# Explain the 'Catholics aren't Christian' thing again? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 15, 2016, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812 "2016-12-15T21:34:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2016, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/81 "2016-12-18T19:04:46Z")
> [@Sangahyando](#): > > – many humane and sensible folk. I thought they were Irish. _rimshot_ ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2016, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/82 "2016-12-18T19:08:08Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > I go further. As I posted above, I would say that anyone who puts Christ, or the words and teachings of Christ, at the center of his or her life (or at least near the center) is a Christian, even if that person doesn’t believe in the Resurrection, or in Christ’s divinity. And that includes deists, or even atheists. You are correct that you are going further, but I’m not sure how you gleaned that from my posts, as all I said was that I consider JWs and Mormons to still be Christians. I think that the teachings of Christ inherently include a God and a Messiah. The word “Christ” refers to a Messiah, and the concept of a Messiah depends on the existence of a god–as Messiah means “anointed one” and God is the one who anoints him. In short, those who follow the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth but do not believe he is the Christ are not Christians. Sure, I won’t get into some huge argument with them. I have at least one friend of that persuasion, and she lists herself as a “Liberal Christian.” If she wants to call herself such, that’s fine with me. I won’t get into a purely semantic argument. But, yeah, I don’t agree you can be a Christian atheist. Deism is technically possible, if you think the Creator God annointed a Messiah before ceasing his interaction with the universe, so I do allow the term. Though I’m not sure what prominent Deists like Thomas Jefferson actually believed in regard to this. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/83 "2016-12-18T19:44:03Z")
> [@Princhester](#): > > I don’t think it’s ironic. I think rather that firstly the idea that modern secularism is “Protestantism with the serial number filed off” is of highly dubious validity. Secondly, the sort of Protestantism that most resembles the socially liberal ideas that tend to be associated with modern secularism has little in common with “Bible literalist Protestantism” which tends to be socially highly conservative. > [@Corry\_El](#): > > Well we disagree. And my point IMO is not disproved by pointing out the obvious fact that mainline Protestants approaching de facto atheism and funadmentalist Protestants came to very different endpoints. Yeah, but they had the process in common of ‘just interpret the scriptures yourself, and if a bunch of people agree with you, start a new sect’. IMO the key point here being that the word “Protestant”, at least in the US, covers two almost diametrically opposed camps of belief. **Princhester** ’s an Aussie. Where AFAIK fundamentalism is a tiny minority and “Protestant” pretty much means exclusively the Lutherans, Episcopals, Methodists, etc. Would that that were true in the US. Making allowance for that difference … I think it’s partly valid to say “Modern secularism is non-fundamentalist Protestantism with the serial number filed off”. But the label only makes sense to a non-fundamentalist Protestant who wants to view secularism as an offshoot of their tradition, a wayward child forgetting Jesus and so doing the right thing for the wrong reason. A child perhaps redeemable back into the fold. For those of us, such as myself, who start from the modern secularist POV that gets the causation exactly backwards. From this end of the telescope it’s far more valid to say “Non-fundamentalist Protestantism is modern secularism with some unnecessary historical Jesus-baggage grafted on.” That baggage was installed for backwards compatibility reasons in the 1600s and perhaps soon they’ll finish learning to do without it. In other words, it’s the non-fundamentalist protestants who’re the wayward children doing the right thing for the wrong reason. IOW, the baggage did come historically first, but is not logically first. The baggage is not a precondition to the humanist ethics embodied in secularism and some parts of NT Jesus-ism. In either case the fundamentalist Protestants aren’t part of the discussion. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2016, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/84 "2016-12-18T20:47:56Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > That’s the Catholic claim, but other people say that if you pray to a being then the act of prayer is a form of worship that means you’re treating them as a god or goddess. \ Dude, as I have said before, Mary has been The Goddess since before that Sumerian storm god, Yahweh, threw his first lightning bolt. > [@Corry\_El](#): > > \*an example list, to summarize the vast majority though not all Protestant, proper, sects you’ve ever heard of’s baptisms are recognized by RCC. A few edgy Protestant-proper sects’ aren’t, the Mormons, Jehovah’s Witnesses (who we might also lump with Protestants but Protestants probably don’t) aren’t etc. > [http://www.dob-tribunal.com/uploads/4/4/8/1/44818299/validity-of-baptisms-and-confirmation.pdf](http://www.dob-tribunal.com/uploads/4/4/8/1/44818299/validity-of-baptisms-and-confirmation.pdf) We don’t. Have you ever read their beliefs? Muslims are closer. > [@Guinastasia](#): > > [Cultural Christian](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cultural_Christian) I have a name! More like Cultural Catholic, but it’s a start. ---
**Author:** ![Alley\_Dweller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alley_dweller/32/430_2.png) [@Alley\_Dweller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alley_Dweller)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2016, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/85 "2016-12-18T22:30:54Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Because said asking doesn’t take the form of a prayer. Nothing in the Bible indicates those people can hear your prayers. > > Sure, God can hear you, since he’s both omniscient and omnipresent. But can the saints? They don’t get their new bodies until after the Resurrection of the Saints. And the description of heaven doesn’t sound like they are constantly looking down at Earth, or else they’d see all the horrible stuff and not be happy. Catholics do find justification in the Scriptures for the notion that saints hear prayers and are aware of what goes on back on earth. [This is perhaps the best summary I could find of it.](http://www.aggiecatholicblog.org/2011/12/can-the-saints-hear-us/) ---
**Author:** ![hibernicus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hibernicus/32/2802_2.png) [@hibernicus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hibernicus)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/86 "2016-12-19T00:59:27Z")
> [@Sangahyando](#): > > For sure; my observation re Northern Ireland, was largely in jest. It’s just that as regards the British Isles nowadays, one has the impression that instances of Protestant extremists / groups thereof, harbouring an incandescent hatred of all things Catholic, occasionally to the point of physical violence, are rare: and that if such are met with, it’s most likely to be among highly extreme Presbyterians in certain “fringe” areas – both geographical and ideological – of Northern Ireland. You are right of course - those are the ones that I had in mind when I referred to “those who shout the loudest”. But I do think it’s interesting and perhaps under-appreciated that the term “Presbyterian” in Ireland encompasses a very wide spectrum from Paisleyite Free Presbyterians in Ballymena to Non-subscribing Presbyterians of Rosemary Street church in Belfast. It wan’t my intention to take issue with your comment but to add to it. [Here’s](http://www.presbyterianireland.org/News/November-2016/Pope-s-anticipated-visit-to-Ireland.aspx) a statement from the Presbyterian Church in Ireland welcoming the planned visit of Pope Francis to Ireland. Not what one might expect from a bunch of Catholic-haters! ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/87 "2016-12-19T01:52:46Z")
My SIL is convinced that the Catholic Church is the Scarlet Whore of Babylon referenced in the Bible. Why? Well, just Google the terms and you’ll find a few results. And some guy wrote a book about it. ---
**Author:** ![BwanaBob](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bwanabob/32/2985_2.png) [@BwanaBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BwanaBob)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/88 "2016-12-19T13:42:39Z")
It seems to me that many Protestant churches really get into the “God as punisher” angle which is very Old Testament rather than “God is Love” angle of the New Testament. But note that they are called Old and New Testaments, not 1st and 2nd. New supercedes old as far as I’m concerned. So if I see any apparent contradiction, New wins. Also, didn’t the Catholic Bible exist before any Protestant Bible? So, how can they point fingers at the Catholic version as incorrect? You don’t get to edit my book and then tell me I don’t have the original. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/89 "2016-12-19T15:19:47Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > Well, we do believe in a hierarchical church, and we believe that God meant it to be that way. And when Jesus said to Peter “And I tell you that you are Peter, and on this rock I will build my church, and the gates of Hades will not overcome it,” He meant that Peter was head of the Church, and the first Pope. There’s scriptural support for the papacy. I think the bigger problem leading to people thinking the RCC is not Christian is not exactly the existence of the papacy, although it does affect things, but the teaching authority of the papacy vs. the single authority of Scripture. There are things like the [assumption of Mary both body and soul into heaven](http://w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/en/apost_constitutions/documents/hf_p-xii_apc_19501101_munificentissimus-deus.html), which are defined as dogma and therefore obligatory, and are defined by the Pope as equally authoritative as Scripture. > [@](#): > > We do not. We do, however believe in intercessory prayer, and we pray to Mary. We do not believe she is divine. We believe she was human. > > We do pray to saints (just like we pray to Mary). I don’t think we’d call them “mediators.” I understand that Roman Catholics are not supposed to pray for saints and Mary to act directly, but to intervene for them with God. In practice, sometimes this shades off into requests made directly to the saints/Mary. The distinction is clear in theory, but not always in practice. And I am not sure if it is official teaching, but Mary is the [Mediatrix of all graces and even has been referred to as Co-redemptrix](http://www.catholic.org/featured/headline.php?ID=5154). To outsiders, that sounds bad, even if the RC church has what they consider a sound explanation. I for one wouldn’t say that this means Roman Catholics aren’t Christian, but ISTM that at least some of the confusion is understandable. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2016, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/90 "2016-12-19T15:54:17Z")
It is true that Catholics consider Mary to be in some ways qualitatively different from all other saints, and in fact she’s considered to be the fourth-most-exalted person in Heaven (after only the Trinity). But that’s still an awfully big step from the Trinity to Our Lady. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/91 "2016-12-20T00:00:33Z")
Yeah, but you tell her that her kid doesn’t have to do what she says. He tried that once at Cana, but she gave Him that look and He changed His tune with a grudging, “Yes, Mom.” ---
**Author:** ![UDS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecae2f/32.png) [@UDS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UDS)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/92 "2016-12-20T00:49:41Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > . . . I for one wouldn’t say that this means Roman Catholics aren’t Christian, but ISTM that at least some of the confusion is understandable. Confusion _is_ understandable, but “I don’t understand the beliefs of those Christians over there; therefore they are not Christians at all” is a bit of a stretch. The Catholics have been accused, with some justification, of arrogance over the whole “one true church” schtick, but not even they have tried to claim that non-Catholic Christians are not Christians at all. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2016, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/93 "2016-12-20T04:22:20Z")
> [@dropzone](#): > > Yeah, but you tell her that her kid doesn’t have to do what she says. He tried that once at Cana, but she gave Him that look and He changed His tune with a grudging, “Yes, Mom.” Old joke: Jesus tells the crowd about to stone the adulteress “Whoever among you who is without sin, cast the first stone.” A stone flies out of the crowd and strikes the adulteress. Jesus says, “Mom! I hate it when you do that!” ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 9:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/94 "2016-12-22T09:33:05Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Well, right in the quote in the OP there’s a Protestant saying, ‘The RCC are not Christians.’ And I’ve heard the sentiment many times from many sources. Actually, I was replying to one of the other posts. But by the time I had removed all the painfully direct explanation of the error of the other poster, clearly I hadn’t left anything inteligable at all. I find that I’m still unable to explain Vatican II and the theology once called “American Fundamentalism” in a way that I think is polite to everyone. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/95 "2016-12-22T13:39:51Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > I think the bigger problem leading to people thinking the RCC is not Christian is not exactly the existence of the papacy, although it does affect things, but the teaching authority of the papacy vs. the single authority of Scripture. There are things like the [assumption of Mary both body and soul into heaven](http://w2.vatican.va/content/pius-xii/en/apost_constitutions/documents/hf_p-xii_apc_19501101_munificentissimus-deus.html), which are defined as dogma and therefore obligatory, and are defined by the Pope as equally authoritative as Scripture. I understand that Roman Catholics are not supposed to pray for saints and Mary to act directly, but to intervene for them with God. In practice, sometimes this shades off into requests made directly to the saints/Mary. The distinction is clear in theory, but not always in practice. > > And I am not sure if it is official teaching, but Mary is the [Mediatrix of all graces and even has been referred to as Co-redemptrix](http://www.catholic.org/featured/headline.php?ID=5154). To outsiders, that sounds bad, even if the RC church has what they consider a sound explanation. > > I for one wouldn’t say that this means Roman Catholics aren’t Christian, but ISTM that at least some of the confusion is understandable. > > Regards, > Shodan Greg Abbott is Governor of Texas & just as much of a right wing Republican as you might think. (He’s not a nutcase like his LIte Gov Dan Patrick.) He’s also Roman Catholic, although he doesn’t generally advertise the fact. [In August 2015](http://www.expressnews.com/news/local/article/Gov-Abbott-gets-flak-for-Facebook-post-about-6449077.php): > [@](#): > > Gov. Greg Abbott often showcases Bible passages and prayerful remarks on social media, but a Facebook post about a holy day in his Catholic faith drew vitriolic comments suggesting he worships idols. > > Abbott posted a commemoration of the Assumption of the Blessed Virgin Mary, marking Catholic belief that Mary was brought into heaven body and soul… > > The Facebook post drew more than 900 comments, with some praising Abbott for his reverence and talking about their own devotion to Mary. Others, however, harshly took him to task. > > “So you’re Catholic Mr. Abbott? So what? You worship idols; not something I’d be telling everyone,” said one. Agreed another, “This is nothing more than idol worship.” > > Another said, with generous punctuation, “Jesus is The Blessed and Holy One!!! Were you hacked???” > > One said that those who pray to Mary are “doomed.” Another, who said he voted for Abbott, expressed disappointment and said, “Another reason Catholics are Catholics and not Christians.” Raised Catholic in Texas, I can testify that there are lot of confused Bible Thumpers around here. (And lots of good folks–like the Southern Baptist grandmother who helped raise me.) For an in-depth look at the topic, I refer you to the late Rev Ian Paisley. [5 Reasons Why Catholic Is Not Christian.](http://www.ianpaisley.org/tiara.asp) ---
**Author:** ![sbunny8](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c77e96/32.png) [@sbunny8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sbunny8)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2016, 11:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/96 "2016-12-22T23:57:00Z")
> [@glowacks](#): > > I think it’s perfectly possible to live your life through the example of Christ as he is portrayed in the Gospels without believing any of the supernatural stuff. Whether they should be called Christians given that most of such people with that label believe in at least some of the religious stuff is another matter, but I could imagine people claiming that they’re being a true Christian simply by giving all of their excess income to charity and living as austerely as possible. \It’s possible to live your life through the example of **Jesus** as he is portrayed in the Gospels without believing any of the supernatural stuff. But calling him “Christ” means you accept that he was the Messiah, which would make him supernatural. \ As a former Baptist, I was taught that Catholics have it all wrong about what it takes to be forgiven. Catholics believe (or so I was told) that you have to confess your sins to a priest, then do a penance to earn forgiveness, and if you commit a mortal sin (such as murder) and can’t get to a confession booth before you die, then you go to hell. Whereas the correct view (so I was told) is that all it takes is a personal prayer between you and Jesus (because being a believer makes you equal with any priest, a concept called “the priesthood of the believer”) and then you are permanently forgiven, “once saved, always saved”. Oh, also Catholics baptize babies, whereas Baptists say baptism doesn’t count unless you’re old enough to understand right from wrong. > [@aceplace57](#): > > John 3:16. Defines the basic Christian message. Catholics and Protestants adhere to this scripture and are Christians. For God so lovedthe world that he gavehis one and only Son,that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. Umm, no, I don’t think so. As I said above, different sects have different ideas about what it takes to get yourself a ticket into heaven. John 3:16 says it takes belief in [the divinity of] Jesus to get eternal life. Catholics say it takes confession and penance. Baptists say it takes being born again, symbolized by full-immersion baptism. IIRC, Calvinists believe that Jesus has decided in advance whether you will get into heaven or not, and nothing you ever say or do can possibly change his mind. And even at the time the Gospel of John was written, there already existed Christian sects who had very different ideas about what it means to be a Christian. The Gospel of John reads like an attempt to correct people who got it wrong and say “No, you dummies, THIS is what the real answers are.” ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2016, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/97 "2016-12-23T01:18:14Z")
Incidentally, that specific passage (John 3:16) is only particularly famous because of one crazy guy who was really fond of it and who eventually became a murderer. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2016, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/98 "2016-12-23T05:37:53Z")
> [@sbunny8](#): > > As a former Baptist, I was taught that Catholics have it all wrong about what it takes to be forgiven. Catholics believe (or so I was told) that you have to confess your sins to a priest, then do a penance to earn forgiveness, and if you commit a mortal sin (such as murder) and can’t get to a confession booth before you die, then you go to hell. Wrong at the end by current doctrine, altough doctrine has been different at other times: the current official teaching is that someone who dies unconfessed still can accept the Divine Mercy firsthand. The priests are just transmitting it secondhand. But yes, we do have the Sacrament of Confession and Baptists don’t. Penance isn’t to earn forgiveness (forgiveness is granted, not earned), it’s to compensate for the wrongs done. If you can compensate the person you wronged directly, you’re supposed to do so: if you can’t, you’re expected to do it through other means (help someone else, perform a sacrifice). And the “three Hail Marys and a Pater” or similar is supposed to be, nor compensation, but meditation, to help cement your remorse and avoid repeating the specific mistakes (sins) that brought you to the confessional. ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2016, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/99 "2016-12-23T08:56:36Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Incidentally, that specific passage (John 3:16) is only particularly famous because of one crazy guy who was really fond of it and who eventually became a murderer. Actually, in Anglicanism, this passage has been featured in the BCP since Cranmer’s time as part of the set of “comfortable words” that have been used in the communion service. [https://www.durhamcathedral.co.uk/worshipandmusic/sermon-archive/comfortable-words](https://www.durhamcathedral.co.uk/worshipandmusic/sermon-archive/comfortable-words) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2016, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812/100 "2016-12-23T15:05:35Z")
Oh, sure, it’s not like the passage appeared out of nowhere. But there are a lot of other passages in the Book of Common Prayer, too, and most of them aren’t anywhere near as famous. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/explain-the-catholics-arent-christian-thing-again/774812.md?page=6)