# F. Christians: is it a sin for a man to be sodomized? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 12, 2003, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100 "2003-01-12T06:18:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![0887](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/977dab/32.png) [@0887](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/0887)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 2:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/61 "2003-01-15T02:07:18Z")
Hi Mangetout I said if a woman has a desire. If she has no desire then her husband should respect that. I find it unappealing also, but not everyone does. 0887 ---
**Author:** ![X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bbe5ce/32.png) [@X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/X_Slayer_ALE)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/62 "2003-01-15T02:11:40Z")
In catholic doctrine, Sodomy isnt just anal sex. It is a sin if youre using the sexual organs in ways that is not for procreation. That includes: \*mastubation \*Anal sex \*oral sex \*same sex sex \*sex with animals \*sex with dead bodies \*sex with birth control anal and oral sex, with or without extra added devices are sins whether or not you are married. \*\*Lusting is sexual. So you cant lust after a person for their mind. if you are a man and You lust for a man, thats a sin. If you are married (man or woman) and you lust for a man then thats a bigger sin because thats adultery. If you lust after Anna Nicole Smith then thats a really really big sin because shes ugly. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/63 "2003-01-15T02:25:53Z")
Regarding **H4E** : thing is, she has already said at least twice on this thread that she is (a) not quite sure about some of these “grey areas” and, (b) quite candidly, that her disapproval of some cases is due to a “it seems sick to me” reaction rather than coming from doctrine. We could ourselves be one day on the receiving end of “how grey does it have to get before you call it black”. We have already found at least three distinct POVs from FCs: (a) “the marriage bed is undefiled”, IOW as long as it’s a lawfully wedded man and wife, anything goes, it’s between them and God (b) “a man should not have the desire” IOW it’s plain wrong no matter what © Up to a point/I don’t have all the answers: God only knows, probably some things are OK but some others just squick me Of course, what this tells me is that there is no single overriding FC “position on positions”. Surprise, surprise. But **0887** , WHY would it be different for a woman to wish to be anally penetrated? It’s _just as much_ “unnatural” for her! Y’know, the Catholics have it easy, all forms of sodomy being just out of the question under any circumstance. ---
**Author:** ![0887](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/977dab/32.png) [@0887](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/0887)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/64 "2003-01-15T02:38:40Z")
I really don’t know if it is okay or not. I was just thinking on the terms of if it is not a sin. If it was agreeable. I believe homosexuals must recieve it that way often. So it must be a matter of taste. For the life of me I can’t see why anyone would desire that. Would a condom be used. That don’t make it any more or less a sin but cleaner. 0887:confused: ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 10:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/65 "2003-01-15T10:22:21Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by **0887** _ > I believe homosexuals must recieve it that way [anally] often. Why? What grounds do you have for that belief? Also, you said earlier that you considered wanting anal sex to be “grounds for adultery.” It’s my firm moral belief that there are _never_ grounds for adultery. This may sound like hair splitting, but I am in favor of open marriages because I know of at least one couple for whom this became necessary to preserve the marriage. Adultery to me implies deception of the spouse who isn’t participating in it. In the open marriages I’ve seen (not many, I admit), no deception is involved. CJ ---
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/66 "2003-01-15T15:06:53Z")
> [@](#): > > _originally posted by 0887_ > For the life of me I can’t see why anyone would desire that [anal sex]. For the life of me, I can’t see why anyone would desire sex with Laura Bush. Does that mean that it is wrong for George Bush to that? ---
**Author:** ![gex\_gex](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/94ad74/32.png) [@gex\_gex](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gex_gex)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/67 "2003-01-15T15:10:49Z")
“for George Bush to desire/partake in that,” I mean. ---
**Author:** ![0887](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/977dab/32.png) [@0887](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/0887)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/68 "2003-01-15T19:04:14Z")
What makes you think an open marriage will work cjhoworth?What grounds do I have well lets just say I know. It is ridiculous to argue this with me or anyone else. You can’t change the fact. Homosexuals take it up the butt and love every inch of it. So there you go. 0887:smack: You should have known that!! ---
**Author:** ![Liberal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/848f3c/32.png) [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/69 "2003-01-15T20:07:49Z")
0887 wrote: > [@](#): > > It is ridiculous to argue this with me or anyone else. You can’t change the fact. Homosexuals take it up the butt and love every inch of it. So there you go. Alas. We hardly knew ye. ---
**Author:** ![nogginhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@nogginhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nogginhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/70 "2003-01-15T20:44:23Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by MSU 1978 \* > \*\*Did not Jesus tell us to turn the other cheek? \*\* Thank you, MSU, for my best laugh of the day! ---
**Author:** ![Lilairen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lilairen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lilairen)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/71 "2003-01-15T20:49:13Z")
What reason do people have for believing an open marriage will work? That which exists is possible. --Xiphias’s Law You who believe it is impossible, please get out of the way of the people who are doing it. --Rosenzweig’s Corollary to Xiphias’s Law (Both quotes taken from the usenet newsgroup alt.polyamory.) ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/72 "2003-01-15T21:06:43Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by His4ever \* > \*\*I notice that you seem to be trying to come up with ever increasing complications of sexuality and abnormal sexual organs. I have to wonder why that is. Either you’re really curious about it or trying to come up with some situtation I can’t answer. I’ve already said I don’t have an answer for every single variable. \*\* I don’t think this was directed at me but can I answer it anyway? I imagine it’s brought up because complicated sex and abnormal organs do, in fact, exist. And any real philosophy of life (or concept of God) would have to encompass them to be valid. It is the awarness of the strangeness and complexity of life that has prevented me from embracing the simplistic view you seem to have. You have a world view that does not, apparently, stand up when confronted with anything…unusual. Not much of a philosophy, by my lights. ---
**Author:** ![Siege](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/dbc845/32.png) [@Siege](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siege)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/73 "2003-01-15T21:15:17Z")
Uhm, **0887** , the couple I mentioned have been married for 26 years. If you like, I’m pretty sure I can arrange an e-mail from one of them. You might also want to check out [this recent BBQ Pit thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=139294) for a recent discussion. As to how well I know this couple, we’ve helped each other move, laughed together, cried together, and I would have to say I know them better than any other two people on the face of the earth. As to the homosexual view of anal sex, I strongly recommend you check out one of **Exprix** ’s “Ask the Gay Guy Thread.” CJ ---
**Author:** ![nogginhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@nogginhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nogginhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/74 "2003-01-15T21:16:06Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by 0887 \* > \*\* I can’t imagine a christian wanting to do something so perverse._\* Here is the nub of the whole problem with fundamentalism, IMO. People don’t like what they don’t like, but instead of admitting that, they invent a preference against what they don’t like on the part of a higher power. “It’s not what I like, so it must not be christian to do it.” It reminds me of what Jesse Ventura said: “Organized religion is a sham and a crutch for weak-minded people who need strength in numbers. It tells people to go out and stick their noses in other people’s business.” The same is true for people who find a revealed gospel truth and give up their ability to question it. The OP is an invitation to FC’s to think about what their doctrine really means. > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by JRDelirious \* > \*\* > (a) “the marriage bed is undefiled”, IOW as long as it’s a lawfully wedded man and wife, anything goes, it’s between them and God > > (b) “a man should not have the desire” IOW it’s plain wrong no matter what > > © Up to a point/I don’t have all the answers: God only knows, probably some things are OK but some others just squick me > > Of course, what this tells me is that there is no single overriding FC “position on positions”.\*\* This astute summary puts this in sharp relief. Choice a is honestly fundamentalist: the book I have says what a married couple does is fine. Choice b is fundamentally dishonest and not at all fundamentalist: _I_ have a _feeling_ it’s wrong, so it must be a sin. And choice c reclaims the FC’s ability to question. It says: hey, there are things not addressed in my book! Am I a fundamentalist or not? ---
**Author:** ![0887](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/0/977dab/32.png) [@0887](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/0887)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/75 "2003-01-15T21:26:54Z")
Hi nogginhead I am not sure what a fundy is I may sound like one but if I am I didn’t know it.😉 Also cjhoworth, I believe some open marriages could work and some closed marriages don’t work. I think there is not one certain rule that works for everyone. 0887 ---
**Author:** ![nogginhead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5e9695/32.png) [@nogginhead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nogginhead)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2003, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/76 "2003-01-15T21:31:09Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 0887 \* > \*\*Hi nogginhead I am not sure what a fundy is I may sound like one but if I am I didn’t know it.😉 \*\* Didn’t mean to offend you by calling you a FC… but I think you probably spoke most people’s minds, FC or not. ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 8:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/77 "2003-01-16T08:40:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Lilairen \* > \*\*Speaking of fighting ignorance, I really, really wish that people would stop equating “theism” with “one true way monotheism”. This statement isn’t even true for all forms of Christianity, let alone all forms of theistic religion. \*\* Could you explain further? ---
**Author:** ![Ben](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/df788c/32.png) [@Ben](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ben)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 8:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/78 "2003-01-16T08:44:00Z")
His4Ever, what do you think of transsexuals? Is it a sin for someone to get their organs changed to match what they feel is their true gender? ---
**Author:** ![Lilairen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/8491ac/32.png) [@Lilairen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lilairen)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/79 "2003-01-16T09:13:42Z")
Explain what further? That there are Christians who don’t believe that following their tradition is the sole way to live? I think there is plenty of evidence for that on this board, just to start out with. For that matter, even some Christians who believe that there is only one religious reality do not necessarily believe that their implementation of reality is the only efficacious one – C. S. Lewis, who I do believe you have heard of, advanced the position in one of his allegories that good deeds done in the name of a false or opposing divinity were nonetheless recognised by his God as their own, and bad deeds done in the name of his God served only the opposition. How about the theistic religions in which there is no creator? Or the ones in which the supposed creation is not relevant to the process of living? (Greek and Roman reconstruction.) Or the ones in which the supposed creator is deceased? (In some ways of looking, Asatru; the world being built from the corpse of the first being and all.) Or the ones in which the god or gods are only truly concerned with the behaviour of their own worshippers? (It’s my understanding that this is a fair description of Judaism.) Or the ones in which attempting to convert and evangelise is considered a sin, in part because it presumes that one’s path is universal? (Wicca.) Then, to get into grey areas, there are theistic religions which believe their structure is universal, but hold the position that unbelievers are at the appropriate point in their existence not to believe. (I believe Hinduism has something of this sort.) Or the people who believe that various religious paths are different approaches to similar end-states, optimised to the “strokes” of the people following them? (Quite a few of various paths, but I believe this is a part of Unitarian Universalism, which includes some theists.) Or the ones that believe that most or all religions have partial truths? (I believe Bahai’i has something like this.) Setting aside the increasing number of eclectics, syncretists, and solitary practitioners of their own theistic spiritualism. Religious beliefs are _diverse_. ---
**Author:** ![Apos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/838e76/32.png) [@Apos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Apos)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2003, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100/80 "2003-01-16T11:33:25Z")
—You can avoid harming the temple by using enough lubricant.— Heh. I can just imagine the sly pillow talk coming out of this thread: “Baby, I’ll harm YOUR temple, but good!” If only the Romans had used enough lubricant 70 B.C., Israel could have been saved… —Religious beliefs are diverse.— Damn straight. Making generalizations about people with religious beliefs is only JUST _slightly_ less silly than making generalizations about people without religious beliefs. Which is to say: it’s all very silly. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/f-christians-is-it-a-sin-for-a-man-to-be-sodomized/148100.md?page=5)