# Experience required... experience required... experience required... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 22, 2007, 6:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042 "2007-05-22T06:21:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/61 "2007-05-23T17:14:18Z")
[QUOTE=fluiddruid] That’s the great thing about cover letters. Explain why your experience is relevant to what they’re asking for. Even if you don’t meet it on paper, someone who can explain why their experience is applicable has a fighting chance. [/QUOTE] Exactly. I applied for my current job (transcript proofreader) coming straight out of college, so I was relying on my degree more than anything. The ad said “English, Communications, or Journalism degree required.” I stated in my cover letter that my degree in Linguistics was quite adequate and in some respects even more appropriate for the job than the degrees the ad was asking for, since we’re dealing with transcribing the spoken word rather than straight written copy. After that, the interview and job offer were basically done deals. ---
**Author:** ![Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spectre_of_pithecanthropus/32/12343_2.png) [@Spectre\_of\_Pithecanthropus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spectre_of_Pithecanthropus)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/62 "2007-05-23T20:10:21Z")
[QUOTE=Nava] I’ve seen ads requiring “five years experience with Windows 98” (the year was 2000); "superior engineer (this degree takes seven years) with an MBA, preferably in Marketing, trilingual English /German/French, with at least 2 years working in industrial environments, under 25yo [/QUOTE] I’m astonished that they can list age as a qualification. That is strictly verboten (oops, sorry **Nava** 🙂 ) in the U.S., although that doesn’t mean that one’s age can’t be a factor in the private thoughts of the person who makes the hiring decision. ---
**Author:** ![gigi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a587f6/32.png) [@gigi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gigi)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/63 "2007-05-23T22:51:14Z")
[QUOTE=lowbrass] Heck, I saw an ad where they wanted “copying” experience. Hmmm…you put the paper on the glass and you press the button. Yep - I think I can handle that. [/QUOTE] You’d think anyone could, but surprisingly, no. ---
**Author:** ![TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/51bf81/32.png) [@TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/64 "2007-05-23T23:29:18Z")
[QUOTE=Nava] Nonononono. See, this is the Pit. In any other forum, we’d be telling you to “market yourself up.” See the difference? Don’t ever lie, “a liar gets caught sooner than a one-legged runner.” But if you can claim to have “managed a lab”, do claim it. After all, 90% of the people in the hiring side have no idea what are the duties of a lab manager: if you say “distributed work stations and supplies, handled purchasing of equipment and materials, prepared and updated work procedures, trained coworkers” and list the rest of the stuff that a lab manager does and which I’ve done at jobs with other titles, they’ll file it under “lab drudge”. No, no, lab _manager_. Make sure to get the right keywords in, etc. You’re out to sell yourself, so do what anybody with a product does: market it! [/QUOTE] Didn’t some guy make a thread a while ago about how he had gotten his job under false pretenses, and he was questioning whether or not to come clean? ---
**Author:** ![TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/51bf81/32.png) [@TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TLDRIDKJKLOLFTW)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/65 "2007-05-23T23:46:02Z")
Spinoff thread: [What are the craziest/stupidest job classifieds you’ve seen?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=8606020#post8606020) ---
**Author:** ![neorxnawange](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f4b2a3/32.png) [@neorxnawange](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/neorxnawange)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2007, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/66 "2007-05-23T23:49:26Z")
My advice is this: Look at the job description and ignore any “years experience” requirements that are listed, also don’t worry about any software requirements that are listed. Next ask yourself if you think you are capable of doing the job, if yes then apply, and count years of education and working other jobs that have any relation to the new job as experience. The fact of the matter is that people grossly overestimate what it takes to do their own job, and managers are even worse about overestimating what it takes to a job they are hiring for. Its human nature, nobody wants to admit that they really aren’t that special. This seems to be especially true for software requirements in want ads. I took a job 4 years ago which the want ad said required at least 5 years experience in SAP. I had no experience in SAP so I lied and said I was familiar with it. I was hired and on the second day I learned enough about SAP in a one hour training session to effectively do my job. Funny thing is, now I can honestly say I have 3 years experience in SAP, even though I basically only know how to a couple of very simple operations. Experience requirements are crap. ---
**Author:** ![lowbrass](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dc4da7/32.png) [@lowbrass](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lowbrass)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 6:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/67 "2007-05-24T06:15:15Z")
[QUOTE=gigi] You’d think anyone could, but surprisingly, no. [/QUOTE] Hmmm…maybe they were smarter than I thought. Anyone who is stupid enough not to just lie and say they have “copying experience” probably ought to be weeded out anyway. ---
**Author:** ![kung\_fu\_lola](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/f4b2a3/32.png) [@kung\_fu\_lola](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kung_fu_lola)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 6:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/68 "2007-05-24T06:26:32Z")
[QUOTE=Rigamarole] That is so not true, and I resent your implication. Bisexual brunette women with large breasts would be perfectly good candidates in such a scenario as well. [/QUOTE] SCORE!!! So, when do I start? srsly, I have a great rack. Just ask **montrealais** , he’s taken it for a test drive or two ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/69 "2007-05-24T11:01:53Z")
[QUOTE=kung fu lola] SCORE!!! So, when do I start? srsly, I have a great rack. Just ask **montrealais** , he’s taken it for a test drive or two [/QUOTE] That depends… how fast can you organise an Australian visa? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 11:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/70 "2007-05-24T11:12:09Z")
[QUOTE=Spectre of Pithecanthropus] I’m astonished that they can list age as a qualification. That is strictly verboten (oops, sorry **Nava** 🙂 ) in the U.S., although that doesn’t mean that one’s age can’t be a factor in the private thoughts of the person who makes the hiring decision. [/QUOTE] As part of our Magnificent and Splendorous Youth-Job-Promoting Law, from the previous bout of Socialist Governing, companies pay less SS tax for an employee below age 25. Yes, this has led to people been fired from menial jobs as soon as they’re over 24 years and 364 days old. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/71 "2007-05-24T13:53:32Z")
[QUOTE=Rigamarole] That is so not true, and I resent your implication. Bisexual brunette women with large breasts would be perfectly good candidates in such a scenario as well. [/QUOTE] woohoo! gee, I should be commanding a better salary. ---
**Author:** ![5\_time\_champ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/278dde/32.png) [@5\_time\_champ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/5_time_champ)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/72 "2007-05-24T20:03:46Z")
[QUOTE=Kimstu] [Straight to the source](http://federaljobs.net/federal_jobs_opening.htm). [/QUOTE] Heh. > [@](#): > > Attorney Positions (Dept. of Justice) is listed third. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [May 24, 2007, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/73 "2007-05-24T20:19:59Z")
[QUOTE=Little Plastic Ninja] woohoo! gee, I should be commanding a better salary. [/QUOTE] When I start my own ludicrously successful business, the first thing I’ll do is populate the office with [little plastic ninjas](http://www.thinkgeek.com/geektoys/plush/70d9/images/). ---
**Author:** ![billyb0b](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7ea924/32.png) [@billyb0b](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/billyb0b)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/74 "2007-05-25T02:36:51Z")
[QUOTE=Lumpy] And have experience. [/QUOTE] HAHAHA! I laughed out loud at that. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/75 "2007-05-25T02:53:13Z")
[QUOTE=Nava] Don’t ever lie, “a liar gets caught sooner than a one-legged runner.” [/QUOTE] I am convinced this is a myth spread by HR types and management wonks. If you believe the book _Freakonomics_, [50% of people lie on their resumes](http://content.monster.com/articles/3475/17197/1/default.aspx). I doubt that even .001% get caught. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Long\_Road](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b5a626/32.png) [@The\_Long\_Road](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Long_Road)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/76 "2007-05-25T03:24:24Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] I am convinced this is a myth spread by HR types and management wonks. If you believe the book _Freakonomics_, [50% of people lie on their resumes](http://content.monster.com/articles/3475/17197/1/default.aspx). I doubt that even .001% get caught. [/QUOTE] I’d think it depends on the lie. Nava has a good point. If you can do the job, you should be able to get away with claiming that as a former job title. If you can’t do the job or inflate your job title to more than you really know, it could quickly become evident that you can’t perform tasks you said you could. Inflating your salary a bit or claiming to be a network administrator when you took care of many of those duties while never having held the title should be ok. I cringe thinking about some of the flatout bullshit I’ve put on past resumes. Over the years I’ve gone from a mechanical engineer to being a banker where I’ve found my niche so I’m sure plenty of bullshit was involved along the way. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 9:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/77 "2007-05-25T09:39:37Z")
[QUOTE=Fear Itself] I am convinced this is a myth spread by HR types and management wonks. If you believe the book _Freakonomics_, [50% of people lie on their resumes](http://content.monster.com/articles/3475/17197/1/default.aspx). I doubt that even .001% get caught. [/QUOTE] Not at the time of the interview; most resumes don’t even get an interview. But by the person who’s training Mr Perfect? Oh yes. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/78 "2007-05-25T11:03:46Z")
[QUOTE=Nava] Not at the time of the interview; most resumes don’t even get an interview. [/QUOTE] Think about it; 50% of the people who are hired by submitting a resume lied. I stand by my statement. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/79 "2007-05-25T13:42:03Z")
Downside to cheating. If the person interviewing you is halfway intelligent, it’s not that difficult to catch a lot of the lies. I’ve seen people make up shit all the time. I used to interview English teacher candidate for a friend, and would get people lying about experience. Everyone would claim on resumes to have volunteered teaching back in their home counties. When I’d ask detailed questions, the bad liars would get the deer in the headlight look, and the better liars would give bogus answers, but a few questions can usually shake out a lot. And yes, any time someone claimed relevant experience from an “out of business” company, it would raise red flags. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [May 25, 2007, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042/80 "2007-05-25T14:17:33Z")
[QUOTE=TokyoPlayer] And yes, any time someone claimed relevant experience from an “out of business” company, it would raise red flags. [/QUOTE] Of the six companies I worked for in my 13 years in the computer game business, only one is still in business. So much for your theory. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/experience-required-experience-required-experience-required/405042.md?page=5)