# Execution by lethal injection
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794
**Category:** Factual Questions
**Created:** [April 19, 2017, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794 "2017-04-19T15:46:46Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/21 "2017-04-19T18:43:21Z")
The basic problem is that, while it is acceptable to do studies on human beings that involve making them healthier, it isn’t so acceptable to hold tests that involve killing them.
Who knew?
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### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/22 "2017-04-19T18:55:52Z")
We don’t really need to do studies though, because we have a massive case history when it comes to gun shot wounds, and the military and law enforcement have done huge amounts of studies on lethality of firearms (as have governments around the world.)
The current firing squad procedure of 5 riflemen, 1 with a dummy round, firing at very close range at a target placed on front of the person’s heart, is probably basically a “zero-failure” scenario and as close to zero-pain as death will ever be. Such trauma to the heart causes such a massive loss of blood pressure that you’re unconscious immediately, and brain death follows rapidly, not to mention you exsanguinate pretty good as well. The human response time is actually pretty slow, something like 100-200ms. I’ve read studies that suggest in high speed accidents, the deceased often “don’t know what hit them” because the impact happens and the physical damage is done to them before their brain can process the pain and event itself. Now, if they see the accident coming (because it’s telegraphed and/or they see the car coming at them for example), they will obviously know it’s about to happen. I’d imagine being shot to death with a headshot or massive heart shot barrage would be very similar.
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### Author:  [@leahcim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/leahcim)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/23 "2017-04-19T19:11:33Z")
I think there is an implicit unstated requirement that there be no “spectacle” associated with an execution. People imagine the public “show” execution of the past and want to make it clear that we are not doing _that_. In addition to being painless for the executee, the execution must also be “boring” for the observer.
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### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/24 "2017-04-19T19:11:47Z")
> [@TriPolar](#):
>
> In addition to the quick painless methods listed above the doomed prisoner could be put under with conventional anesthesia and never know it’s coming.
And then the pharmaceutical companies, many of which are not in the US, will stop selling conventional anaesthetics to the US, causing a shortage of anaesthetics for regular medical treatments.
This has already happened with some of the drugs in the execution “cocktail”. They are becoming hard for state governments to obtain, because foreign drug companies won’t sell them anymore to countries that use them for executions - that is, the United States.
Sometimes this is a voluntary ban by the drug company, sometimes they are barred by law in their home country from selling drugs for death penalty usage. For example, EU law bars pharma companies in EU states from selling their “cocktail” drugs to the US.
That’s why Arkansas is rushing to kill so many before the end of the month. Their drugs “best before” date expires April 30, and Arkansas is having trouble buying more.
One of the drug companies is suing Arkansas for the return of the drugs, arguing that Arkansas bought them by deception about their plan to use them for executions.
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### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/25 "2017-04-19T19:22:23Z")
A lot of the drugs in the typical cocktail are very old (as in invented long ago) and can be easily made in a compounding pharmacy. It doesn’t really bypass most of the problems associated with lethal injection though.
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### Author:  [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/26 "2017-04-19T19:38:22Z")
FWIW, putting down animals doesn’t always go by the book, but you don’t have to stop and treat the animal for whatever adverse reaction it might have-- you just hurry along with something else. The basic difference to keep in mind is that you are dealing with a healthy human, and for the most part, not with healthy animals.
I had a dog with cancer who could no longer walk and needed to be put down. The vet planned to give her a sedative that the vet said would probably put her to sleep, and “causes some animals to pass from that alone.” Then she gives them another drug that stops their hearts, assuming it is still beating. It was supposed to be slow and calm, and I could pet her while she just went to sleep.
Well, my dog had a paradoxical reaction to the sedative, and got very agitated. Because she couldn’t move her legs well, she didn’t jump off the table, but she was clearly distressed. The vet gave her something else-- something they give dogs before a minor emergency procedure, and it relaxed her, but it wears off fast (I remember one of our other dogs getting it when she cut a gash in her side and needed stitches). So once she had that drug, then she needed the heart-stopper right away.
With a human you can’t be changing drugs, or altering the protocol according to the situation.
That’s true partly because of the law, but mainly because doctors aren’t involved.
The fact that we humanely put down animals (and covertly, very sick humans, sometimes) with less trouble, really isn’t germane.
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### Author:  [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/27 "2017-04-19T19:39:59Z")
> [@Martin\_Hyde](#):
>
> A lot of the drugs in the typical cocktail are very old (as in invented long ago) and can be easily made in a compounding pharmacy. It doesn’t really bypass most of the problems associated with lethal injection though.
I doubt a compounding pharmacy would do it, though. All it needs is to be outed as the “Death Pharmacy,” to get boycotted.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/28 "2017-04-19T19:56:44Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#):
>
> I doubt a compounding pharmacy would do it, though. All it needs is to be outed as the “Death Pharmacy,” to get boycotted.
On the other hand, they mat get new business from people who favor the death penalty. I personally would not want to bet my livelihood on that, but hey.
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### Author:  [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/29 "2017-04-19T19:59:04Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#):
>
> On the other hand, they mat get new business from people who favor the death penalty. I personally would not want to bet my livelihood on that, but hey.
Downside is that they cannot ship any of their drugs to most other countries that do not have the death penalty, which limits their international market just a tad.
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### Author:  [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/30 "2017-04-19T20:03:18Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#):
>
> I doubt a compounding pharmacy would do it, though. All it needs is to be outed as the “Death Pharmacy,” to get boycotted.
They already have for some states; there are states that have passed “shield laws” which make it so the public cannot get information through FOIA or other means to disclose who the compounding pharmacy was. Anti-DP groups have been fighting this in court for awhile.
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### Author:  [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/31 "2017-04-19T20:26:43Z")
Since nicotine is quite poisonous, maybe tobacco companies can be enlisted to made a lethal potion. It seems unlikely that there is anything a tobacco company won’t do for money.
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### Author:  [@Weisshund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weisshund)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/32 "2017-04-19T20:53:39Z")
Just use CO2
Its nearly free, and quite effective at causing “Humane” death.
Medium flow to induce the Sandman, then heavy flow to induce the Grim Reaper.
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### Author:  [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/33 "2017-04-19T21:08:26Z")
> [@Weisshund](#):
>
> Just use CO2
> Its nearly free, and quite effective at causing “Humane” death.
>
> Medium flow to induce the Sandman, then heavy flow to induce the Grim Reaper.
Not humane at all. Quite painful, I hear.
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### Author:  [@Mean\_Mr.Mustard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mean_Mr.Mustard)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/34 "2017-04-19T22:27:33Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#):
>
> I could have [_sworn_ that list also contained:
> Agitation or irritability
> Fever
> Hallucinations (either visual or auditory)
> Muscle stiffness
> Nausea or vomiting
> Nervousness.
> Seizures
> Stomach pain or severe cramps
> Sweating
> Twitching
>
> And on rechecking that list, I see that I’m right-it did include all those.
Something tells me the nervousness and sweating may not be pharmacological in nature. 🙂
mmm
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### Author:  [@SigMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SigMan)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 10:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/35 "2017-04-19T22:35:48Z")
Why spend thousands on drugs when a 30.06 cartridge are a dollar?
The condemned will never know what hit him. How humane is that?
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### Author:  [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 10:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/36 "2017-04-19T22:47:57Z")
> [@SigMan](#):
>
> Why spend thousands on drugs when a 30.06 cartridge are a dollar?
>
> The condemned will never know what hit him. How humane is that?
It’s messy.
A big bottle of nitrogen is the way to go, I think.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/37 "2017-04-19T22:52:20Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#):
>
> Not humane at all. Quite painful, I hear.
What about the guys who run a hose from the exhaust pipe to the inside of the car? I thought they just “went to sleep”.
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### Author:  [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)
#### Post date: [April 19, 2017, 11:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/38 "2017-04-19T23:54:13Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#):
>
> What about the guys who run a hose from the exhaust pipe to the inside of the car? I thought they just “went to sleep”.
That’s carbon monoxide, or CO.
CO2 (carbon dioxide) was what I was responding to.
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### Author:  [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)
#### Post date: [April 20, 2017, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/39 "2017-04-20T01:38:21Z")
> [@MindsEye\_Watering](#):
>
> That’s carbon monoxide, or CO.
> CO2 (carbon dioxide) was what I was responding to.
Oh.
Well, what about carbon monoxide, then?
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### Author:  [@MindsEye\_Watering](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MindsEye_Watering)
#### Post date: [April 20, 2017, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/execution-by-lethal-injection/784794/40 "2017-04-20T01:59:32Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#):
>
> Oh.
>
> Well, what about carbon monoxide, then?
A lot more hazardous to bystanders.
I’m not being whooshed, am I?
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