studio pictures that emphasized character over spectacle and fx–opened in _theaters_. That’s practically unimaginable, today. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [January 5, 2025, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/128 "2025-01-05T21:34:34Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > Film and photos support his claim. Not completely. There’s one photo that looks that way but Wepner’s foot might not have actually been over Ali’s at all . Photojournalist were autoclicking cameras around the ring but I don’t recall seeing another one that has showing Wepner’s boot touching Ali’s. It is certainly possible though. Whether an intentional tactic or accidental it’s often the result of stepping on a boxer’s foot because yanking a foot away or any disturbance to their footwork can leave them off balance. Wepner has said he made a mistake because he woke Ali up, and then Ali proceeded to torture him through the remaining rounds. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 12:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/129 "2025-01-06T00:32:24Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > While it’s true that Wepner inspired Stallone to write “Rocky,” he didn’t go the distance. Ali knocked him out in the 15th round. Thanks for the correction. Ali did indeed take him out. But it was the _final_ round. And Wepner was still trying to get up when the ref waived it off. There was _grit_ on display. I can see where Stallone got the inspiration. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/ncCQDEvhulQ/maxresdefault.jpg "Muhammad Ali BRUTAL Knockout Chuck Wepner In The Final Round | 4K Ultra HD") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ncCQDEvhulQ) > [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > Ali insisted that it shouldn’t have been ruled a knockdown, that he fell because Wepner stepped on his foot and pushed him. Film and photos support his claim. It wasn’t a devastating blow. More of a body shot, and Ali popped right back up. But as the clip below shows, it was only the third time, to that point, that the champ had ever been knocked down. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/oLA8HIAQEzU/maxresdefault.jpg "CHUCK WEPNER AND THE FAMOUS KNOCK DOWN OF Muhammad Ali Courtesy of Jeff Feuerzeig and ESPN!") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLA8HIAQEzU) > [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > And now back to your regular programming. . . What he said. ---
**Author:** ![MortSahlFan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@MortSahlFan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MortSahlFan)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/130 "2025-01-06T02:29:23Z")
Jack Nicholson (except “King of Marvin Garden”) ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/131 "2025-01-06T04:50:33Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Early in his career, Hanks played characters who were sleazy or sarcastic jerks several times (most prominently in “Bachelor Party” but note in “Dragnet,” he’s the one who plays the modern cop, not the straitlaced Joe Friday) and on TV he was the drunk who hit Alex Keaton (and on Bosom Buddies, his roommate was the idealist, while Hanks played the wilder one). It’s rather startling when you look at Hanks later career. Oh, you can’t leave out his spot on [Taxi](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSl0X4heQBQ)! ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/132 "2025-01-06T12:29:30Z")
I had never seen that! ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2025, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524/133 "2025-01-06T17:01:26Z")
> [@Rilchiam](#): > > > [@Andy\_L](#): > > > > Early in his career, Hanks played characters who were sleazy or sarcastic jerks several times (most prominently in “Bachelor Party” but note in “Dragnet,” he’s the one who plays the modern cop, not the straitlaced Joe Friday) and on TV he was the drunk who hit Alex Keaton (and on Bosom Buddies, his roommate was the idealist, while Hanks played the wilder one). It’s rather startling when you look at Hanks later career. > > Oh, you can’t leave out his spot on [Taxi](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SSl0X4heQBQ)! What about the guy fighting The Fonz with karate? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/exceptions-to-actors-who-always-play-themselves/1012524.md?page=7)