# Explain Firefly **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 16, 2004, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421 "2004-07-16T14:58:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/81 "2004-07-20T00:00:46Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > And we’re supposed to accept that insane people can form self-sustaining communities, keep spaceships in working order, etc.? I found that to be a bit of a stretch. Not that it detracted too much from the show, it’s just a nitpick. I don’t think there was nearly enough information on what the Reavers were, where they came from, etc. to make many conclusions about how plausible they were. All we got from the series was the foreshadowing: some passing references, one close call, and one victim. We have the lore about what the Reavers were like, but we never really even saw one in the flesh, excepting the guy who had been turned into one. It’s clear that Joss had big plans for the Reavers somewhere down the line. It could even be that there’s a rational explanation behind their seemingly irrational behaviors. The sad fact is, thanks to the truncated life of the series, there are a lot of things you can’t really criticize, because we haven’t had the full story yet. It’d be like watching _Fellowship of the Rings_ and complaining that they didn’t resolve the One Ring plot line at the end. I feel the same way about calling the blue hands guys “one-dimensional” villains, because Whedon never had a chance to give them any more dimensions. The show was killed before he could develop them fully. I also suspect that at some point we were going to somehow be given a more sympathetic insight into the Reavers. _Firefly_ is a space Western, and one of the common elements of the original Western genre was Indians as bloodthirsty, uncivilized savages. It wasn’t until the sixties and seventies that we got the other side of the coin in Westerns: the Indian as wise and oppressed and slightly magical. (Which, really, was not a huge improvement. Well, I suppose being patronized is better than being demonized, but neither is exactly a positive thing.) The Reavers were clearly Whedon’s stand in for the earlier “blood thirsty savages”, and I wouldn’t put it past him to try to transform his “Indians” in exactly the same way over the course of the series. Plus, he knows his audience has a great appreciation for characters who are completely and violently immoral, so long as they’re hot. Exhibit A being Spike from _Buffy_ and _Angel_. ---
**Author:** ![Ethilrist](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ethilrist/32/4604_2.png) [@Ethilrist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ethilrist)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/82 "2004-07-20T13:14:45Z")
Also bear in mind re: reavers, my major WAG spoiler: Malcolm’s a high-functioning reaver. Listen to everything he says about what makes men turn into Reavers, then listen to everything he and Zoe say about what it was like in the battle of Serenity. It’s all the same stuff, but he’s just doing a better job of dealing with it. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/83 "2004-07-20T13:44:04Z")
This series just didn’t hook me like it does others. Though the same thing can be said about Buffy - I fit their demographic almost exactly, and yet somehow I just can’t get into them. Having said that, I watched _Firefly_ and was at least mostly entertained. Many of the characters are very likeable (Kaylee, Wash, River, Book) and the dynamic between them all is extremely realistic. Plus I am curious about the arc involving River, and for that reason my favourite episode is _Objects In Space_ (the one with the bounty hunter who boards the ship to get River, who vanishes). My least favourite ep is _Heart of Gold_ which is painfully awful in every way. ---
**Author:** ![peritrochoid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@peritrochoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peritrochoid)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/84 "2004-07-20T15:02:45Z")
I was just introduced to this series about a week ago by a couple of friends. I’ve never been into many of the shows they enjoy, like _Farscape_, _Star Trek_ (and its spawns), etc., so I had my doubts about _Firefly_. HOLY SMOKES, was I wrong! Nearly everyone here has mentioned the character-centric nature of the show, and the dialog and one-liners are spectacular. I only got to see the true pilot episode, but I’m already hooked and ready to see the rest. I have a tendency to really enjoy the shows many of the networks don’t keep long, like _Sports Night_, _Strange Luck_, and this one, to name a few … all of which are among the most intelligently put-together shows. ---
**Author:** ![DeadlyAccurate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ac91a4/32.png) [@DeadlyAccurate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DeadlyAccurate)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/85 "2004-07-20T15:04:14Z")
I love _Heart of Gold_ for this exchange alone: ZOE Those who have a mind are welcome to join. Those who just as soon stay on the ship can do that, too. JAYNE Don’t much see the benefit in getting involved in strangers’ troubles without a upfront price negotiated. BOOK These people need assistance. The benefit wouldn’t necessarily be for you. JAYNE S’what I’m sayin’ ZOE No one’s gonna force you to go, Jayne. As has been stated – this job’s strictly speculative. JAYNE Good. 'cause I don’t know these folks. Don’t much care to. MAL They’re whores. JAYNE I’m in. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/86 "2004-07-20T15:16:21Z")
> [@GuanoLad](#): > > My least favourite ep is _Heart of Gold_ which is painfully awful in every way. I was gonna mention the exchange quoted by **DeadlyAccurate** in support of HoG, along with the matter-of-fact acceptance of homosexuality in the ep (the madam asks if Mal is “sly” and offers him a boy-whore and he says he isn’t and is totally non-threatened by the suggestion that he is, plus I like the word “sly”) which differs significantly from the soft-core something for the adolescent male viewers of Inara and the Commissioner from “War Stories.” That said, while HoG isn’t my least favorite ep (that dubious honor being reserved for the steaming pile of _go se_ that is “The Message”), it doesn’t rank very high. ---
**Author:** ![Jenny\_Haniver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Jenny\_Haniver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jenny_Haniver)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/87 "2004-07-20T15:28:55Z")
> [@Ethilrist](#): > > No, they left all the stuff behind on the ship that got hit by Reavers. But you’re forgetting - that ship was bait. They set a trap to hold the salvaging ship there for them - and they were recruiting. So, if it had worked, they would have had two more ships and at least one spankin’ new Reaver when they were done. ---
**Author:** ![Misnomer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/misnomer/32/14897_2.png) [@Misnomer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Misnomer)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/88 "2004-07-20T20:36:23Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > There is a clip of Whedon singing the theme song. > Do _ **NOT** _ watch it. > 🙂 But **DO** watch the clip of Adam Baldwin singing _The Ballad of Jayne_…priceless. 😃 I recently read something that disturbs me greatly: I saw it on [darkhorizons.com](http://darkhorizons.com), but it was originally posted on the _Serenity_ board by [this guy](http://fireflydvd.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=2455#2455), who was an extra on the movie set: > [@](#): > > _At one point I overheard a discussion about how Universal is planning on releasing an animated prequel to Serenity that will fill in the details between the end of the series and the movie._ I’m sorry, did he just say _animated prequel_? :eek: No one has really commented on it over on the _Serenity_ board, except for one freak who thinks it’s good news. _Animated_? Would Joss ever really OK that? Am I the only one who thinks it would be a horrible, horrible thing? ---
**Author:** ![Teelo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8491ac/32.png) [@Teelo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Teelo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/89 "2004-07-20T20:42:48Z")
In ‘Objects in Space’ an unusual but funny conversation between Simon and the Bounty hunter Jewbul Early. Simon: Are you Alliance? Early: Am I a Lion? No, I don’t think of myself as a Lion, I like to roar sometim– Simon: No, I said are you with the Alliance? Early: Oh, I thought you said…hmm…that was weird. _Simon is completely dumbstruck as to what he is dealing with._ Jewbul Early didnt get out much did he? Later on in that episode was a great cliche crasher: Simon pounces on Early in a last attempt to stop him from getting to his ship, Jayne whose bunk is right underneath is startled at the noise of people fighting, tears down a blanket revealing several high calibre short range guns and weapons…only to take the blanket and wrap himself up and go back to sleep. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/90 "2004-07-20T20:56:28Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > I’m sorry, did he just say _animated prequel_? :eek: No one has really commented on it over on the _Serenity_ board, except for one freak who thinks it’s good news. _Animated_? Would Joss ever really OK that? Am I the only one who thinks it would be a horrible, horrible thing? Odd that Google can’t find anything about a prequel except for references to the guy whom you quoted. Maybe he was the victim of a practical joke. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/91 "2004-07-20T21:25:43Z")
> [@threeorange](#): > > That’s it. I must see this show. Be warned, I think that particular episode was directed by Quenton Tarentino. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/92 "2004-07-20T21:25:44Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > I’m sorry, did he just say _animated prequel_? :eek: No one has really commented on it over on the _Serenity_ board, except for one freak who thinks it’s good news. _Animated_? Would Joss ever really OK that? Am I the only one who thinks it would be a horrible, horrible thing? Sounds really unlikely to me, but I think it would be pretty kick-ass if it were true. What’s wrong with it being animated? They could get the regular cast to do the voices, I assume. This could be a great way to get more Firefly material out there faster: they could work on two movies at the same time. The cast works on set in the live action version while a team of animators work on the cartoon version. Sounds win-win to me. But, I’d be very surprised if there’s anything behind this rumor. No way they could keep something like this under wraps, and I can’t fathom why they’d want to in the first place. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/93 "2004-07-20T23:15:09Z")
> [@Misnomer](#): > > But **DO** watch the clip of Adam Baldwin singing _The Ballad of Jayne_…priceless. 😃 The blooper reel is quite good, too, though it’s not as good as the extended version I found online. You remember the show where the crew ends up with the supposedly dead body of one of Mal and Zoe’s old friends? There’s a very solemn and serious scene in that show where they’re all standing around the body listening to his final recorded message. The camera pans around in a circle to catch everyone’s very serious, solemn faces before panning down to the body. Anyhoo, in the blooper reel I found, there’s a slightly different version of that scene. Malcom keeps running around behind the camera to get back in the circle whenever the camera goes off him, so as the camera pans around, he’s in the circle about five or six times, each time with a cheesier serious look on his face. Everyone else, of course, has a harder and harder time keeping a straight face as it goes on. Finally, when the camera pans down to the body, you see Malcolm lying on top of it, staring intently at its face, and everyone cracks up. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/94 "2004-07-20T23:20:46Z")
> [@Teelo](#): > > Simon pounces on Early in a last attempt to stop him from getting to his ship, Jayne whose bunk is right underneath is startled at the noise of people fighting, tears down a blanket revealing several high calibre short range guns and weapons…only to take the blanket and wrap himself up and go back to sleep. Remember, too, that earlier in that episode Jayne swore up and down like the most injured of innocents that he his guns were under lock and key and that River’s getting her hands on one was just one more piece of proof of here pyscho-wacky dangerous abilities. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/95 "2004-07-20T23:30:00Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Finally, when the camera pans down to the body, you see Malcolm lying on top of it, staring intently at its face Actually, it’s even better than that (just checked my copy), Nathan’s looking off to the side, and Jonathan’s snuggling his head, making little sleepy lipsmackies. ---
**Author:** ![Kamino\_Neko](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kamino_neko/32/34_2.png) [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2004, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/96 "2004-07-20T23:32:00Z")
BTW, I almost feel like I’m picking on you, Smeghead. I assure you that’s not the case. ---
**Author:** ![ladybug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/46a35a/32.png) [@ladybug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ladybug)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2004, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/97 "2004-07-21T00:30:01Z")
I let my brother borrow disc one of my Firefly DVDs a few weeks ago. Today I got this e-mail from him: _Watched Firefly. Damn it, now I have to buy the friggin box set!_ Another convert joins the ranks. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2004, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/98 "2004-07-21T00:30:58Z")
> [@Tengu](#): > > BTW, I almost feel like I’m picking on you, Smeghead. I assure you that’s not the case. Don’t MAKE me get my chain of command! ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2004, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/99 "2004-07-21T01:30:57Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > Don’t MAKE me get my chain of command! Good gad man, you’re quoting Jayne, who cursed because a stun gun wouldn’t blow a door open. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![ArrMatey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/arrmatey/32/3522_2.png) [@ArrMatey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ArrMatey)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2004, 1:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421/100 "2004-07-21T01:38:03Z")
> [@Draelin](#): > > My all-time favorite example of this comes from “The Train Job” (which is the second episode on the DVDs, gods only know what order Fox showed them in): Captain Mal tries to reason with a big tough guy and his minions. Tough Guy more or less spits in his face. What to do? Well, if you’re Mal, you kick him into the engine’s intake (which makes a really satisfying sound) and move to the next guy in line, maybe he’ll cooperate. This was the moment for me. I’m listening to the contest of words, and my friends (who had sat me down to watch the series) were waiting, watching for my reaction. Apparently, after the WHOOMP noise, I just sat there, jaw agape, stunned for about a minute and a half. That scene, man… Just rocked. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-firefly/255421.md?page=6)