I work in events. A lot of the pricing is set at the level it is because many events are corporate and either the company is fine with the set up fee, or they provide enough repeat business to make the fees worth negotiating. That’s capitalism at work – it’s what the market will bear.
I used to work at a facility that offered events AT COST (no profit) to employees as a benefit. Even with this, it was amazing to many people that costs were higher than expected. We knew exactly what the “turn key” cost was – the cost based on what the facility spent to turn the key and open the door, before there was any food served at all. We knew what our electric bill was per hour, for example. What it cost to have the cleaning staff prepare the room. The additional staff needed in the kitchen to prepare for a event. (You need more people to make a lot of food to be served at once as opposed to food served over the course of a restaurant night when orders are staggered, even if the ultimate quantity of the food is comparable.) Deliveries for a large party often need to happen outside of the regular food delivery schedule, and the additional costs for that need to be made up.
Personal events are always much more demanding on staff than corporate events, in my experience, mostly because corporate events tend to be organized by a person who has done it often and knows the drill. The staff time needed to arrange a personal event grows and grows, because most people don’t do it often so they need more assistance, and they tend to have more specialized requests.
So yeah, it’s a combo – a lot of these fees are to ensure that the place makes a profit, because that is why businesses exist. But the base cost is higher than many people realize.
Here’s how it worked when I was a server lo these many years ago:
As you noted in your last post, at many restaurants, they don’t have dedicated banquet space. They simply cordon off a section of the restaurant that would otherwise be used for regular patrons. So you’re monopolizing that part of the restaurant for however long your party is there, plus the time it takes them to arrange the tables, set up the buffet and bar, and do all the breakdown and cleanup afterward. This could effectively be the whole night.
This part, I don’t get what you don’t get. It’s a buffet, so presumably, you want all of your guests to at least have the option of eating the appetizer, main course, and dessert, even if they don’t choose to. So the restaurant has to prepare enough of everything for everyone. They also have to have it all ready for all 50 people at the same time, which would never happen in a normal restaurant.
Yes, because they’re probably going to set up an additional bar just for your party, with at least one bartender serving you alone. (If they don’t, then yes, that may be an unnecessary charge.)
Look at it this way: yes, you’re probably going to have a lower server-to-guest ratio than in normal restaurant service. But with a buffet, you can still get restaurant-level service with fewer servers. Remember, even though they don’t have to bring the plates from the kitchen to your table, they probably still have to do everything else a normal server would do - clear plates, bring drinks, etc. - as well as the million little requests they’ll get. Guests at a restaurant party always to want to make the most of the experience, it seems. They want to feel like they’re VIPs, not just ordinary restaurant patrons in another room, so they tend to be a bit higher-maintenance. Besides that, your servers will also likely be the ones responsible for setting up the tables and the buffet, keeping the food refilled, and possibly doing individual service (if it’s not a serve-yourself buffet). Also, like your bartender, your servers will probably be serving you alone. So, just like the restaurant can’t make any additional money off those tables while you’re there, your servers can’t make any additional tips.
And as for the cash vs. charge tip: when I was a server, I worked at a restaurant that participated in an IRS compliance program. All our sales were recorded electronically, regardless of how they were paid for, and naturally, there was also a record of our charge tips. The only remaining variable was the cash tips, so at the end of the night, we had to enter those into the computer ourselves. Of course, we could always enter less than we actually earned, but the system was regularly audited. So if we were making, say, about 20% on our charge tips, and only 10% on our cash tips, it would certainly get noticed. There were one or two people who would break out the calculator every night and figure out how much they could skim and still make it look plausible, but most of us just entered the correct amount, because it wasn’t worth the hassle to save the tax on a few bucks here and there. I’m sure that plenty of restaurants don’t participate in this program (if it’s still voluntary), and that plenty of servers take the risk anyway. But suffice it to say, unfortunately, your cash tips may not be doing anyone any favors anyway. If you really want to help them out, slip them each a couple of bucks on top of the 20%.
I’m not so sure that’s a good assumption. The restaurants I’ve been to with private rooms use those tables for ordinary customers when the rooms are not booked for a party. Even though they really are separate rooms, not just a cordoned off space.
And about the food- I’ve more than once been to a restaurant where they ran out of a particular item. They can’t really take a chance on this with a buffet. They can’t say " a serving of rice is 1/2 cup and there are 50 people so we’ll make 25 cups." They’ll have to prepare at least a little extra for each dish and possibly more than you would expect. They have to do a little bit of this even with a non-buffet dinner especially if there is a choice of entrees, but at a non-buffet they don’t need to worry about people with large appetites taking two servings of something before everyone has been fed. You can avoid this by having servers at the buffet rather than having people help themselves , but then you’ll need as much staff as a plated dinner - some to serve the food and others to clear tables, etc.
A banquet has additional costs in staff and utilities. The space is used for only one sitting. They also have to order food just for the event. Restaurants otherwise run a risky business, a slow night will be a loss already. They don’t want to book a risky event on top of the risk they’re already running. The prices you are charged guarantee a reasonable profit. The prices are no different than you’d find at a restaurant doing so well they’re available on a reservation only basis. You can always negotiate and shop around, but in the end, you’ll get what you pay for.
No, it’s a separate room that would otherwise be used by some other banquet. You’re in a different market now: obviously, the demand for banquet rooms is much smaller than for seats at a restaurant, but so is the supply. It’s not a matter of sell it to you, or to nobody: it’s a matter of sell it to you, or some other group. The pricing structure they’ve figured out is one that is most likely to lead to the banquet room being used every weekend.
If there are very many weekends at all when they are sitting there idle, then they can’t make a profit going any lower: if they could, they would, and sell more.
And it’s almost always being booked for a Fri or Sat, when the restaurant is already busy. If your event (and it happens) fails to be as big or popular as you imagine, it has actually cost them to accommodate your party. They charge, in line with, what the space would have profited them, had they used it for overflow from their busy night.
There are a lot of ways for a restaurant to get bit in the ass on large parties. The people hosting just see that, “Well I’m bringing in 50 customers at one time!” and expect the restaurant to absorb any and all costs out of gratitude. And many start out doing just that. But any that get good at it, and stick with it, develop protocols and pricing structures such as you’re encountering.
A quick check with the competition, should reveal if it’s standard and in line with demand in your area or not.
But people unaccustomed to arranging such things, just assume they should be treated like royalty and given lots of freebie extras, the place should absorb any costs they’ve failed to consider, all because, “I’m bringing 50 people!”
First, what I wanted when I started this threat was to be convinced that these charges, which I had thought were unreasonable, were in fact due to things that I had not considered. And it seems that this is so. This allows me to be satisfied that I am not being ripped off, and I now am. And I was definitely one of those people who thought I was doing the restaurant a big favor by bringing in 50 guests.
I am very unhappy to hear that tipping in cash brings almost no benefits. My strategy now will be to leave a 10% tip via credit card, and 10% in cash.
Actually it does benefit some when you tip in cash. Some restaurants make the servers wait a few days to get their charge card tips, making sure they clear or something. Sometimes restaurants use the opportunity to ding them for things like breakage (real or imagined) or just a cut for the house. Servers do appreciate being tipped in cash. You should do what you feel, servers are nothing, if not accommodating.
I am just organising an office Christmas party for 70 people. When I was researching venues, I found similar things to the OP. Some venues wanted a room hire fee on top of the food costs, most added a compulsory service charge (to be fair, this is very common for parties of 6/8 or more, though seeing as I am in the UK 10% is the usual figure). If one of the venues charging for room hire had been one I really wanted, I would have opened negotiations with the venue and asked them to move on it, given the event is on a Friday night and we will no doubt be buying a lot of drinks. As it was, the venue I wanted did not have a hire charge, was cheaper than the others, and has been very flexible about the numbers attending (they did not even require a deposit - just my credit card details to secure the booking, then full payment on the night for everyone who turns up - except cancellations with less than 48 hours notices will be charged a fee of £10 (so not even full price). So it does vary, and it’s worth shopping around - obviously it will be different in different parts of the world.
Regarding tips, some restaurants keep a proportion of the service charge if you pay it on a card, so unless it’s impossible to do so I always try to tip in cash and ask them to remove the service charge from the bill.
I’ve worked in service 30yrs and never heard of a restaurant where the servers pool their tips. Guess that doesn’t apply around here. I would never take such a position. It may be the future though, who knows?
I think it’s pretty common now in the US. Taxing tips may have led to this in the 80s. I would have thought servers would object, but apparently a lot of them like the idea. Maybe because the lousy ones make more that way.
Exactly. You’d only draw shitty servers not pros. Good servers will always go where they get their own tips, not share with the crappier servers. Three bartenders working one bar, is a different thing of course, that often happens. But the floor staff? It wouldn’t fly around here. Owners would know they wouldn’t be getting top drawer servers, only the dreggs.
So what do the restaurant chains such as Chili’s, TGIF, Outback, Macaroni Grill do? These are the places to which we usually go. Do they pool their tips? Let’s hear from people who have worked there.
You’re going to be hanging around there far longer than average diners would. Without appearing to rush patrons, restaurants need to have them eat and leave so the table can be used again.
In the time your group is going to occupying their building, they could probably turn over a few times as many seats as your guests will be taking up.
Shitty servers stay around just long enough to torpedo a restaurant’s Yelp rating, awesome servers go to the high ticket places and make bank. There are waiting lists just for the chance of replacing a waiter in NY. Yeah, they practically auction off their position. This is very rare, but it happens.
I really don’t think the OP is of the mindset of “How dare they make a profit form me”, but I see where she might feel overcharged. Yes she is bringing in a lot of people, but the venue is saying “great, we’ll do it but you gotta pay more than you thought”.
The bottom line is, if the price (or price/person) is in line with what you want to spend, then do it. Otherwise, you can get a ton for not much if you look in the right places.
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